Above the rear wheel well of my '51 Ford was rusted so I cut it out and welded in a new piece. As I was doing that, I realized more of the quarter was paper thin and tearing. So I busted out a patch panel I got off ebay and welded it in. I do a lousy job of t******* metal to **** weld, so the patch went behind the quarter panel so it was lapped over the patch. I figured id fibergl*** then bondo it all straight, its only 1/16 " or so. Now I'm worried I'll never get it flat or the line will show through. Any thoughts? If I cut it out and **** weld, do I need to hammer the area around the opening a little so I have some room to build up a little filler to cover the seam? This stuff makes my head hurt and I'm at the ragged edge of my skill level. If anybody can steer me in the right direction id surely appreciate it. Thanks!
your best finish, will be to **** weld and grind smooth and doing some hammer dolly work to get the best results. the area in question ****s to get to one way or another so sometimes your patch panel will be way bigger just to have access to the welded seam.
Show car or driver ?? If a driver, do the best you can and don't sweat it as long as it is a sound patch... Of course JMHO...don't sweat the small things...a good overlap patch with good grinding and some decent filler will look just fine...(if a driver) Cheers......
Hey Johnny, I'd probably cut out your attempted patch, and take a good look behind the area you cut out. Schewbaux Fords rot big time from inside the rear wheelhouses. Cut out any rot you find, and repair that before you worry 'bout the outer panel. What kinda welding experience do you have and equipment? A mig with .023 wire works well for thin sheetmetal, with small tacks. I go with a **** weld all around your outer patch panel, with just a slime coat of filler necessary " if '' you keep the heat'warpage under control. Do this by using many small tacks spaced 6''-10'' apart to start. Once you've a good fit up make more tacks closer together. " Life ain't no Disney movie "
You bring up a good point, pimpin. I've been welding ****pily for years, and I'm using. 035 fluxcore for reasons that are too boring to explain. I gotta use what's available. Oh yeah the inside wasn't great, I did my best with it.
If you can live with a lap weld then plug weld the two sheets together. I found that type of weld is the most forgiving. As you more proficient then go back to **** welding. My .02
Usually patch panels are made to fit on the out side of the panel. This will allow the water on the inside of the wheel well to run down the panel and not get trapped in between the two panels and rust. (of course the seam should be sealed, but most times they are not.) One way to make it easy for a beginner to **** weld a seam and help keep it from warping is to fold over the inside edge the patch panel 1/2", 180 degrees on a sheet metal brake at the local sheet metal shop. (do not completely flatten, leave it a little rounded.). This will provide a heat sink and slow down the burning of holes in the panel and tends to keep the panel straight. It also keeps the "oil canning "down. Another way is to weld a 1' back up strip of 16 Ga. along the inside of the patch panel and put it on the inside of the original panel. This will also make a heat sink. You can then attach it with sheet metal screws temporary and weld the holes later.
Definitely cut out and try again **** welding. You will have so much mud on that thing by the time you are done the car will lean to the left. Try laying out your new panel with ****m and a scribe. Maybe make a paper template of the patch and transfer it to the car so your cut lines match up. Personally I don't believe in the 'just a driver' mantra. You might be suprised at what you are capable of! Plus you actually save time doing it right! Unless you want arms like pop eye from sanding for a year! Your converse are not shop shoes. Buy boots.
X2....and if at all possible, try to find someone who'll let you use their Gas-shielded MIG, or convert yours. Flux-core really isn't made for sheetmetal
I've found a good way to get a good patch panel fit; try and cut those tacks and get the panel back out without removing the 'overlap'. Grind smooth those tacks, Then score some ****m layout fluid. Use the brush in the layout fluid to mark about 1" wide around the edge you're going to trim on the patch panel. Clamp it back into place behind the quarter and use a sharp scribe to trace out the opening. Get some sharp tin snips and take your time to cut pretty close to the line you scribed. I then use a vixen file to fine tune that edge to match the existing opening. Get a few long armed panel vise grips and once the part is fitted start tacking it in. Gotta watch your heat. I'd tack every 6-10" and let it cool to the touch before tacking again. Keep going like that, tacking 1/2 between every tack until you fill all the voids. Also try and remove any undercoating on the inside of the old quarter panel as it can contaminate the weld and make a stinky mess.
I was hoping Jon would chime in. This guys work is as close to perfect as a human can achieve! Follow his advice, ignore dudes like me. Your converse are not shop shoes. Buy boots.
It took me a long time to figure out how to hold the MIG stinger to **** weld. Now I just need to do something about the flash burns on my ***. It's an old line, but I still get a chuckle out of it now and then......... I use pretty much the same method as b-a-r, using dye and a scribe.
I never will install any panel with an overlap. **** weld only, when you have a double layer of metal, you can't stretch and planish the weld back out. Follow Metal Surgeons blog, that is the right way! Take your time on fit up.
If your problem is cutting two parts that fit - 1,Figure out what you want to remove but 1" less. 2, have your patch bigger than what you need but 1" more. 3. Fit your patch right on top of the area. Fasten with clecos, pop rivets, screws . 4,cut thru both pieces at once within that overlap. they will fit perfectly everytime as long as you keep the cut in the overlap. I like an airsaw with as many teeth as you can find. When planning your cut, keep dolly access to the rear in mind. That's probably clear as mud right ?
Between Metalsmith and Pimpin-Paint you have the best of sources. I've had luck using a small oxy-acet torch and tacking **** joints, then slowly move around and min heat to fuse the panels. Newer guys use the mig, either will work fine w/a little practice.
Y a really need to get a way from the fluxcore for one. if your goal is a nice job in the end. there are many ways to get a good fit the better the fit the easier the weld. If your wire size is so large your heat range is way p***ed the melt point of the panel. It's going to be hard to get a good finished product. But if your stuck with the fluxcore then your end goads need to have mud in it . Fluxcore wire is for welding dirty metals the flux is a cleaning and shield agent. For panels I like tig first if time permits er70-3 wire or .023 s70 6 mig. just say in the it's going slowwww heat make a mess of it.
well you is kinda in a mess but the best way to save it is too get a long staight edge and start on top and do some hammer and shrink as needed fill that and go down the sides and i am sure you are gonna need some shrinks to get it decent and fill that and lean from your mistakes so you can do it better the next time it should be saveable with a little filler, definately not show car style but will fill the hole for a street car the next one with a gas shield welder , better fitting , a little old water on the welds should be easier it just part of the learning curve
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