Ford 390 cam and modification help needed!

Ok, first off ! Hello ! I`m new here..

I´m a Chevrolet guy but bought my first Ford recently. Being a guy that likes to modify stuff I started a couple of threads around to get some info on how to modify my new aquintance.. Didn´t get much help, but this forum started showing up when googling for answer so I´m trying here instead. Hope you don´t mind me copying my old posts into this thread ?!

here it goes:

I bought a 1971 F100 with a 390, C6 and N/A rear end ratio. Seems to be somewhere in the low to mid 3`s. Tires are street tires 265/60-15.

It has a Holley 2v carb that flows 280cfm and points
stock iron intake
Engine seems all stock with stock manifolds.

I`ll be using this truck around town, a few trips here and there, moving lightweight stuff around. I wan`t more power and double the mpg
Cruising steady 50mph I`m at 9 mpg.

It`ll break the tires loose from start at half pedal, and giving it full it stops pulling around 3500rpm (I don`t have a tach).
I`m blaming this on the tiny weenie carb, and wan`t to change it out to a q-jet on a performer rpm intake. While the intake is off I also wan`t to change out the cam. So I wan`t some ideas on which cam to choose. I`d like to keep as much of the valvetrain as possible. I won` t be turning any rpm`s, max around 5000rpm.

I`d like to buy:

Used q-jet on evilbay, rebuild it and thune with apt mixture screw
Buying an rpm intake (using adapter to spread bore)
adequate cam (need advise for a stomp puller with great fuel economy, low end torque and can hang on to 5000 rpm)
I`m thinking somewhere around 210/215-220 @ 0.50, maximum lift of what the stock valvetrain can handle, 110 lsa.

What is the most lift I can run with stock valvetrain ?
Is there any chance my heads and cr are ok for performance around 300hp and 400 ft/lbs ? I`m thinking I have around 200hp as it is now, with GREAT idle and low end performance.
Where can I find numbers on the heads to find out if they are any good.

The engine is OLD and rusty, but doesn`t have any noise to it, doesn`t use oil and runs smooth. So I`m going to try and up the power a bit.

Also curious about my cr ratio, won`t be changing pistons as that is too much work without doing a complete overhaul. Milling the heads is a possibility, but not sure if I will gain much without doing a full port job on the heads, and that is a little more work than what I`m willing to put into this project.

Also looking for a set of full lenght headers, but willing to use the manifolds until I find a good deal locally.

Am I on the right track with this ?

 

I've written to a few cam companies this is what I got so far:

COMP cams:
33-234-4
Specs:
1,000-5,200 rpm
Duration at 050 inch Lift:212 int./219 exh.
Valve Lift with Factory Rocker Arm Ratio:0.487 int./0.493 exh
Lobe Separation (degrees):110
Hydraulic-Strong torque through low and mid-range. Good idle.

Crane:
13404
1400-4800
210/210 int/ex
Lift: 0.516 int./0.516 exh.
Lsa: 110
Good low and mid range torque, Smooth idle, daily usage, light towing, off road, 2200 - 2700 cruise RPM, 8.5 to 10.0 compression ratio advised.

I like both of them specs wise. I'm curious about how much lift a stock 390 can handle. And I've heard the 390 heads have really poor flowing exhaust ports so that maken me like the COMP cams more. But also heard there COMP cams have a bad reputation with cams going flat.. *
Let me know if anyone have tried one of these cams.

Btw:
A guy locally is selling a offenhauser 360 single plane intake.
I know a single plane isn`t the best at all for what I wan`t to do. BUT it is very cheap, 80 dollars, and being what it is I might opt for a touch more cam too.
How do you think it will work ? They say it`s good from 2000 and up, but since 390 is quite a bit of engine I`m thinking it might run good from 18-1900rpm.
Should I buy it ?

 

Try the 332- 428 FE engine forum. post over there then do a search, There is tons of info for your build.

 

Just got an email from Lunati. He strongly suggests this cam for my application. I like it a lot, I have the smallest voodoo in my 305 chevrolet malibu 1965, it pulls strong gets 22mpg with q-jet, performer intake, good flowing iron heads, long tube headers and abou 9:1 cr. It's not a rocket but goes 0-60 in 7,5 sec which is good for what it is.

