Ive got a lwb c20 that i plan on making into a swb. While I'm at it, i was thinking making it a unibody. What would need to be done to pull this off properly. 1. make frame very rigid. 2. cut bed down to a swb. also frame 3. remove back piece of bed thats against the cab. 4. weld bed to cab. What am i missing?
Well you don't need to stiffen the ch***is that is the beauty of a unibody truck the body doesn't flex in the middle. You may consider stiffening the body where it welds together maybe some extra plating on the inside of the cab where it doesn't show.
Just wondering... why? As already stated you went wrong with number one and stiffening the ch***is. Are just trying to go light weight or something? It would be a ton of work and a bit of brains to pull it off properly. You could whack the front clip off and make into a sub frame and then run essentially " sub frame connectors" to the back half, which you could make one or use the back half of the frame... (not much lighter than the frame under it now) Then joining of the cab isn't quit as simple as just welding them together. You gotta realize that a truck bed doesn't have much structural integrity... it's a box. And as I said you would pretty much have to run "sub frame connectors" to keep this thing from becomming a taco. I dont mean to shoot down your idea but I just don't get it....?
I think he meant just connecting the body to the cab....not actual unit-body construction without framerails
My c20 is a 1963 and it needs a lot of body work and it was free, so its either s**** it or hack it. Here are some pics ford chevy
A couple years ago Cl***ic Trucks had a Chev in bare metal and again painted. Could prob find it on their site.
I understood you and like I said no reason to stiffen the ch***is. There was big money in stiffeners for the desert truck racing crowd and the wannabes back in the '90s because pickup trucks wiggle in the middle. The reason they wiggle in the middle is because they don't have a one piece body to stuffen them. Does that make sense? I think it would look smooth as silk with a one piece body but you need to think twice and cut and weld once if you catch my drift. Hardest part is going to be where the bed sides meet the cab, unbolt the bed and slid it against the cab, you may need to widen or narrow the bed appropriately. Also take a good hard look at the belt line and make sure that everything lines up well if you get a wiggle in your beltline you just trashed a project. To take full advantage of the conversion you should also think about welding a metal floor into the bed like the fods have, you can buy that material with the beads already rolled into it as a repop floor for the ford or maybe an elcamino. The Ford would come closer to fitting and looking correct. It could be done but I wouldn't do it just for the sake of doing it make sure you get yourself some benifit out of it. Remember form follows function.
Without stiffening the frame, and even then, the chances of it not cracking are pretty slim. Go jack one one corner of the truck an look at the box to cab gap. It would take major reinforcement of the cab. Weak cab structure, strong box. Something will give. Ford had problems with the unibox cracking in the early production. Not sure what the fix was. Could have been the reason it didn't last.
porkn******, mmm good stuff, i and definitely going to make sure that everything is perfect and i will prob spend at least a week trying to get it taken care of. I was planning on finding a re pop metal bed floor that will fit the make it stronger. tinbender, if i take my time and box in the frame and add stiffer crossmembers i can take all flex out of the frame, similar to the ranger that is being build on the show trucks, they removed all flex. I will definitely do my research before it is done, thats why i posted this first.
I diddnt notice that. Well If I must I can add on to the top of the bed rails, if it looks good in person.
Ok I was tricked I thought this thread would be about one of these . To do it right you will have to put a 302 or 351 windsor in it since so many *******ise the real ones with SBC's. Rick
Yeah don't get me wrong it can be done. I just worry when people start telling you no problem weld it. This will require very well thought out reinforcement. Seeing a picture of one doesn't mean a lot to me. I see **** every day that someone has done. Making it work is another story. The other thing I haven't seen asked is what your going to do with the truck. Big difference if your going to run a 6 cyl. or a blown big block pulling the front wheels at the track. Won't take up time here but PM me if you want some detailed ideas on how to join the cab and box. I'd do it differently than most.
Naaaah alright I get ya... I was under the impression that you want to make it a "uni- body".... you just wanna join the cab to the bed... well why didn't you say so? No but seriously I'll have to agree with TinBender.... I've seen a lot of **** in life that seemed cool or was a great idea but wasn't thought out carfully or built properly and sometimes was just **** ugly cuz someone jacked it up. I'm diggin the idea there with connecting the bed to the cab. If your gonna do it, do it right.
