Howdy folks, this is my first post other than the "introduce yourself" post, so bear with me. Here's a summary, we have a 1951 Ford Custom with a stuck intake valve. I messed with thru the plug hole, and it's still doesnt act right (although the valve sure seems to move free when you apply some light pressure with a screwdriver) , plus is now making a clackity clackity noise when it runs. I'm fairly handy with tools, as are most guys here, so I pulled the intake off to see if I could figure out what is wrong. I got the intake off, and nothing looked broke at first glance. Upon further inspection, I noticed the valve guide keeper was not pointed in the same direction as the other 15. I reached down to see if it would turn, and the whole works turned (spring, keeper, valve, guide.) And then I noticed the guide itself is hanging down about 1/4 of an inch, and none of the others are, and the hole thing moves up and down 1/4", and thats what is causing the clackity clackity racket when it runs. I know the head has to come off, but, will a new guide fix that, or is the block F'ed up? Or is it possible the seat has been pounded out? Sorry for the questions, but I know nothing about flatheads and am learning as I go.
After further review, the spring is still partially collapsed and I am sure the valve is still stuck in the guide. After I get the head off, how do I go about getting the valve freed up so I can remove it and the guide?
Pull the head. Take that valve guide keeper out, and I think you said the guide is loose in the block? If yes, then the whole deal; valve,spring and guide comes up/out as a unit. If the guide is not loose, there are different types of tool designs to pull it out. I have one from my Dads old shop that looks like a C-clamp shape.
Thanks. Yeah, the whole thing is loose. I can reach down there and spin it around, move it up and down, I can see the guide hanging out the bottom of the block, etc. It's loose for sure. I soaked the head bolts in PB Blaster, and tomorrow I'll see if I can get the head off without breaking any head bolts (I've heard that can be an issue with these.)
Now another question. Can the pan be removed in the car? With as bad as the lifter valley looked (sludged up) it kind of concerns me what the oil pan may look like inside. And just because I'm new and havent annoyed anyone yet, here are a couple more pic of the car. Yeah, we drove it to a cruise in with a stuck valve. My gf really wanted to drive it, so we took it into town, a whole 6 miles from home. Here's what it looked like when we pulled it out of the building it had sat in since 1985.
Wow, that looks almost exactly like my '51 when I got it (see my album). You are correct in soaking the headbolts. A couple of suggestions would be to use an impact wrench to remove them (the shock of an air wrench seems to work better than a steady pull), and maybe tighten them up just a tad before trying to break them loose. Also, don't try to take any stubborn ones all at once. Work them back and forth. I see you have the famous "Korean War Chrome". I'm sure glad I had my plating done in 1987! Oh yeah, the pan can be removed with the engine in the car. You have to take the bolts out of the motor mounts, jack the engine up (board under the pan), and have the crank positioned so the front counterweights get out of the way. While you have it apart, install new motor mounts. I spent several years chasing a supposed clutch problem, only to find out it was a bad p***enger side motor mount that was completely separated, but hard to see.
Thanks man! That sounds a lot easier than getting the pan off the motor in my racecar. The car actually drives real well, and everything seems to work too, except running on 8 cylinders (or the wipers.) The carb has some issues too, even after rebuilding, but I'll wait till it runs on all 8 cylinders to address that issue. At this time, my gf doesnt want to do anything to the body or chrome, she just wants to get it so we can drive it, and go to some cruise ins and whatnot. I tend to agree with her at this point. It's a survivor and hasnt had anything done to "restore" the car, and we both like that. Even the interior is in real good shape.
Here's a dumb question (I'm full of them) but where's the best place to buy parts? We've been buying everything from Dennis Carpenter. I cant complain about any of the stuff we've got, and since they are in NC as well, we get the stuff from there pretty quickly. But if there is someone cheaper, I'm all ears.