Specs:
Hydraulic. The best torque cam for 360-390 F.E. applications. Expect strong low to mid range horsepower and torque gains. Excellent for RV type vehicles, pleasure boats or towing applications.
Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 250/256
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 207/213
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .503/.524
LSA/ICL: 112/108
Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd
RPM Range: 800-5000

I would like lsa to be 108 to 110, but on the good side - lunati has a better reputation for not getting flat lobes. Think this will do the 390 good. Might even be looking into a new set of valve springs.


Sorry for the rant.... !!

 

My first FE also, I gather the gas mileage isn't going to come up a lot unless you go to an overdrive trans. The 390's have LOTS of torque so you need to make a little more torque and hp, too much hp and mpg with suffer lots.

http://www.ford-trucks.com/forums/893186-390-in-a-54-panel-mpg.html

I went with a comps cam:
http://www.compcams.com/Company/CC/cam-specs/Details.aspx?csid=941&sb=2

 

My parents have a 1972 F250 that I've been begging since high school for them to let me hot rod. I love it especially the way it'll squeal the tires like you mentioned. I've also set off a few car alarms with the stock exhaust. Stock compression ratio on the early 70's truck FE motors is around 8.2:1, which makes it put out around 200 hp and close to 400 lb-ft. I found (at one time) a full exhaust system (headers and everything) for the truck, I don't remember where though. If it were me, I'd start off by looking for a 4-barrel intake from a Mustang or other 390, it'd probably be fairly cheap. Mustang heads might help as well, not sure if there's a difference in combustion chamber size but if there is it's probably pretty substantial, plus the ports will probably be bigger. If you're going for higher mpg, then I'd say a trans swap or higher rearend ratio. Problem is, there aren't any "budget" OD transmissions (T-5, AOD, etc.) that will hold up to the torque of the 390, especially once you start throwing stuff at it.

 

Your truck (at 9 MPG) is where my truck started (with a 360 2/barrel and C6).

Have made many modifications for both power and economy; and it now has a modified 390 with 2x4 carburetion and MUCH better economy. The single best modification for both power and especially economy was recycling the dogmatic transmission into a four speed manual. That one modification resulted in better than 30 percent fuel economy increase; AND a octane requirement DECREASE from 93 to 91 octane.

Other modifications included:

(A) 390 GT Mustang cylinder heads, camshaft, and exhaust manifolds
(B) dual exhaust
(C) radial tires
(D) removing the bug screen (big pickup in economy here!)

Each modification helped, but the big item was losing the dogmatic trans.

Jon.

 

I hate that I am going to say this but if you want a good around town cam just get the cam from edelbrock that is matched to the intake. It is just a slightly healthier stock came but they work if all performance is not your goal and they work well with the intake.

Done deal.

 

If your just looking for mileage check the carb for a blown power valve.

 

Go with a performer intake, the ports on the '71 heads are tiny so the rpm is not a good choice. The lunati cam choice sounds good. If you can get 13 mpg out of it you'll be doin great.

 

Did you use a toploader, or something else?

 

Transmission is from a 3/4 ton Ford pickup, with the granny low.

Jon.

 

keep the lift right at or under .510 ish. Unless you want to do some headwork and other stuff.

my worn out 352 with an isky 262 super cam and a c-6 gets 13-14 MPG on the highway. Thats no **** gps miles and ive taken ALOT of highway trips. In town, who knows who cares.

 

Guys, finally some great info on this project! Grateful..

I like the lunati cam myself, arguing with my self on maybe going with the 62001 cam, but needing to keep the lift under 510 is good info and rules out that cam.
Here's the specs:


Hydraulic. Best choice for 390 c.i. daily driven street performance vehicle. Good torque and horsepower production with heavier emphasis on the low to mid range. Will work with A/C, power brakes and stock converter. Fair idle!
Advertised Duration (Int/Exh): 256/262
Duration @ .050 (Int/Exh): 213/219
Gross Valve Lift (Int/Exh): .524/.540
LSA/ICL: 112/108
Valve Lash (Int/Exh): Hyd/Hyd
RPM Range: 1000-5300

A manual od transmission would be great for what I wan't, problem is; I'm just to lazy to shift.

