1932 Roadster Frame without reveal?

hell i don't even own a 32 ford and this is a interesting thread testing what everyone THINKS they know about 32 fords!

 

My thoughts are big deuce hit the nail on the head. Out the back door it went.

 

sheesh

 

I spoke to the Ford Research Center today. They expect to get back to me later this week or early next. Keeping you all up to date.

 

I'll be waiting.......

 

No news yet.....hopefully soon.

 

Well HAMB'ers.....I have my answer and IT IS GREAT NEWS. I hope everyone is ready to learn something new today. I am very happy. See below:

Hi Mike,
Finally have a response for you from our specialist:
We do not have the drawings of the frame assembly. However, we do have drawings for the “frame side member” part number B-5016 LH. This is the long “C” section on the driver’s side. There are 16 microfilms of this part with the original drawing being completed on 7-10-1931 and the newest date of 9-15-1932. The reason for all these microfilms was to document the changes from the original drawing. On the oldest microfilm of the drawing there were nine revisions. On the microfilm dated 12-17-1931 are scribbled marks showing proposed changes to add the reveal depression starting behind the steering box holes and continuing to the area that begins to bend upward around rear wheels. The microfilm dated after that shows these drawing changes were officially added on 12-21-1931 as part of engineering change number 2006-53. This engineering change record and the release notice that went to the factory are not in the BFRC archives. Usually when a change is made to the engineering of a part, there is a period of time when the factory creates the tooling to make parts with the change on them. That time varies with the complexity of the change, but would be about 3 months after the change was released to the manufacturing departments. Therefore, it would be reasonable to believe that there were some frames built without the reveal stamped into them. It has been documented in the reference books that there were many changes to the frames of 1932 cars and production was held up until March due to the introduction of the V-8 engines. Many frame changes were completed by the factory, but some may have been installed by dealers. The reveal is one change that could only be done at the stamping plant that made the frame.
The frame reveal can be seen on the microfilm dated 12-21-1931 at section A-A. This is the area that can be seen on the side of the car. The 1932 models did not have a sheet metal.
The sheet metal mentioned in the original answer was in reference to the material known as an “Apron” that mounts between the body and the running boards of 1931 & older cars. On 1932 cars the side of the frame is visible between the body and the running boards, which is why this area of the frame was finished and painted like the body.
References:
The Early Ford V8 As Henry Built IT by Edward P. Francis and George DeAnglis
Pages 16,17, 32, 33,34
I.S.B.N. #0-911383-01-8
Benson Ford Research Center ref # 629.2222 F699 F817 1982

The 1932 Ford Book----A Production Chronicle and Restoration Guide---volume 1
Pages 4-22 and 5-2
Available from “The Early Ford V8 Club of America”
B.F.R.C. ref 629.2222 F699 E1932 2008 v.1 c.1

The 1932 Ford Book----A Production Chronicle and Restoration Guide---volume 2
Available from “The Early Ford V8 Club of America”
B.F.R.C. ref 629.2222 F699 E1932 2008 v.2 c.1

Microfilm
Frame side member
Ford Motor Co. part #B-5016 dates 7-10-31 though 9-15-32
Location A12-C-2 box 18
I hope this information is of assistance and thank you again for your request.
Stephanie
Stephanie Lucas, Research Specialist
Benson Ford Research Center
The Henry Ford
Reading Room Hours:
9:30am - 5:00pm Tuesday - Friday
Closed Mondays, Weekends, and Holidays

 

Awesome bit of history on this subject. Thanks for researching it and making it known and available here! Looks like you have a super rare frame on your hands. Lucky Mike, indeed!

 

Very cool!

 

It looks like the pissing contest is over (thank God).

 

Too funny Kenduce, too funny.....thanks!

 

Damn cool! And, not something we'll likely see agian.

 

Ture Louverguy, true.

 

So, frames made in December 1931 or earlier lacked the reveal. Job 1 was March 1932. This would mean that either pre-production vehicles were sold, or old pre-production frames were used in production vehicles. The former seems most likely, unless Henry built up a stock pile some frames way early.

Wouldn't a frame built 3 months or more prior to March '32 lack a K-member too, having a simple crossmember instead?

Steve

 

No, not necessarily Michigander. This frame came out of the factory as a pickup as a model b with a 4 banger. I heard from the original owner of this truck that it came to life as a roadster, but started as a truck.

 

Ahhhhh....

Finally!!! sweet validation for all of those guys that got picked on for flattening reveals in the street rod movement.

As it turns out, ol Henry didn't put that reveal in there for style afterall...just to save some money on aprons.

