Champ quick change axle ideas

I'll measure it up and post pics too.

Have to buy a new camera.

 

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/album.php?albumid=14709&pictureid=225346
picture of one in my garage album

 

Is a "Gold Track Differential" current stuff, or is it strictly used these days?

 

Gold track is a good choice Chip.

 

I believe the 'Gold Trac' was a brand name originally used by Dan Press.

This was similar to the Stock Car Products Tru Trac and the Quickchange Exchange Diamond Trac.

The 'Gold' was the color of the Anodizing on the aluminum parts of the case, making it better than the others.
<O</O

Winters called theirs a Winters Trac.<O</O
<O</O

All good units.
<O</O

If you do buy a Dan Press unit, be aware that some of them have preload built in to 'lock up' the differential quicker under acceleration. Actually, it creates drag between the two side gears, all the time. You won't want this in a street rod. Fortunately, you can adjust this out quite easily. They are marked, "1/4, 1/2, 3/4, and full tight".

Dan Press does not show a ‘Gold Trac in their current catalog, but they now have a Platinum Trac. (Guess the gold standard has been replaced.)
I have never seen this style differential in anything but 31 spline, but just ask before you buy.
<O</O






Bruce

 

I have been reading all the QC posts as I see them..I know I've posted the following somewheres but can't remember where [duh!] so here it is maybe again.. Ford police cruiser [prob 9-3/8], big Ford/Merc Station wagon [9], Rancheros, Pick ups, around the years of 67' to 79', maybe [should be] big bearing/brakes and 31 spline [a little under 1.375 spline OD]..And WIDE..If you get the long side axles, and they are a strait enough forging, you should be able to get the 1.375 for the 12 spline at the length you need as they taper up [pretty quick] to the bearing size..Even some 28 spline big bearing axles can be turned to the 1.375 dia..KEY is big bearing and long axles so when they are shortened you are at the "meat"....However you will lose some strength at the new splines as the axle hardness depth decreases along the length of the axle to the flange..So moderate HP and Good Traction with exuberance equals twisting the axle at the splines and its done..

 

I would like to add a couple of observations. There are at least some pick-up axles that use a tapered roller bearing at the outer end. I have no idea if these axles will accept a typical ball type axle bearing or the offset between the housing end and the outer face of the axle flange. This is important in determining the brake set-up.

Another bit of information:

The most requested axle widths for non-fendered (Ford) cars are 54" and 56".
This is total width from wheel mounting surface to wheel mounting surface.

54" on '26 - '29
56" on '30 - '34

The very best way to determine rear end width is to measure total backspace of the wheel/tire combination, body/frame width at the closest potential rub point. Add clearance for each side. I like 1 1/2" per side, nothing less than 1".

Finally, individual axle length is 1/2 total width less 1/8" to 1/2". On some differentials the two side gears meet in the middle. (Tru-Trac and Torsen styles). Lockers have a 1" gap between the side gears. I try to get as much spline engagement as possible. Therefore, the most common axle lengths will be between 26 1/2" and 27 7/8".

This all pertains to 3/4 ton Quick Changes with the differential centered. Be sure to thoroughly inspect all the components you are trying to marry.

If anyone needs help in determining if the pieces they have are compatible you can PM me or post on the H.A.M.B. Put 'Quick Change' in the ***le and I will try to help. I like posting better because it saves having to repeat something several times.

Bruce

 

I am building a frankland QC with truck bells and am in need of a spacer like this, where do you get them?

 

I need one of these....any idea on demisions?

 

WOW....I asked a question about the spacer needed in my 3/4 ton QuickChange....26 roadster showed me a picture of one....PLUS he sent one to me....for free.....I appreciate it very much and thanks ...Bill

 

Thanks for the info I will also need a spacer for my Frankland/ 3/4 ton rear. a set of mesurements would be good. Thanks Jim (55willys)

 

I'm trying to come up with an axle tube length for my winters "champ-style" rear end. I need to know how far apart the ends of the tubes are from each other when installed in their bells and ***embled.
Also, I went to Winter's site but could find no tubes with ford 9" ends already welded on...guess I gotta call them, eh?

 

Rocky you might try Lefthander Ch***is.com, they have good parts and service.

 

Rocky, I am now a Lefthander dealer and owe you a Friday call anyway. A bunch of my QC parts came from them.

 

Axle tubes are made to your specified length. The Housing end to end width is determined by a couple of factors.

1. Overall width desired

2. Axle bearing to wheel mounting offset (The brakes you want to use determine this)

3. Width of center section and depth of tube pockets in the bells.

If you post the width you want and the pieces you already have, I would be glad to show you (and everyone else reading this thread how to determine the tube length required.

This should get you within + or - 1/16" overall width.

Winters part number for BIG BEARING AXLE TUBES AND HOUSING ENDS is 6478.