Oh no My someday dream car is a 69 Z28 complete with a BOSS 302 under the hood and a Toploader 4 speed behind it . I would have to hit all the Super Chevy shows with it . Cant tell I'm a ford guy huh . Rick
No. 1, making the frame rigid is essential. Old truck frames were designed to flex. The "unibody" Ford was built on such a frame. The Fords were a huge failure in farm country because once they were driven across rough ground, and especially driven across a terrace, the doors would not open. Ford learned an expensive lesson and quickly switched back to a separate bed. So, a torsionally stiff frame is essential to avoid problems with body panels and doors.
Wow, Ok... Well as an owner of a 63 Ford Unitbody and having built a few dozen of them over the years, I can tell you some real facts about ch***is strength and how it all works. First off, have you ever heard about the Chevy suburbans and Panel Trucks having crack issues? Like any? The reason I ask is they sit on the same frame construction as the pickups. I would expect to have door alignment issues, cracking and such if this was true. I know what you're going to say "they have a roof" and to that I would respond that the same forces that would cause cracks between the bed and cab would otherwise be moved to the door openings and windshield frame. Still no issue. On the Fords, the biggest problem is with the single wall bed and cab wall. When the owners used them as trucks, the cracks, dings and dents started to show up. Normal pickup usage when the bed was trashed, you could just replace it. When the cabs and torque box under the rear cab wall would start to rust, then the body structure would start to flex and you would have trouble with door alignment. If you want to stiffen the frame, then a simple tube six pointed crossmember would be enough. But I have a customer here in town with a 62 Ford with a Ford Racing 514 and a TKO, my old Dakota kit and stock leaf in the back. No extra frame stiffening and no ill effects of ch***is flex in the 6+ years he has had it on the road. I have others, just no pictures. ------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- I would say if you are going to do something like this to your GM, make sure you weld the entire bed structure to the cab and somehow join the bed floor to the cab floor. You weld joints are going to be the most stressed areas because of the HAZ and MIG wire has a higher silcon content so it will be harder than the parent metal. Just be smart about your work and you will be fine.
Actually, no. Same frame as all the other trucks. Here is a stock (nearly) 61 Ford short bed Unitbody frame before I got too far along with it. You can clearly see there are no "extra" parts.
El P. I have a great deal of respect for you skills and knowledge, but I disagree with some of what you say. I've been in the collision biz for close to 40 years most of it in heavy collision. I have repaired stress cracked suburbans, not many, but it happens.More than cracks, separated welds are not uncommon in a few different models. For a short time, ford produced a frame filled with holes on pick ups and Broncos. Lost count of how many of those Broncos. I've repaired. And the lack of roof structure is a major issue. Cut the top off of any car and and you can move things all over the place. Again this can be done, but it's a serious modification. Without the correct bracing, I can see some problems developing. Again, doable, but much more involved than welding the bed to the cab.
Not surprising, I too have seen cracks and separated welds on many vehicles with heavy use or high miles, ladder frame or otherwise. I just find it hard to believe that these are caused solely by a flexible frame. Poor engineering, maybe but I just don't understand the alarmism here. It's not too surprising you would have to repair plenty of Broncos over the years. Bronco frames are boxed but are still a ladder frame and had less crossmembering than the pickup ch***is. I have seen the ones with the holes in the inner wall of the frame rails also. But, I would have to see proof of a factory boxed Ford PU (not Bronco) frame from the 40-50-60's and 70's year ranges before I would believe it. . It's almost always a given that a convertible is not as stiff as a sedan. But for what the OP wants to do, I do suggest the six pointed X as I mentioned in my first post on this thread. It may not be necessary though. I'm just countering the negative neigh-bobs of negativity. It's ok to disagree
No prob El P, like I said I highly respect your opinion. The broncos I'm referring to were later. late 80s I believe. These were c channel frames. Only made for a year of two. because they were ****! I agree with the X member, and wouldnt weld the box to the cab, but would open up the cab and the end of the box and slide the box foreword to the door jamb, and bring the inner box into the inner structure of the cab. Along with some well thought out reinforcement to the cab and box junction. My reply was not meant to be a don't do it statement, but rather a it's not as easy and simple as welding the box to the cab.
maybe look into a later c10 metal bed floor i think they started doing them around 69 seems like it would fit better than a bed out of an elky
I don't know the OPs use for the truck, but if I wanted to pull this off as a show vehicle that wasn't meant to carry a lot of weight, I would consider a single box mount so the frame twist wouldn't get into the cab/box unit. This is not the most usable choice but the box won't get ripped off the cab because of frame movement. Another choice is a good frame mounted roll cage to stiffen the frame to the point that it won't twist enough to matter. Personally I can't believe that Ford pulled such a stupid ***** back in the day! The laws of physics always trump idiot designers. LOL
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