The C6 is staying.
I'm p***ing on the offenhauser sinlge plane 360 intake. Looks cool but to old design, single plane and not ideal for my combo. Goodbye.

Can i useva hei style ignition setup ? Being a chevy guy I now how to dial one in and adjust the vacuum advance etc. Or is there a better alternative out there for FE's ?

Could easily be a blown power valve. Carb being old remanufactured holley with no info on rebuild kit availbleb, broken choke etc.. I'm just glad it runs and not going to spend a quarter to get that 280cfm carb fixed. Will never workoptimal anyways. Imo.

 

Thumbs down on the RPM intake it is not a good match for MPG or a good match for the cams you are looking at,for a good education on FE Fords check this place out http://www.network54.com/Forum/74182/ There was a manifold shootout and the best all around intake is the Edelbrock Streetmaster, that Offy intake would work fine for your goals.I would suggest this for a cam http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HRS-CL250021-11/ and while you are at Summit this Carb http://www.summitracing.com/parts/SUM-M08600VS/ add headers and duals but take the distributor that is OEM and junk it they have a retarded curve in those and are out and out garbage for performance or mileage this is an option since you like HEI's http://www.ebay.com/itm/NEW-HEI-DIS...ries&hash=item45ff354b12&vxp=mtr#ht_597wt_948 plug and play EZ hookup.Don't buy that dual plane vs single plane BS it may be relevant in other engines but does not mean squat on an FE Ford,FE's actually like single plane intakes.

 

Jeffb2 is right about the single planes. The offy 360° manifolds are awesome on fe's and the streetmaster has small intake runners and a nice open plenum, they feel like a dual plane. Either manifold does great with a 1" 4 hole spacer.

 

havent worked on a fe since the 80s
but then it was the street master
or the Police interceptor intake for
the street 750 holley or a AFB carb
Ford duraspark dist early 60s heads
or 390 gt

For fuel economy i would build it with
duraspark ,streetmaster, or stock 4v
intake,stock 390 4v carb,some of the
early 60s heads or edelbrock heads
good headers dual exhaust
you make easy 300+ hp with this combo
and a stock cam if you have flattop pistons

Duraspark and ford 4100 carb must be
the most maintainace free parts you
can find mount them and forget them
and start woundering why the hell
you drove a chevy after all

 

Where did your mpg end up ? Have you done any carb and ignition tuning to help mpg, or mostly bolt ons ?

 

I rebuilt a 61 390 for my 60 T-Bird, used the same Lunati cam, 10.5 compression, 330 horse T-Bird heads and it runs great, smooth idle with plenty of power. I used the stock intake, exhaust manifolds with duals and an Eldebrock 650 and I'm only getting 12 mpg wi9th a 3:10 rearend. Don't think 390's are known for mileage..

 

I read a post where a guy was claiming 3-4 mpg gain with the streetmaster over a single plane intake. I'm leaning to the performer (non rpm), but still haven't decided with the offenhauser intake. I read a lot of positive about it, but also negative, like - old design, bad for mpg. For low down torque I've read no negatives on the performer. Do you think the streetmaster would be better for my use?
Ebay HEI's, was looking at em earlier. Will buy one.

Cam... Why single pattern ? Ain't that a little old school and not so ideal with the poor flow of the fe's exhaust? Just asking not trying to be a smart ss, as I know nothing about what works in these engines.

 

It's close to being on the road, so I'm not sure of the MPG yet. I tried a buick quadrajet and adapter but it had an internal vacuum leak, then went to a 500cfm AFB (which I already had), the idle circuit was too small and now I'm putting together a 625cfm AFB. I ended up using the petronix distributor, modified sanderson headers, edelbrock streetmaster intake, flow kooler waterpump, the 625 AFB and going to switch to a 2.47 rear gear with 31" tall tires (should be about 1800 rpm @ 65mph).

