This has to have been asked before or at least a question somewhat close to it, however I can't seem to stumble on it in the search. That, or its too dumb of a question, but here it goes. Is building a flathead from a bare block truly a job for a first time builder? I've worked on engines before however have no real hands on experience with flatheads outside of starring at them and some recent dis***embly experience. From the start I was planning on reading and researching how to build the engine for my car since day one. However now, 4 years into my build and still no true garage to work in, it might make this somewhat difficult. I have found a somewhat local shop that sells bascially a flathead crate motor, its stock, but its all reman-ed and works. So would it make sense to continue on as planned and start fresh since I have a good block and other major components I've collected over the years? or Go with the flathead "crate" motor that is stock and over time swap out the cam, crank and other goodies?
Hey just think it as eight Briggs n Stratton engines..... All kidding aside first off figure just what you want it to do and what you are putting it in. Then get a coupla good books to help you out, Nostalgia by Ron Halloran is my favorite, will give you lots of good advice. Once you have decided on just what you want and expect then go and go for it. If you want a stocker then a crate by someone else might be ok but if you really want to know just what you have there is no better feeling than doing it yourself, and you will be sure of just what you have........
Depends on lot on what that flathead crate motor costs. If it's in the thousands you might be better off building your own since you already have the block. If you do buy the crate motor, do not get rid of your block.
I just read your whole build thread, absolutely awesome work! If you can afford to do it go with the crate FH to get it driving. That way you can work out any hidden issues not related to the engine. I doubt you will any. Keep the builder and do it the way you want it. Then swap it later. Just my take. Nice work! Chuck.
Depends on how much the "crate motor" cost and how many more parts you need to buy for the block you have. in my opinion you would be better off building your own because you can do it yourself and it would probably be cheaper but if your itching to throw an engine in there then go the crate route.
I too went back and looked at your build thread. Either motor would work, your call. I bought a car with a freshly rebuild flathead/crate motor. I do not fully trust the motor. With time it will prove to me whether they did their job right. I have another car that I rebuilt the motor and will take it anywhere without a worry about reliablity. I would build the motor that you have. I like learning about the flatheads and they are not difficult to work on. When I looked over your build thread, I would think that you would choose the same option. The price of the crate motor would be a factor. I would go with it if it was a smoking deal. Neal
First off thanks for all the replies guys. To answer some of the questions the crate would be in the neighborhood of 2700. I'm currently compiling a list of sorts to see what else I'm going to need to get the rebuild done on my own and weigh the difference. I'm still leery though of building a motor without a shop... I do think though if i go the way of the stocker I'll hold onto the block in case...
If you move the easy chair and couch to one side of the living room the coffee table makes an excellent work bench and you know magically have a garage. Ya know other that a short stint that I lived in an old warehouse I didn't have a garage until about 7 years ago. Hell even in the warehouse my garage was also my kitchen and living room. All that aside a flathead is just nutz n bolts just like any other engine.
Who is the crate motor guy and how good is he? If you would be happy and have confidence in one of his motors ask how much he would charge to build yours.
Go for it, You can do it no problem. Flatheads are pretty simple and once you add adjustable lifters the headache is over. Good luck, Tim
first thing you do on any flathead build is magnaflux the block even the crate motor go with adj lifters and isky 77 cam 3 dueces progressive linking get all parts from speedway dont mill heads or deck the block the only hard part is the valves after that its a lawnmower by the way they aint cheap
Heads...LOTS of new are out there, Offy, Edelbrock, and So Cal sells new Navarro heads and manifolds now. Speedway has whatever you need,..even new **** cranks, so you can do a 4" flattie, without hunting down a Merc crank. Take the block to a known good machine shop, and have it crack checked, as flathead jack mentioned. They will let you know what size pistons to order. I believe all the shops are drilling the lifter bores, to facilitate valve adjustment. 4TTRUK
Thanks 4TTRUk, that's some of the parts I have. Already acquired edelbrock block letter heads and a dual carb Navarro intake with 97's. I have the goodies now I just need to figure out the filler... Its sounding like I should just take it on as another project. I ran the numbers and I should be able to save about a good chunk of change to to it on my own....just need to figure out the tolerances I suppose and not get in a hurry?
A lawn mower it ain't. There's a lot more to building a proper flathead than just ***embing it. Don't mill the heads, what's that?
flatheads cant breath as it is why dont you mill it a choke the damn thing todeath if you can build a briggs you can build a flathead ford if you want to dig a dremal tool out we can go there oh yeah lets put chevy intake valves in it it how deep do you want to go with a build i was trying to give this guy some confidence to dig into it its not that hard
I'm getting one stripped now to do a build for my project. I'm going to do this myself and I've had a number of years between builds. Point being I want to do it. Do you if yes have at it. Roger
the first engine i ever built was my 8BA. i had no idea what i was doing when i started. after machine work and replacing everything but the rods i think i have about 5,000 into it. i did all the ***embly myself in by ba*****t studio apartment!! it runs great, and has been for ten years. if i can do it, you can do it!! these engines are so cool, and you will learn alot by doing it yourself.
