i have a new brake system . i bench bleed the mc , & im using a vac*** bleeder . i can not get a pedal ! any ideas appreciated ... master cyclinder is below the wheel cylinders , but am using a 10# residual valve (as suggested by wilwood) . just need ideas ... thanks .. steve kzsteve@yahoo.com
Get a helper who fully understands the concept of pump "very slowly" and "hold" it. Read Tommy's post again as that is often an issue for guys who don't often do brakes. Other than that go back and check your brake fittings and brake flares. Especially any flairs that you did yourself. I just fought the brakes on my wife's mini van because I didn't get a flare right and although you didn't see fluid leaking it was drawing air back in the system. Also you might think about making up one of these. About 20 bucks if you catch the one gallon sprayer on sale at Ace or some other hardware store. You need a master cylinder cap that matches the master cylinder to make it work. http://www.myturbodiesel.com/1000q/multi/brakebleeder.htm The pressure gauge is nice but not a necessity of life and I'd put it in the body of the sprayer where the relief valve was rather than on the cap.
I've been working on brakes for like 8 months!!!! What I think may have been the issue for me was the MC. Even though brand new I took it out and rebuilt the system. Now I have brake pedal.... It's not perfect but pretty good.
I worked in or owned a brake shop for over 25 years and never once did I use a fancy tool for bleeding brakes. No vacuum units, no pressure pots...nothing. Get a helper and do it the old fashioned way. I was usually the designated pumper. I recently had a brake line rust out and tried the gravity bleed thing...I had to get my buddy to come over and had brakes in minutes.
Check the rod length on the master cylinder. Heard of a case where it was adjusted for good pedal placement at rest but as such, the piston in the master cylinder wasn't coming back far enough. There wasn't enough brake fluid getting into the cylinder to move the shoes against the drums until the pedal was nearly on the floor. Sounds like you have a similar situation. I'm ***uming you've checked all the easy stuff already... Good luck, Worken2much
Working by yourself jack car as to get front wheel cylinders below mc,and jack other end to do back ones.Drum brakes should be djusted before. I open bleeder litle and pump pedel about 10 times and only half travel on pedal. When you see on floor could still be runing out no air cloes and do other.May have to do twice. Keep mc full.
I agree, gotta adjust the brakes FIRST. f you have not done this, they could be bled but the shoes do not hit the drum because they are in too far.
Getting a helper is not always convenient. I have a reservoir cap I made that connects to an air line with a precision regulator. Only using <3lbs of pressure, I go to ea cylinder and it bleeds quickly, w/o frothing and always gets great pedal right away. Whole process takes me about 20 mins (Unless there is a mech issue like bad seals or defective connection) and saves me alot of $ by not pouring out expensive DOT5 fluid into the recycle bin. The most common mistake I see it pumping the pedal too hard or fast then not allowing it to "rest" long enough between cycles. Slow and methodical, allow the resevoir to catch up before pumping it up again.
no screwing around - use this. it looks like the vac*** bleeder im using now ..... i am going to try it the old way , i have a helper now . yes i adjusted them . george/maine ... ill give that a try . thank you 1942 ford brakes , 1 1/8 wilwood mc . all new parts . checked the mc on the bench , squirts accross the shop ! gonna give it a try again this morning . thanks all . will report ............
i have a vacuum bleeder, a presure bleeder and i do not use them, what i do is cut myself a stick or 1"x2" board long enough to sit on the brake pedal on one end and reach about one foot up through and p***ed the steering wheel, then i use two or three good strong bungies with one end hooked onto the steering wheel, then i pull them up across the end of the stick and back to the steering wheel, kind of like a bow and arrow, i pump up the brakes and pull the stick back and place it on the pedal, then i do my bleeding, when i have to pump them up more i remove the stick from the pedal and pump up the brakes and return the stick to the pedal.
Make sure the bleeder screws are at the top of the caliper.... Wheel cylinders.... Believe it or not, alot of people make this mistake..... How its done??? Right caliper on left side and left on right. You will always have an air pocket at the top, and no peddle...
my bleeders are where i could put them . fronts at the top , rears at 20* to miss spring hanger . just did the old way with help . no air it seems but no pedal either . im getting to close to the forrest to see the trees ! any more help please ............ thanks ** never had this problem before !
do you have a return spring on the pedal? sounds like the master is not returning enough to fill the bore with fluid, you need some freeplay on the rod going from the pedal to the master, like a 1/16" or 1/8"
I bought a pedal kit for my 39 floor trpe. Make sure you have a return spring pedal hits floor when up. That gives you max pedal. Now the adjusting rod may be to short,buy parts to exstend. Bring up to MC piston 1/16",maybe even up little farther.,and long as the pedel works ok.Try that and see if it helps bring pedla up.
Gravity bleeding will get enough air, out of most cars, most of the time, to get by. My experience is that a gravity bled car will have at least a little air left in the system. Per your post, and in spite of claims otherwise, gravity bleeding is not the best option.
You need to plug the outputs on the master cylinder and you should get a rock hard pedal. If not the master is the problem.
ok , made some progress finally ! bought 4 plugs , blocked off all lines . mc is hard as a rock , so i believe its ok . hooked up rears only , good pedal ! blocked off the rear & hooked up the front only .... no pedal ! found a leak & fixed it . so its in my fronts only . tried bleeding them once , no luck . got to hot for me , so done till tommorow . gonna get it soon i feel . could go on rears only , but not really my style . thanks all !! any more ideas appreciated . will report tommorow . can not gravity bleed as mc is a lil lower than the rest ..............
At this point, do what George said: Crack one front bleeder, slowly push down maybe 3/4, then very slow return. Repeat till it runs clear, no air. Close that one, do the other side. Repetative pumping can add foaming in the fluid, so try his way first.
ooppss forgot . yes i have a return spring . FJ , i am doing that idea . thank you .. ive been pumping slowly , she demands it until the end ! LOL i guess being old & not having drum breaks for the last 25 yrs puts me in the newbie catagory ! thanks all ... cya tommorow !
Hi Steve, always start with the longest line and finish on the shortest and dont let the peddle go full travel as this will let a bit of air back in.
thank you . i am lucky to have a smart helper . trained her from a pup ! i do remember a lil from days back , but reminders for OF is always good !
If you had everything apart you also have to adjust the anchors at the top of the backing plate to center the shoes in the drum. That fixed the problem I had.
The Jalopy Journal