 

Where's your timing during cruise? I'm asking because I wen't from 10 mpg to 13 getting my timing right in my bbc. I ended up running 52 adance, total timing + vacuum advance.

And the million dollar question, how do you like the cam mister ? Liking your cr btw heathy with iron heads and smallish cam, any pinging problems ?

 

ive got the performer. Price was right, 250 bucks for the entire 352 with it on there.

Just find either a cheap performer or a stock 4v. From what ive researched from some very smart FE guys is that the performer and a stock 4v is right about the same but the aluminum one is lighter.

Please do not put an HEI on it. Thats just my two cents, its like having ***s on a nun.

If you look at my build thread you can see what ive done to my 352, and I drive the dog**** out of it and have the MPG numbers and miles driven in a year to back it up. 13-14 on the highway. Just keep the RPMS down on the highway with tall tires and a good rear end combo.

 

The single pattern is what they recommend in a pickup, a lot of cam companies still are single pattern and can work well if aftermarket heads or a good porting has been done.If your heads are pretty much stock this cam will have the added exhaust lift and duration http://www.summitracing.com/parts/HRS-250011-12/ Notice in the specs "improved mileage".The regular Performer intake was rated the lowest in the FE shootout alongside the stock 4 barrel intake the Offy was in the middle of the tests,you will get some **** about HEI's on Fords looking ugly but the facts are they work good period(have had mine on my 5.0 Ford 3 years) and use Chevy HEI internals which are parts you can find anywhere if you need them.One of the things that killed mileage on the FE's was retarded timing in the distributor and timing set,get a timing set that has the 3 marks and degree the cam 4 degrees advanced this gives more low end.Here is a pic of that "ugly" HEI Notice post # 16 and the one inch spacer,run one myself it's a good idea.

 

Best advise I've seen here. I havent worked on an FE since to 70's
and thats the way I would go. Anyone driving a Ford on the street
thats looking for mileage, dependability and a bit of performance is
missing the boat if they dont run the 4100 carb. Top it off with the Duraspark ignition and your ready to rock. My 0.02

 

I have a 75 F150 with a 416" FE (390 block, 428 crank, .060" over) Stock 66 Fe heads. My cam is a Melling with 282°-292° and 484-510" lift and a set of factory adjustable rockers (which are worth about 10% in power on these motors by getting lifter pre load correct). The manifold is an old Offy 360 and the carb is an Edelbrock 650. The distributor is a PerTronix complete distributor with the Ignitor II electronics and vacuum advnace. Headers are Patriot Coated long tubes #H8406 and I have 2 1/2" duals with Magnaflow mufflers. Trans is a C6 with a stock converter. Rear end is a Posi 9" with 3.50 gears. I get about 12 MPG combine freeway and in town and this thing pulls like a freight train.
the guys at Edelbrock reckon I could get a bit more mileage with a 750 as the velocity would go down a bit at low RPM which means it wouldn't be ****ing quite as much gas from the jets.

 

There's a stock 390 gt intake for sale here. Would that be a good intake for low end torque and milage ?
Also, if I understand you guys correct the offy 360 intake would be together with the streetmaster intake the best street intakes to run ?

I don't mind performance, don't get me wrong, i'm just a little **** about finding the right combo to get the best of both worlds.

 

it got slightly bigger runners compared
to a regular 390 4bbl intake

 

FE's manifolds can run hot, hot to the point of boiling fuel. The cast iron intake wont dissipate the heat as well as aluminum . And make sure you put the valley pan heat shield back in.

 

The 390gt was to expensive, made a call today..
Debating wether to buy the offy intake locally for 80bucks used or getting a new performer. I hear what you're saying about the streetmaster intake. Just haven't found any locally and just don't like the fact that I'll be running the smallest intake ports. Afterall I am a hp junkie.
Got a tip on this cam today.

Elgin E966P
.484-.510 lift
270*-280* advertised duration
204*-214* duration @ .050
107* LS

I love that it is 107 lsa. Been looking for a tight lsa to get a small rpm band torquey down low. Being that small I don't feel it will hurt mpg to much either.

Btw.. Gas is about 9,5 dollars pr gallon here now. You read it right 9,5.