I've seen the rebuilds on ebay and the price is right or maybe even somewhat low... If you are going to build, your new best friends should be here: http://www.flatheadv8.org/phpBB/viewforum.php?f=6&sid=a21263bf7b3817674933a4c39e2a03ea They are the holders of the best Flathead tech site anywhere bar none. -good reading: http://www.btc-bci.com/~billben/flathead.htm As far as it goes, you will need a few specialized valve tools if you intend to ***emble yourself or you can have a short block ***embled and then just top it with heads/intake etc. An Isky 400jr cam is an excellent choice for all around drive-ability and street-able performance, just remember, it's torque that gets you down the race track and Flatheads have Torque. Good luck with your build and good show on keeping things Flat, you won't be disappointed in either the torque department or or in the attention she will get at no matter were you go. moe .. . .
You can build it yourself they are not difficult to build. There is alot of good info over on the Ford Barn too. I just built a 286 stroker it was not any harder to build than any other motor Ive ever done, infact they are pretty straight forward. Do a lot of research on your cam choice. The 77B is not much more than a stock cam but thats ok if thats what you are looking for.
Thanks for the links moe! There is a ton of info in both, and now have a lot more reading to do. I'll see if i can post a build sheet tomorrow regarding what I'm planning and see if anyone can think of anything I'm missing or if anything jumps out as not necessary.
Alright so here is the parts plan.... All items in italics are what I currently have including a good block I was going to bore to 3-5/16. Intake_Navarro Carbs_Stromberg 97's Heads_Edelbrock block letter Crank_ I have a merc that might be usable post machining Connecting Rods_ 8bas for the merc Generator Stock Points Distributor Parts still need to acquire: Cam_ Isky 400 Jr. Cam bolt plate Lifters _ Solid Adjustable Johnson Valves_Pro-flo Valve guide retainers Valve springs Valve spring retainers Valve guide seals Hard split locks Pistons Piston Rings Rod bearings Main bearings Cam bearings High Flow Melling Oil Pump Gasket Set Head Studs and Nuts Generator Mount Bracket Generator Mount Bolts Water Pumps Thermostats Cloth Plug Wires and Ends Spark Plugs Starter Am I missing anything or thoughts of parts combination?
Nothing mystical about flatheads. If you're building a pre-8ba, the floating rod bearings can be a real adventure, but other than that, not difficult. Do a lot of research, and when you think you you've done enough, do some more. Flathead knowledge can be rather arcane, and acquiring it is the hardest part of the build. Bob
You have a good list going. I would change a couple of things. Standard melling pump not high volume no need to have,no advantage. 1.5" valves not 1.6" you won't see any difference and 1.5 is easier and cheaper to do.Both are about .100" to long and this has to be addressed. Cloth wires ? get a good ignition system. Converted gm or mallory. "Bubbas Ignition" (hei) Head bolts instead of studs arp stainless if desired,easier to install and studs are "pia" to work with and have no advantage at all.Consider a 95% oil filter system during the build.Buy isky springs and normal 11/32" valve locks and retainers non rotating will do you well.Guide seals can be eliminated during ***embly and replaced with hi temp red rtv much easier to work with.Buy old Rons book on the ford barn or JWL's book on the barn also both are well written and easy to follow.You could consider bronze liners for the valve train and "pos" seals on the intakes.Drill lifter boss for adjustables as this is a time consuming job at the best of time.Aluminum timing gears and some money and time will be all it takes.Just keep asking questions as there is some good knowledge here just for the asking.
Just do NOT be in any hurry...take your time,... It has it's idiosyncrosies to be sure, but nothing that's radical. GO GOR IT !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! 4TTRUK
Ps; If you go to a 4" crank, you will need to also use the Merc pistons. The wrist pins are closer to the piston top, to accomodate the 1/4" longer stroke. All flathead rods are 7", no matter what stroke. 4TTRUK
I used a **** balanced rotating kit. You have to buy much of the stuff(pistons bearings ring sets etc Plus all the machine work and balancing) anyway it wont add much onto your costs and you get some more cubes. Also check with some of the old timers about cam choices and if you do use the Isky make sure you check its ground to specs. (Dont ask me how I know)
For a good street engine, you want max compression ratio. You need to get a "tight" combustiion chamber. You want .040 to .050 over the piston and you want to make sure the pistom dome radius is the same as the combustion chamber so you have a consistent clearance over the entire head. This is not going to be a consistently high revving engine, so compression is more important than breathing.
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