The flat and smooth version is the realest deal there is. The reveal version is just the cheapo production version that every shmo off the street got.

WOW!! from now on, I'll place no greater value on a 32 frame with the reveal...from this day forth it is an equal or lesser to the model a or 33-34!!

Ford research should have kept this info sealed in a tomb.

 

In all seriousness tho...the reveal really makes the 32 frame the nicest frame ever made, or reproduced. The 'reveal' frame is a work of art that has allowed fenderless cars to look just as finished as full fendered cars of that era.

But...Lucky Mike...there's something about your car...the smoothness of that rail and the way the roadster hugs them....pretty slick.

Hopefull this will 'trend' a bit, and we'll see somebody go for that look in future GNRS builds...or other big show contender builds.

I for one would like to see Pinkees turn one of their slimmer side profile 32 frames into a smoothie version. Plunk a sectioned roadster body on there...set it off with a more traditional and higher early hotrod stance....if only I had the dough, I'd be on the phone now.

 

Did you get Dicks measurement for the contest

 

Bringing up an old post.
I am in the process of purchasing a Model B pickup that does not have the reveal either. Frame looks like a 32 with riveted cross members and has a B motor in it. Bellhousing flange is stamped with a number that reflects a May 32 build date.
Here is where things get fuzzy. I am aware of the frame VIN stampings in 3 places and this one may have 4.
Vin on front by firewall foot is illedgible. There are stampings on the rear face of the rear cross member that are fairly readable but no star either side of the stamping and hard to tell if it starts with a "B" or "18". Same #`s on top of crossmember fairly crisp with some upside down #`s. The numbers do not correlate with 1932 but fall within the range of 1934.
Not in a position to pull the cab to look at the "B" post area but suspect that the #`s will be the same.
The vehicle was titled using partial numbers off the side of the block which I have had no luck identifying by research.
I am aware of replacement frames but one with out a reveal and then stamped incorrectly?

Thoughts

 

HB32, you do know that 33-34 pickups looked like 32's, right? But their frames didn't have any reveal? And they made 4 cylinders into 34, so the 32 bellhousing could have been switched in the last 80 years. You might be buying a 33-34. Show us a picture and we'll have an answer faster than you can refresh your screen.

 

Too late to chime in that I have the smallest, if we are still measuring ?? Hung like a tic tac she said.

 

Definitely 32. All 3 crossmembers are riveted in, 106" wheel base, shape of frame follows the contours of a 32 frame, firewall is definitely 32 and no signs of welding on the frame as in shortening it from a 33/34. No visible signs of the 33/34 center cross member either.
Does not have the usual 3 stampings for VIN.
I will post some pics when I get a chance...any specific areas?

 

Post a clear pic of the frame right where the cowl band bolts down to it. We are looking for a small divot in the top corner of the frame rail to determine the rails are real Henry Ford. And any pics of the rails where the K-member is riveted in can help as well.

Since you know what all the differences are between 32 and 33/4, we now need to determine if the reveal-less frame is original Ford or a repro. And why it has a 34 era VIN.

There were no numbers originally on the side of the block after 1931. The 32 and up four cylinders had their serial number stamped on the top of the flywheel housing.

 

Will have a look and post what I find shortly.

 

Tried but unable to get a clear pic as the cab, fenders etc are still on the frame. I can feel a definite divot, adjacent to the cowl band nut, on the lower side of the top, close to the side of the rail, if this makes sense. Is this what you are referring to?

 

K member pics.

 

Being an old Hot Rodder I'm not an expert on restoring, but I have been around a few '32's and I've never seen the numbers stamped on the leg of the K member. I have a pick up chassis and the numbers are where they are supposed to be,but only one set on the rear of the driver side and they don't have the stars. Will be interesting to see what you've got.

 

Sure looks like a regular old, common 32 frame. Not an early frame as it has the front legs of the K riveted to the crossmember and rails. Some front legs got retrofitted to the early frames, but not sure if the local dealer would have been able to rivet them.

That serial number location is definitely not right. I've never seen that before, and think that maybe a dealer or some local DMV put those there.

Make sure to post these pics on Fordbarn so Mr. Rehor can see them. He'll give you the straight scoop.

 

Not having much luck on the barn searching for him.

 

HRP is exactly right-on. If memory serves me, I think about Lil John Buttera (RIP) building a '29 Highboy on a '32 frame. Now, if anyone ever hated that reveal on Deuce frames, it was Lil John. An article showed him with a rosebud tip on his torch, carefully massaging that beautiful characteristic completely out of that frame. He fucking hated that one part of the Deuce frame. Anyone remember the article, probably in R & C ?