Oil : detergent / non- detergent

Ok - oil change today with a new to me oil. I have an original 53 241 Hemi with 49,000 miles. For the last 15,000 miles I've been using Napa brand 10w-40.
After reading lots about the need for zinc I've decided to switch to something different.
Rotella T 15w-40 or Valvoline diesel 15w-40. Both have a CI-4+ rating.
My brother builds high hp 426 Hemi's and uses the Valvoline.
So... I bought the Valvoline, however it doesn't say on the bottle if it is detergent or non-detergent. The counterman thought it was probably detergent.
So is it? And if so, is that a problem?
And yes, I know I should probably use Brad Penn or something.
Thanks.

 

Diesel is high in detergent. Is it a problem? depends on how gummed up your engine is & if the glop would come off in globs & clog something like the oil pump pick up. Actually where you've been using detergent oil (is it detergent?)for the last 15K of 49K miles, I'd say you're probably OK.

 

Brad Penn , Amsoil , Comp Cams , Joe Gibbs are just a few that have what you need for a flat tap camshaft . You can get them from Summit and dealers of oil Amsoil . Stuff off the shelf at the parts stores don't have what you need . There is Lucas engine break in additive you can get at Advance Auto to add to your oil . Valvoline Racing doesn't have enough of what you want for a flat tap engine ! Diesel oils aren't the best to use either .
There were a good many posts done on the subject . If you do a search you will find a lot of information about what oils to use and which ones not to use .

Retro Jim

 

All I can say is I have build well over 30 engines,12, 13 14 to 1 on flat tappets and no problems using Valvoline 20W50Racing oil. And I use Shell Rotella synthetic in my Legends oval track car because it get pretty hot 280 or so at times. Never had any lifer /cam wear problems. I do use cam lube on the build up.
Unless you search out non-detergent oil it all has detergent...that is a very good thing.

 

diesel oil is designed for diesels not gas engines. i would use the Valvoline VR1 which is designed for gasoline engines, and they make that in synthetic formula also.

 

The basic difference between detergent and non detergent oil is the ability to drain back. Non detergent oil is used in a splash system (lawn mowers, compressors, etc. where the oil needs to cling to the parts.The oilcan in your shop should be filled with non detergent. Detergent oil is used in a pump system. The detergent property helps it to drain back quickly and keeps to pan full.Or so I think. OK all of you oil engineers jump on me!

 

Really?

Non- detrergent oil is for all non internal combustion applications, like Air Compressors. Anything that has internal combustion, like lawn mowers, cars snow blowers ect need detergent, because of the combustion process.

For me I use Mobil 1 or Castrol. Last time I used Valvoline, I played heel cleaning the engine, it was like a milk shake. As soon as I cleaned it, my problem was solved, and I never looked back.

 

Does it have an SA Rating? I think that SA A rating is for a non-detergent oil? Not sure what the current CI (compression ignition) rating is? CI engine oil will have more detergent than a spark ignition engine. Go to the API website and see what the CI rating standards are.

 

Non detergent oil will not attack sludge in engine. detergent oil has cleaners in it to attack sludge buildup. If you use detergent oil in a dirty engine you could clog up pick-up, oil pasages etc. Safe bet with a tired old mystery motor would be non detergent until you have the money to tear it down/ freshen up.

On to the other subject.....I used to like diesel oil for the zinc content, but epa has screwed that up recently. No more heavy zinc content in rotella diesel oil.

that is the long and short of it.......

 

Why is diesel oil "bad" for gas motors?

 

It aint....trust me. I send out oil samples to vendor, check for contaniments content [part of my day job] Diesel engines typically will go 10-20K between BPM services. Detroit DD15's [ new version] will go 50K!!!! So you tell me whats wrong with it

 

Where the hell did you get your information that diesel oil was bad for a gasoline engine.That is plain BS .

 

He didn't say it was bad, he said it was designed (formulated) for Compression Ignition engines which is true! I think most motor oils are rated for spark and compression ignition engines, the exception may be bulk oils formulated for OTR fleet trucks.

 

To the OP ,the Napa 10-40 you have been using IS a detergent oil !!! With a broken in cam with the low spring pressures on your motor bacon grease would do the job. Flat tappet cam wear problems come with heavy spring pressures used on radical cams. Stock cam/spring setups once broken in will do just fine with any decent oil.

 

It's not about combustion or not . It's about the lube system, splash or pressure. Splash needs the cling effect of non. Pressure needs drainback. All other things considered the cleaning effect of detergent is absolutly superior.

 

This is what I've always wondered too, aren't most diesels flat tappet? Not only that, but diesels last way longer than a gas engine

 

Multi grade oil was first made in 1951, detergent oil even earlier. Chances are a 1953 engine has never used anything else. The default choice in gas stations and dealerships from the fifties to the eighties was 10W30 detergent oil. Later they made even thinner oil in hope of reducing friction and improving gas mileage.

10W30 or Rotella 15W40 is fine.

 

If you've gotten 15k on this motor with no problems I wouldn't see much reason to switch to a high zinc oil. I will say that I quit running NAPA oil after opening up the little 4cyl in my old daily and seeing the sludge built up in there. Of course it did have 150k on it by then. Once the motors broken in you should be fine.

 

Valvoline VR-1 Racing Oil has 1400 PPM of Zinc and 1300 PPM of Phosphorous which is about the highest levels on the market. Don't know how someone can bad mouth a product when they are totally wrong and don't even know the Zinc and Phosphorous levels of Valvoline VR-1. Amazing.

 

Sorry, but you guy's who insist Diesel oil is good for modern gasoline engines, don't have a clue.

Engineers, like myself, and real engine builders alike, like myself, know better.

You guy's continue to do what you want, post what you think is right, and GOD bless you all.

When you start building $100,000 race engines, maybe then you will have progressed to the point of remotely understanding oil technology to where it is today.

For those who want the truth= Diesel oil is for diesel engines.

Gasoline oil is for gasoline engines.

Enough of the misinformation, once and for all with this subject.

This is beyond ignorance already with this senseless debate.

 

SA is pure oil with no additives. Wal-Mart carries SA 30W oil marked" For pre 1930 only". I suspect not too many people read the label. Current low zinc diesel is CJ, the old high zinc was CI.

 

There was an article on a mag recently, Hot Rod or Car Craft, that made it sound like diesel & car oil was incompatable with each other & that diesel shouldn't be used in car engines. Supposedly SM/N has no zinc, but supposedly CJ still does. so, Mr Engineer...why is there oil marked SM/CJ and older oil marked SF/CI if they are incompatable?

 

Hemmings has started maketing their brand oil formulated for old engines with the zink you need, its multi weght and detergent.