I'm thinking of changing out the boring TH350 for a Manual. What are the Strongest options?....Motor has about 475ft/lbs and I like to play. i'm not a manual guy so i really don't know. what are some good options how strong are the late model 5-speeds some of you guys are putting in? or should i stick with the muncie's?
For that kind of torque I'd go with a tremec if using an overdrive. I staying with a 4 speed, hard to beat either a mucie or a super t-10 or t-10. Can't much go wrong either way. jerry
TKO-500 or 600 is the best 5 speed. A LT1 six speed with Viper shift forks is cool also. For a four speed I would go with a close ratio Super T10 . The 2.43 first gear one with the 904 casting nodular iron case is the stongest chevy 4 speed every made. I have one behind my turbocharged 355 in my camaro. No problems with over 500ft-lbs at the rear wheels. It is much stronger than the Rockcrusher M22 Muncie because the case is the weak point on the Rockcrusher. The gears might be stronger but the case flexes and the gear mesh goes away and you blow gears anyways. The nodular iron case doesn't flex. They have much stronger aftermarket cases that fix this problem.
Yeh i was looking into the aftermarket M22 trannys...all new cases with all new parts for like $1800 - that seems like a steal. are these the stronger cases your talking about RacerRick? http://www.5speeds.com/newm22.html wherewould i go looking for a superT-10 (What did they come in) i know that they bring big $$$$$$$ everywhere but i would just like to know what to look for with the nodular case. I know i should use a ShatterProof Bell and a good clutch. Are Aluminum Flywheels any good for street driven stuff??? I just don't like the idea of a 35lb flywheel breaking the end of the crank off and demolishing everything in sight. is the mounting distance from the bell to the mount the same for a TH350 Auto/ 4-speed Muncie or SuperT10? or will i have to move the crossmember?
Tranny is built by a race shop. I told them that it was going to have a stout BigBlock in front of it and the said "no problem". - I really don't know i've never had it running...but i don't particularly like the idea of an auto in my hot rod. The truck is going to be light and probably won't ever be able to hook up anyway..so i think the 350 would survive. if it was hooking up on slicks i'd be a little more worried. I don't really care when tranny's break..i care when motors break the torque number is pretty close...i know that some guys will think "yeh right" since most guys over estimate (usually by alot) but i had it run on one of the best computer simulators out there...that garuntees the numbers will be within 10% and 475 is about 5% lower than the projected number on the machine
Maybe a Richmond? Don't know much about them but they are supposed to be tough. Do stay away from the aluminum case 4 speeds. I have seen those drop their guts on the ground with stock 300 horse motors. A bigshaft Ford yoploader is tough and the Mopar iron 4 speeds of the early 70s were real stout too. All the pro stocks used them back then.
http://ddperformance.com these guys are the supplier of late-model manual transmissions. Best bet is a TKO 600 for two reasons: 1) TKO 600 will withstand 600 HP 2) TKO's have the ability to locate the shifter in three discrete locations. D&D can set you up with the right flywheel, pressure plate, bellhousing, etc. for your app. They're good folk. If you're on a budget; they're selling TKO 500's (500 HP rating) for $1300...The TKO 500 is being discontinued, so they're on sale until they're gone. The T56 is nice (six speed trans) but the TKO is more versatile for a lower RPM app in an older vehicle. 5 speeds are nice; they let you run short gears (more play time) and still have decent RPM's on the freeway. I'm runnin' a 5 speed and 4.30's in my DD, and my freeway RPM is 3150 at 80 MPH.
I plan to install a small block ford and a manual transmission in my 50' ford. If I use a T-5 and shifter from a 5.0 Mustang where will the shifter be located? I have considered a TKO if necessary for proper shifter location. -- Chuck
The mustang T-5 has the shifter on the end of the tailshaft - don't know the exact dimension, but its around 27" from the bellhousing face. On an AV8, that puts it almost in the seat! Generally speaking, the shifter would be awufully close to the same position in a '50 Ford. I can get you the exact face-to-shifter measurement on Friday when I can get into the shed and measure the trans I have there. Otherwise - the T-5 outta an S-10 is the hot ticket; it has the shifter in the intermediate location, which is the 'common' hole for most cars. A used T-5 can be had for peanuts, and there are rebuild kits for under $200 that freshen it nicely. If you're on a budget, this setup can be had for a third of the cost of a TKO, and will take up to 275 HP without much complaint - unless you shift past 6000 RPM.
T56 6 speed, rebuilt to Viper spec. It'll handle any power you can put through it, It's very adaptable, and with 5th and 6th being overdrives, you can run 4.10-4.56 gears for great off the line acceleration, and still get great highway milage. It's a very popular trans amone B-body guys(like me) and will handle pleanty of abuse in a 4400 LB Impala SS. An upgraded T56 will cost you about $1900, but are avalible inexpensivley in late model LT1 Cameros and firebirds.
ummmm where did you find an upgraded one for $1900? that D&D place wants $3000 for a GM/Viper T56????
