Cross steer or traditional?

I purchased a vega box for my build and I am using a telescopic type caddy colum..I am also running a new speedway 4 inch drop front end..I need to purchase the rest of steering but wanted some opinions on different set ups pros cons..I would really like to hear from those of you that have run both..do I just run it tradition or set up cross steer does it matter if the tie rod is in front of axle or behind?..

Many more questions to come from this newb.

 

Cross steer is just as traditional as side steer, '35 and up left the factory that way, and there were plenty of '34 and earlier based hot rods built in the fifties with cross-steer and '37 up steering boxes. Its the column and vega box that are not "traditional".

 

I get that ...I am no means building a traditional HotRod..I am building my HotRod..When I look in speedway catalog it refers to the set ups as traditional and cross steer..

 

With cross steering I would recomend a panard bar.I like the tierod behind the axel.
Good luck with your build. What are you building?

 

I prefer side steer. Just looks "right" to me. But I dont do tilts, so since its your car, build it how you want, both work when done right.

 

Not knowing a lot about all these "new non-Ford" steering boxes, I am under the impression that a Vega box is, in stock configuration, a cross steer deal.
I that hope someone will reply and correct me if I am wrong. I'm never too old to learn.

 

I bought a Model A with cross steering and changed it back to traditional. Both work fine if set up right but the set up in mine was a hack job and it had a death wobble that wouldnt quit. Lots of things wrong and all was corrected by going back to traditional drag link and an F1 box. Handles great and looks like it should IMHO.

 

Typically, they are used for cross steer, but I have seen them used side steer as well.

 

Curious as to why a panhard for only the cross steer?

 

As the steering box tries to push the steering arms side to side, it will push the frame pivoting on the shackles sideways.

 

I'm ***uming he's referring to the side thrust created by the force of moving the steering gear cross ways putting extra force laterally into the axle. For every action there's an equal and opposite reaction...

 

lol...nice timing...

 

Model A on 32 rails...I have a thread started on it..

 

Thanks for any and all comments..

 

The idea is that the p***enger end of the axle move in the same arc as the cross-link and thus eliminate any chance of bump-steer. Ideally you want the Panhard bar and the cross-link as close as possible to the same length, orientation, and height. That way they are substantially parallel through all suspension movements.

 

In lieu of a pan hard bar, you can use a fixed, or "dead" perch at one end of your spring to fix lateral axle movement.

 

To do cross steer, you need to be able to mount the steering gear far enough forward to allow for parallelism between the drag link and the tie rod. Does your engine/ch***is combo have enough room for the column to p*** by the engine?

 

I think it depends on "the look" you want. I happen to like the look of side steering. It plays into my sprint car / hot rod likes. The Vega box is mostly seen use as is in cross steer setups. It could be reversed and used in a side steer setup, but they are not super strong. A GM 525 would be a better choice. However, both the 525 and the Vega (GM 140) present a few mounting issues when used in side steer. On my '29 on '32 rails, I played with numerous boxes before finally doing this:
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=749287&highlight=fj40+steering

 

Still in moc up stages...not exactly sure which route I am going..

 

Do not move the tie rod to the front. IT will really mess up the steering geometry. IT will give you reverse Ackerman, ie; the outside wheel in a turn will try to turn sharper than the inside wheel. The spindles can be modified to help but using Ford type spindles I don't believe it can be modified enough.
Sure someone will now tell you that they have had one for years, BUT IT IS STILL NOT RIGHT.
The one guy is correct, to use the Vega box as a side steer you will have to reverse it. Meaning that the steering shaft will have to come out of the other end. Also the Vega box does not lend it's self to easy mounting for side steer.

 

My car was side steer to start. It was fine and all but I didn't like the hoop up front or the recess where the box set into the frame. When I redid it I mounted a 40 box and column. I have to say it drives a million times better. It handles like a damn Porsche. Plus lock to lock is only like 2 turns. No panhard bar needed. No dead perch needed. They're band aids.


Early on with the f100 side steer (I later bent the arm outside of the wishbone):


With '40 Cross steer:

 

I am also steering away eek:) from the F1/F100 box, I agree with Dreddybear that it is too slow for a light car. But there are other side steer boxes you can use. I am putting a hemi in a T, I dont think cross steer will fit without a u-joint. You haven't said what engine you are using, but at someone else has mentioned, there can be clearance issues. My build has a fairly strong track T flavour, so side steer just looks right.

 

Dreddy and Falcon; Appropriate timing for me... A hamber just dropped of a F100 box this morning and when I was counting turns to find true center to check for slop, it was just under 5.5 turns lock-to-lock. Yikes, the first thing I thought of is turning the steering wheel a lot in normal driving.

car is 32, boxed frame, undropped 32 axle, 32 spindles and then the 32 stock steering arm length on the left spindle.

Caddy motor ( posting that for weight info). and caster is not set yet; it's way wrong at 10



Suggestions welcome, he wants good driver, but not modern parts/style

 

It will have a 460 and a c6..

 

I ***ume you are ok with a u-joint? 460s are pretty wide across the heads, I bet you will have trouble fitting cross-steer unless you use one.

 

joints dont scare me..

 

A lot of people don't realize that stock early-Ford angled shackles go a long way to locating the axle laterally. That's why it's better to have the shackles near vertical when using a Panhard bar. One doesn't "add" a Panhard bar to a front end that is already ostensibly complete; either one uses solely a Panhard bar to locate the axle and thus define the roll centre, or one doesn't. When several devices try to locate the axle they are likely to fight one another, and one can't really say which of them are band-aids and which of them are what one is trying to stick the band-aid onto .

 

Great advice Ned! Thanks, makes perfect sense.

 

F&J- for some reason I can't pm you on my phone so my answer is going here

The stock f100 pitman is a hair under 6". My bent one is 3" and man did it **** to turn.


Posted from the TJJ App for iPhone & iPad

 

step away from the speedway dictionary...

and put the vega box in. I doubt you'll regret it.