As many have said...$100 for a 409 = Great Deal! Good for you. Also learned something today about 65's with 409's
No, he's full of shit Mid-march of '65 a Corvette could be had with a 396/425, 21 hundred or so made. Kind of a lot for the short production run. It was replaced with the 427 for '66 in Corvette. Every car for sale has an engine that came out of a Corvette.
lol, that's like all the 60-66 v8 trucks I look at... they all have a 327 actually they all have 283s...
Well, unfortunately, it looks like the one-year-only exhaust manifolds may have been scrapped before I got there to pick up the motor! I'm going back this weekend to rummage thru the guy's shed to see if they're buried there!
The '65 425hp 396 is the same motor as the '66 375hp 396 (overrated in '65).......the 425hp 427 has essentially the same cam/carb/heads/compression as the 396 - but it has 31 extra cubes... On a side note, my dads vette sucked a valve (they used the low hp retainers in the high hp motor) and it was replaced with a '66 spec 427 under warranty - he remembers the car as being a completly different animal after that, even though they supposedly had the "same" hp...
Was the 65 396-425 the same engine a few years years later in the Camaro and Nova rated at 375 HP but factored to 425 HP by the NHRA?
See above post....It was a rating game with Chevrolet. Nothing was allowed to have the same hp rating as the flagship Corvette. All the part numbers are identical. Posted using two Dixie cups and a medium length piece of string.
I always heard the 375 HP rating was because of insurance. The insurance companies frowned on anything rated over 400 HP. They frowned on Corvettes anyway, so it didn't matter as much in them. Don't remember where I heard or read it, so take it for what it's worth. As far as the 396 vs 427. I figure 31 extra cubic inches is worth about 31 horsepower in a high performance engine.
Assuming your block casting ends in "656" you have a 1965 409 block (or engine). As noted, that 1965 409 casting was the last year for the passenger car block to be cast before the BBC (396) replaced it. That last year there were only two versions of the 409, the detuned (but torquey) 340 horse with small heads (817s) and hydraulic lifters and the performance oriented 400 horse single four barrel with the bigger heads (583s). If you got those heads (actually either set) with your block then you have an even better deal. Your 6x2 setup fits only on the smaller heads, not the tall ones. What are you planning on using up top for cylinder heads? They came in trucks that year as well (with "eyebrows" in the cylinder bores reducing the compression and delivering 252 horses but a lot of torque). If you have a passenger car 1965 409 block only with the 656 casting I would venture to say the value is around $2K (or more to some guys with a 1965 Chevy) assuming it is clean and crack checked. Assuming yours checks out, for $100 you did great! And you are saving a legendary engine by building it and installing it in your vehicle. Congrats, I am envious . Best, Tom
I agree that the 425 horse 427 4 speed in a Biscayne was an absolute sleeper. We used to street race for money. I had a 63 dodge convertible 383 auto and nearly lost to the Biscayne! I was accustomed to racing the 396 Camaros Chevells and whatever fords would try (yawn). Street hemis were pigs. Oh my, that 66 Biscayne!
I worked at a gas station in high school in the 60's and one day a red/black '65 Impala with an old gent drove in. It was a single four barrel 409 with all the luxury options you would expect from a mature fella like that. A few weeks later the same car came back - at least it looked the same, same year, colours, old gent, etc. Except this one had a 396, same options, different car. Imagine what these two cars would be worth in a collection today, the last of the W engines and the first of the rats, everything else the same.
Or it was the 400 cubic inch rule GM had for intermediate cars....that was before 1970 And yes the Vette always got the biggest HP for engine size then and now
I worked with a guy that said he ordered a '65 Impala SS when he got out of the service. He said the order was by horsepower rating and that he thought he was getting a 396 but the car came in with a 409. I have no idea if this is true or not. Blue
It has always been my understanding a 396 could not be ordered in '65 until the 409 option had been discontinued. But you know there had to be some glitches in the switch.
In 1965 I was in the Navy at Long Beach, CA and in early '65 I bought a '58 Chevy Bel Air from Cormier Chevrolet on Long Beach Blvd. One day, while at Cormier, I saw a '65 Impala hardtop with a 409 in their shop. It was Evening Orchid in color but I do not remember details about the trans or carbs. A short time later, in '65, my enlistment was up and I returned home to Missouri and went to work for a Chevy dealer. By then the 396's were in production. I stayed in the automobile business for several decades and that '65 409 Impala i saw in Long Beach is the only one I ever saw. I have no doubt there were more.......just not very common, it seems.
Yes, somewhere I've got an interim shop manual supplement for '65 that outlines the new 396 and TH400. Too bad they never offered a TH400 with the '09.
I agree, but if you are lucky enough to score a PG from behind an '09, they have an extra clutch pack. Good powerglide......
Saw a 65 pickup a few years ago with the 409 in it. Looked original. I have an AFB that is coded for 65 409, on my shelf. Can't remember how I got it, though.
Be careful here because the 1965 409 block casting is shared with the really common truck 409 block casting ending in "656"! No big deal it just probably has compression reliefs in the cylinders and "333" casting truck cylinder heads. I would have bought it in a minute for $100!
Yep it was a rare bird. Frank traded the 65 409 wagon to me for a 63 Tbird. I took the wagon home and found the build sheet on top of the gas tank. It was all real except for the 2-4 set up some one had added. When I told Frank I found the build sheet, he had me come and check the 64 409 wagon. Unfortunately the 64 wagon build sheet was gone.. We would drive it around as a shop car. It was great. Kind of like riding on the back of a pissed off dinosaur!
I have pictures of it somewhere along with a copy of that build sheet. Will have to look for it and post it.
GM hadn't learned anything about keeping valves where they belong from the earlier years. My buddy had a 66 425 hp 427, and his engine swallowed a valve while on warrenty. He hadn't had the car for 3 months, and he was an excellent driver that always respected the red line on the tach. After he got the car back, he put proper keepers on both heads. That solved the problem. I had a 300 horse 327 coupe, and after driving his car, the performance of his car made me feel like driving my car was like driving a Yugo. My car was better balanced though. You could feel the push, from the extra weight in the front end, during severe cornering. ( an L 88 would have solved that problem) I wish I had both cars today.
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