So, along the same lines as this thread, I was planning on using a three speed that I currently have, but what four or five speeds (or three with OD) can I find at the local junkyards, and in what cars/trucks? I won't be running a ton of HP, just a basically stock 4.3L GM V6, but it'd be nice to have some move gears... Thanks! Ben
The Supercase is the new heavy duty case. I would stick in a TKO600 personally since the price is very similar. Super T10 is same as a muncie. I don't remember if they are the same as the TH350 or the TH400. The ST10 does take a TH400 yoke. The ST10's are mostly aluminum cases and Z gearsets. The Z 3.42 first gear is the weaker gearset and has six rings on the input shaft. The mid 70's had a 2.64 first gear (75-79) and a one year only (74' Trans Am) 2.43 first gear The only factory Nodular iron cases were in 80-81 Z28's. Some also came in the 82-83's. You want the 80-81 because they have a standard rear mount while the later one has a mount that is sitting at about a 30 degree angle because they twisted the trans in the 3rd gen camaros to make it fit. The case will have a large 904 at the end of the casting number to signify a nodular iron case. I have one in my car and a spare. These trans only go for around $600 in good working condition. Ones that need rebuilding are usually under $200. My spare has rusty gears, so I am going to find a 2.64 geared one with a broken case (ears break off easily) and swap the guts. My Camaro uses a 35lb nodular iron flywheel. Aluminum isn't needed on the street if you have torque.
I got mine for $2195 at Rockland Standard Gear (www.rsgear.com). It's an F-body unit (LT1-based) PN T56-016V It's got upgrades like the Viper 30-spline output shaft, carbon fiber synchro rings, and steel 3-4 shift fork. It's rated to take 750hp. I put it behind a 545hp SBC in a 3,700lb station wagon. I used a hyd. clutch kit from American Touring Specialties (www.T56kit.com) and a Centerforce LT1 clutch. I also added a Hurst shifter. I think the T56 is the way to go after researching it for my application. The Rockland box is a solid unit and the upgrades make it tough. The shifter location is right for most cars and I dig the hydraulic clutch (real easy pedal effort and no need to adjust). I'd recommend this setup to anyone. It bolted up easily to my old-school SBC with an LT1 bellhousing and with the ATS adaptor, the stock LT1 clutch cylinder mounts by being sandwiched between the master cyl. and the firewall. Real clean setup. Scotch~!
Well, Lakewood does make a bellhousing to put the best 4-speed ever built behind a SBC - a Ford Toploader!
A chrysler 833 was stronger. Just ask Sox & Martin who tried the top loader and went back to the 833 behind their hemi's!
They rarely use Jericos except for road courses, last I checked. For the "turn left lots" tracks I heard they use the T101 which is an aftermarket clone of the Super T10 with a ton of gearsets available so they can set the car up. It also sucks the least power. Anyways. There is next to no shock loading in nascar, and shock loading is what kills transmissions.
wow lots of good infor here guys...thanks so much. looks like the best/strongest option is the upgraded T56. good to know all the other stuff for future use too.. glad you guys know about this stuff cause i certainly don't keep up on the manual tranny stuff.
OK how about Ford pick 5 speed trannys? Shifter is foreward. Not made for racing but a nice cruiser tranny at a cheap price. Right now I have access to a FI 351 5 spped for cheap (mazda tranny I suppose) aand a 88 460 5 speed which would be a Getrag.
If you're thinkin' T-56, note there are two sets of gears - one is a wide ratio (Mustang and Camaro/Firebird) set, and the other is a narrow ratio (Viper and Z06) set. For your app - you're better off with the wide gear set, IMHO. The narrow gear set is commony referred to as the Viper gearset, and folks do charge more for it. Benefit is less of a gap between 5th and 6th - personally, I like the taller 6th, as it allows for a shorter final drive ratio.
The mazda trannies are junk. The Getrags are pretty good. The ZF in the later ones is the best. Did you know they put that Mazda pickup transmission in the Thunderbird Super Coupes? The 3.8L v6 is known for blowing them up.
I believe you are correct about the 80s they didn't have the 4-speed in the 80. I was lumping 80-81 together because they were the turbo years and forgot about the 4-speed not coming back till 81. Mine is a 81 formula firebird and it is the orig. super-super. As far as I can tell a little better than 10% would be the best guess as to the ratio of cars that got the 4-speed as the breakdown wasn't published. What I read was that the 4-speed only came behind the 305 SBC in '81 firebird or T/A. If there is a mix of aluminum/nodular cases, you are probably correct about the nodular cases coming in later builds as mine has a later build date. I don't know if it would be possible that it would be part of the ws-6 package/manual tranny combo--probably not, probably just a coincidence. At any rate it feels bulletproof behind my 350 that pushed 338hp on the dyno. and 275 series tires and 3.73 gear set.
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