These are the old style big bearing cups with 1/2" bolts. They also have the later Torino style (3/8" bolts) but I can't lay my hands on that part number.

PM me for pricing.

 

Some Willys Pickups used the Timken rear axle. They have a long left side tube that I was going to use for the right side by machining a little farther up the tube and heating the bell to slide it a little further in redrill the tube and bolt it in. then weld on the right side spindle end off my 3/4 ton Ford rear. I think this will eliminate the need for a spacer. Any one know if I am correct?

 

Done a couple of champs in different optios, if you want the course spline axles you need to look at starting with 40 sline axle stock and start from there! Used all configuration of 31 spline centres, trying a Winters alumimum maxi spool modified for my champ, i was not happy with the previous hemisphere, felt it lazy. Quick Change exchange centres are my favourite locker type centres. Have used galaxy brakes previously on my coupe with the large 9" axle ends, now fitting Buicks, 48 backing plates on the same large ends. have a number of course spline spools from various projects, would not be my first choice . Hope you can take something from my late night contribution, good to see your project is gaining momentum again! cheers Wayne

 

The spacer is used internally to position the differential carrier between the bells. I thnk you will find that the bell has a step to STOP the tube from going in too far. I suppose you could machine the bell and put a bearing cup in the end of the tube, but why? The spacer can be fabricated out of a chunk of aluminum far easier than all that rigamaroll (sp?)

 

Subscribed!

I have an old Frankland that was on a roundy round ch***is under a t-bucket. I sold off the wide five axles and tubes and picked up a 31 spline Gold Trac and some used 9 inch brakes for it, but I have never gone further.

I want to go the new axle tubes and cut to fit axle way, but never seem to have the $. Plus, wasn't really sure how to figure the axle and tube lengths (until this thread).

Looking forward to Gearhead's book on the subject too.

 

i bought a franklin champ QC from franklin when they were in ruskin fl. it was the pumkin and bare tubes, no axils that was in 1975, i built my 34 w/boss429 in 92, i sent the rear over to jamie franklin in ruskin fl. [son of jim franklin], he cut tubes and put in axils etc. for ford 9'' brakes.no problems yet. he still does work on QC rears he is still in ruskin, he might be of help w/problem. 1-888 287 6148 i think

 

I have been following this thread for a while and got a lot of good info from it. Here are a few pictures of the end result.

 

Good to see this pop back up. I kinda shelved the quick change idea last fall, but damn it;s hard to have that cool thing sitting on a shelf staring at me every time I'm out louvering... Might have to get back on it.

 

I converted a Winters 10" heavy duty QC out of a dirt car to use under my 32Ford. Pulled the axle tubes and made new tubes with Ford 9" bearing ends. Put Buick complete backing plates and brakes on it. Polished it, got a Winters trak for diff, helical gears. 4:88 R&P still wines. The thing is great, have 12,000 miles on it 3:01 qc gears. Do all your bracket welding on the tubes first, then put it in a jig with a 2" bar end to end and weld on bearing ends. Can't post photos , car is the winter garage that I rent.



Ago

 

Ya know, while I'm thinking about it again, another thought crossed my mind. I have seen the "conversion" side plates that bolt an early Ford P***enger type axle tube to a Champ type quickie... Did they ever make those in 11 bolt? Do they still?

 

I don't know about 11 bolt, but Winters sell some conversion plates, they are not cheap and Winters does not sell very many.



Ago

 

Yes, they were made by Halibrand for 11 bolt centers. And the Winters are also 11 bolt.

 

I was just looking at a Champ rear the other day set up that way and it kinda helped hide the m*** of the larger center section. If I was building a '32 - '34 it wouldn't be a big deal, but with my smaller "A" roadster pickup, it's my opinion a Champ looks just a bit out of scale.

 

I put a 11 stud champ in my 29 pickup.I used the truck bells but cut the ribs off and filled it in to look like car bells.Also put 9 inch stuff on at ends.I really like the look of the big QC under my truck.Under a car they might look m***ive but in a truck their ok.

 

Just a couple of examples, for those not familiar with the side plate adapters. The one on the wall is an 11 bolt, the one in the car is a 12 bolt, all genuine Halibrand.

 

Using a Champ rear center section will provide you with all the looks and strength you require in your traditional hot rod. If you think they are too large, then paint them and they disappear from sight. I do agree that a A/V8 looks better with the V8 model but if you don't want to spend the going price then shop for a Champ center section and build your own.

Shown below are some examples of the Champ. I would caution you to stay away from the 80's style with the smooth bells and full floating axles. They were famous for breaking the axle ends. Also note that when using 40 axle tubes no oil goes into the housings. A small seal is required in the side plates. Some people don't install these and the oil goes everywhere. Note the machine work required on the DPI "Gold Trac" which is required to fit the side plates bearing spacing. Someone should start making the side plates and new Halibrand 301 Champ center sections.