For flathead stuff I really like Van Pelt Sales. Mac Van Pelt is a member here and an excellent source of knowledge and parts. www.vanpeltsales.com For shoebox parts and advice contact Chris at Shoebox Central. Look for him on Facebook. Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
That one cleaned up nicely! As you and your GF feel, I'd leave it as is. Some nice history there. Just fix the dead cylinder and clean the pan. She'll probably run longer than you will. Joblot also carries a good amount of parts for these later flathead cars.
The head is off, and those bolts came loose pretty easily actually. I had a couple I couldn't get to with the impact gun and I had to use a breaker bar on them. They came loose easy enough I probably could have used my half inch rachet to break them loose. I've taken 351Cs apart that fought me a lot worse than this motor has so far. I got the valve ***embly out, and talk about being stuuu-uuuu-uuuck! I cant even get the valve to spin in the guide. The spring turns freely, but that valve aint moving. At this point, what are my options? Replace the whole ***embly, or just the valve and guide? I took some pictures of the progress, and if I remember I'll get them uploaded and post a few here to share. Oh yeah, and now that I have it apart, it's an exhaust valve that is stuck and not an intake. Sorry, but like I said earlier, I dont know squat about these motors.
I'm not up on any flathead V8 Fords, but I recall seeing new valve guides from my Dad's 1950s auto shop. Those were split down the center, for the valve stems that had a mushroom shape at the lifter end. Are yours split like that?
Split guides and mushroom valves are early flathead. Good advice on here but the really old flatheaders hang out on the Fordbarn.
Ford dropped the split guides, and the one piece items available are exact fit replacements. The intake guides need to have an O Ring to prevent oil from being drawn past the guides . Remove the valve and guide, and as said, clean and inspect everything. Happy Flatheadin' 4TTRUK
Before you just put a new guide in that hole, it would be a good idea to measure it and see how much wear there is. You may have to have the new guide knurled to take up some wear from the old one rattling around in there for awhile. In any event put the new guide in with something like Loc***e 609 to take up any excess wear.
What a great old car to start on, you are one lucky dude! Check the lifters to see if they are adjustable. When they left the factory, valve adjustment was by grinding the seat or the stem to get it right. Another place to by Ford parts is Macs in NY. If you are in NC, shipping may answer all the questions on where to buy. Close is cheap.
Thanks everyone. At this point, I still can't get the valve to move in the guide. I currently have it soaking in some old, more than likely highly hazardous, carb cleaner that was in a metal, screw top can I found in my father's garage after he p***ed away. I know this, it sure stinks to high heaven! Here's a couple of pics.
Hi "kv", if you're going to do a "quickie" repair throw the valve, the guide, the spring, and the keepers in the dumpster. Just save/reuse the retainer if it's OK. If not, toss that also. Replace all the parts, use a new horseshoe clip on the guide and try to get local shop to put a bronze liner in the new guide! At least that one will never "hang" again with the bronze! Just a tip, the stock springs are a progressive wound setup, the closer wound coils sit directly on the guide. Thanks, Gary in N.Y. P.S. You can use a conventional spring compressor (with straight ends) "in the valley" to re***emble the pieces, we do it all the time! Tight fit but it works.
Thanks Gary. Good to know that about the spring. Yeah, it's gonna be a quick fix for sure. I dont have the money to do any upgrades on it, plus my girlfriend (who is the real owner of the car) just wants to be able to drive it. Looks like I'm gonna chuck that whole ***embly in the dumpster (actually set it on the shelf with all the other broken parts I have collected from racing), and buy everything new for that one hole. Cool tip on the spring compressor, but the one I own isnt going to fit down in there. It's a manual job, and a big heavy duty SOB to handle the roller springs on my racecar.
With this being a '51, you should have the last iteration of flatmotor valve ***emblies, but it could have been changed over the years. I can't tell from your picture. The difference is in the retainer and a little piece that sits in it. It was designed to help the valves rotate. Replace with whatever was in there. Personal opinion, even tho you're probably dying to drive the thing this summer, pulling the motor and having it vatted would sure pay dividends down the road. Even if no other parts are replaced, just getting all that **** out of there and running it with fresh clean detergent oil will ensure many miles of smooth running.
The Jalopy Journal
