Because I've got nothing better to think about... I'm going to get a '62 Suburban. Stock 283 is in it, bored to 302. It'll get by for a while, but at some point I'll need to change it. I'm getting this truck to primarily tow a car trailer, and daily to work 20 miles round trip. Need a torque motor. 401 Nailhead is available, and will need a rebuild. 472 or 500 Caddy could be found if I start looking. I'm familiar enough with the Nailhead that I'd know where to find parts, etc. No little about the Caddy engines. Just looking for some bench racing opinions on doing a good stock-ish rebuild on one of these under-the-radar big blocks. single 4bbl intakes, cast iron manifolds, stock (or mild performance) cam, etc. Turbo 400, with Gear Vendor OD would be the pipe-dream plan. And no, I don't know why I wouldn't just build a big block Chevy to drop in the hole... Is "I don't like the valve covers" a good enough reason? -Brad
go with the caddy. motors are cheap plenty of speed parts make tons of power for towing. they come standard with a turbo 400.
Get the caddy, drop on an edelbrock intake, and a quicky rebuild. They rarely need to be bored because of the high nickle content inthe block. Leave the stock cam but port the heads. Low RPM torque monster (550ft-lbs+ is easy) that will run on cheap gas. Won't like to rev past 4000 pm though.
For a tow rig/daily runner, I'd definitely lean to the Caddy. You can still find parts for them on the shelves at your local counter, and since the Cads were built in the 70s, the parts counter staffers won't need to resort to the "paper computers" (books, if they still have them) to find your water pump or valve cover gaskets. Save the nail for a hot rod. We put a Caddy 500 in a 41 Cad Sedanette a while back... even with a 2.47 rear end, that thing would get-up-and-go like nobody's business. That motor was a bone stock rebuild except for an Edelbrock intake & carb. Rebuild costs are surprisingly reasonable, too, compared to what I've seen for nail motors.
Brad, Years ago, there was a small shop in Southern Missouri near Springfield that switched out weak-kneed-BBChevy's to either 455 Olds or 472-500 Cads, your choice, although the Olds 455 was by far the most popular. They would run incrediable and run cirlces around the 454's that they replaced, and oh, guess what ? ......they got allot better gas mileage too. You really don't have to do anything but a straight up quality rebuild to either of these engines, tune 'em good and hold on for fun.
"There is no subs***ute for cubic inches." ... don't know who said it first, but it still makes sense ... 302
It's tough to argue with 500-plus inches of grunt. Go Caddy. Nailheads are cool, but can be quirky, and parts availability cannot rival the Caddy. If you have problems on the road, finding Caddy parts will be a breeze...especially compared to the Buick. ~Scotch~
Caddy, Have a 500 in my 65 Impala wagon... Fun,Fun,Fun http://www.cowboyseven.us/forum/index For Cad swap info.
Any 71-76 Cad would make a nice pull option and it weights about 100lbs less than a big block chev the Cad is not a big block per say its more like a 455 olds or Buick, Lots of new speed stuff for those Cads, Good luck.
I vote for the 500 Cad. 502 lbs. torque,stock, is awesome. And yes, "I don't like the valve covers" is a real good reason. I don't like 'em either. Seen 500's in Ford and Dodge 3/4 ton towtrucks, even a '53 International 3-ton. Give 'em enough traction and the world will spin out from underneath them! Just be sure to put a big ****** cooler somewhere.
One of my friends put a 500 in his '80 Chevy 2WD pickup to use as a tow vehicle for his stock car. Smooth running, easy to hook the A/C up to, unlimited hill climbing ability, and reasonable fuel mileage.
Had 500 Cad in a 1980 F-150. Came out of a 75 cpe deville. Ran like a top, didn't even bother with a re-build. Leaked OK and compression was good. We ran that motor for 7 years of hauling and towing an open car trailer. Sold the truck to my sister and her and her husband drove it for another 5 years. We did this in the early 80s. The best I remember was around 89-90 we were hauling a Packard back from PA to Detroit. On the 'pike there's that long slow climb heading back west from northern PA. We loved the looks on people's faces as we p***ed them with something that heavy on the back as we climbed that rise. Our round trip avg was like 13mpg towing at 70+ most of the way. We did have a 3.23 gear in that truck which was helpful for highway towing. On some rare weekends I would go out street racing with the thing just for grins. My favorite race was against a stone stock 428 Talladega Torino (yes, it was a 428). 1st race he covered me by a car length. Then I remebered that Dad flipped the lid back to normal on the stock air cleaner since the groan was irritating him on occasion (that PA turnpike!). I opened the hood, flipped the lid upside down and had a re-match. I then covered him by a car length...2 times in a row. I guess the moral is go for the Caddy mtr. 2yrs ago we saw the old girl on the road somewhere around Wyandotte or Lincoln Park. Maybe it was 3yrs ago. Couldn't believe it was still out there.
Man it ****s that I can't remember but I once read that if you put early 500 heads on a late 500 short block,(or vice versa, can't remember ) you would get something like 13:1 compression. The thing that ****s is that I don't remember what years seperate early 500 and late.
Man, I'm really glad I posted this question. I've learned a bit, and got some really good, educated, "I've done it myself" advice on this. I really was on the fence; I've got a line on a very rebuildable 401 here in town, but Pick-a-part frequently gets Caddys in. I'd have gone with the Nail because I'm familiar with them, but after reading these replies, the Caddy seems like a better choice for a tow vehicle. Things that swayed me: Parts availability, accessories, stock power and weight. Can anyone elaborate on the High Nickel content of the blocks, and them not needing an overbore? I mean, even in a high nickel block, something is going to wear once an engine has been around for 30 years. Did they have moly rings too? Is EVERY Caddy block a high-nickel block? Also--and this may be stupid--but the distributor in the front is going to be a bit easier to work on, and Edelbrock single 4bbl intakes being available is nice because it'll perform better and it takes a dozen pounds off the nose. Power Steering pumps, brackets and pulleys will also be easier to find. And this, ladies and gentlemen, is what makes the HAMB a great place. -Brad
I know it's an OOOLd thread, but I'm looking at this swap myself for my 85 Dodge Crew. There's a 70 Eldo with the 10.5 to 1 472 nearby for diirt cheap. ***mins is ideal but that swap is slightly more pricey. Plus, I've always loved the way '472' rolls off the tongue.
Gas was a little cheaper when this thread started, go with the ***mins, it will outlast any gas engine out there.
The Cad's will not have to work as hard. Which of these choices are the lowest miles/best condition? And let's see a [ix of the beast. Anything new to the '57 wagon?
X2 I had a 73 Caddy and towed a 2 axle trailer with all kinds of cars on it performed great all the time. PS it was stock w/ air Pat
I'm thinking of putting one in the 53 F100 i have,they're pretty cheap on C/list--now that i said that they'll double in price or wont be for sale whens it come time!
If the choice is only between those two then the caddy but as was said earlier in the thread you can't go wrong with an olds 455
Without hi-jacking- yes the 455 Old's is an even easier fit! No oil pan issues at all. Fits like a glove. We have done several 455 Olds/Chevy truck swaps.
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