i am going to switch over to a ifs m11 in my 51 fleetline and I am torn between tci and ch***is engineering. I am going to put in a small block chevy mustang 11 front 700r4 trans nova rear I want to buy the kit from one company any help
I went with the TCI front end....if I wanted a good riding car, I would modify the orig suspension to meet my needs....and for sure the rear suspension....best I can tell there is NOT a good company out there for suspensions for these cars... I am used to a 71 monte in my 55 f100 and a 84 monte in my 51 shoebox...both had leaves removed in the rear and both rode super smooth....been adjusting and changing the front and rear suspensions now for over a month....still the worse riding car I have ever sat in and rode in....and I have rode in some old dodge pickups...my old corvette with the 1920's buggy rear spring rides like a caddy compared to my after market (when you call them, they have NO advice that helps you at all) suspension people. I am no expert on suspensions....but my 55 and 51 had me cut, weld and install the GM clips and neither ever had a front end alignment...they drove that nice, both were driven by me for over 8 years each and one had over 30,000 miles on it when I sold it.
So you know I am not talking junk here....my 86 year old mechanic, who was the corvette spe******t at a GM dealer for years, said if you think you can beat a stock GM front suspension like a monte, etc with an after market...good luck." I even had, and I will respect his privacy, a mentioned suspension company tech tell me what I just said about the stock gm, ford, etc suspension systems. And that goes for the braking systems also....that chrome big buck brake booster and MC I have...are in a junk box, never made it out of the driveway after fooling with them for over a month....put on an S-10 booster and MC from a jobber....had brakes within an hour that will stand you on your head. As you can see, my 49 fleetline is a nice car, the public go crazy over it anywhere I take it....and I even love the looks....and its pretty fast for a jazzed up 283, 700R, 3.42 s10 rear. I will make it ride nice eventually....
be sure to ignore any talk of clips. there is no better or easier installed front suspension for these cars than MII. I don't know about the TCI or Ch***is Engineering set ups, other than Ch***is Engineering has a bolt in MII available. did you look at Fatman? my buddy just put one in his 51. comes with polished stainless upper and lower A-Arms, and I believe dropped spindles were the same price as regular. it is also available in the "ultra low" version that puts the crossmember higher in the frame lowering the car even more.
Trust me....I wanted it blue. Friends just climbed my frame....my painter, who painted the vette, kept saying bronze...my vette had been red at one time for about 35 years and I sorta missed the hot color .... But yes, all three of those ride better than my fleetline...too bad the 55 and 51 are gone to happy owners now....55 went to NJ....51 to Greensboro area.... Blue does make them ride better...and in one case....go much faster....LOL.
I put a Ch***is Engineering bolt in kit in a friends 50 and went in great. No problems. It already had a v8 in it and I didn't have to take it out first. Because I didn't know where the engine sat in relation to their mounts, I had them leave the mounts off and welded them in myself. Good thing because the engine was set back farther than what their mounts would have been.
I am saying this.... If power steering is a must....then you need to change to a different suspension but the stock front end steers easy. The only reason I did not put a monte clip on this one is that the sheet metal fits precision on these chevys and the frame is too narrow to make a slip in GM clip work unless you take the body off as the clip would be welded p*** the front door just about. If you look at a GM clip, you willl find that the lower A frames are much longer than these MII...that tells me MII is much more violent going up and down, thus a choppier movement and less stable than the GM. Also, the MII is more narrow than the orig suspension. If I had it to do again, I would put in Fatman dropped upright to lower the car and rebuild the suspension and put in a disc brake set up. On the rear I think someone makes a part that you can use the stock springs with a later model rear end. And I would use lowering blocks on the rear. Then....You would have a very nice looking lowered car that drives and rides like a dream compared to my TCI front end and CE rear end. I have changed the rear spring set up at least 8 different ways and still need to do something else....I have worn the bolts out changing the rear springs so much...you can find lots of posts saying "rides like a truck" when you check...I even re-located the rear spring hanger per CE...orig instructions were wrong for my car....when asked why not give 47 1/2 between hangers...they said no one ever reads the directions or call them. I said ....I did. The MII front end was making all kinds of squeaks and noises...after talking with the tech at TCI said for me to lossen up the A frames...they did NOT give a torque value for the upper A frame in the instructions. I have backed them way off and the front end seems to be more free on movement but have not driven it yet. My mechanic, and he has never been wrong on anything in 40 years that I have known him, says the rubber in the A frames will be shot in a week or less if run loose. But I am going to try that....tired of the car riding like a boat on the roads...The tech told me to put maybe 60 lbs of torque on the upper a frame bolts...it goes to a stop first before getting to 60 lb....nice tech info huh???? I live in the mountains and there is not a level straight road anywhere. So, I need a good handling and riding car...the monte GM clips provided that. If you live where there is just warm weather and straight roads, then the MII might meet your needs....not here. Talk to others and find the right way for you to go.....so far....I have not been the least satisfied with mine ride wise.
No reason to clip these cars. The stock front end unbolts from the frame. Unbolts! It doesn't get any easier than that. The best low-buck option is to use a 73-86 Jaguar XJ front end - they also unbolt (!) and require only minor fab work to install. In fact, a couple of the bolt holes line right up. It lowers you about an inch, has disc brakes, rack & pinion, coil springs, and the wheel bolt pattern is the same 5 x 4.75" as stock. Plus, if you dig you should be able to buy a dead Jag, pull the front end, part it out a little, s**** the rest and at least be even money on it. If you have the bucks to spend, then a kit is the next option. A clip is crazy - you're joining three thicknesses of metal and two different frame designs. Unless you're a pro welder, that's potential for trouble. Plus you have to re-engineer the radiator support, front clip attachment, front bumper attachment, and most clips are too wide for these cars so they need to be narrowed or they look like hell. And FWIW, the stock front end *is* IFS; Corvette used the same suspension through '62, so parts are out there and cheap. With mine I planned to drive it as is and see how it was before going to a Jag.
My 50 Fleetline has a Late 70's Malibu/Monte Carlo front clip with drop spindles, stock rear springs with a nova rear end and lowering blocks. Drives and rides great. Love to drive it.
One of my good friends installed a Ch***is Eng front end in his. This is their bolt in unit with adjustable spring mounts to dial in the ride height you want. The only thing he is not happy with is the lack of power steering. He has plans to install a power rack this winter, but it is not a" bolt in job". Going to require a little surgery to the frame as the power rack is larger in the input shaft area. He is very happy with the way the car rides and drives. Francodag is here on the HAMB. He'd be more than happy to answer any questions you would have. Good luck with your build.
Nothing wrong with front clips. I have installed many of them. I have a 69 Z28 Camaro in my 49 Olds and it rides and drives great. But it is certainly a lot more work than un-bolting the stock front end and replacing it with a bolt in deal.
thanks for all the input. very interesting the problems that seem to occur with m11. if I am getting the general drift stay with the original front and if I need power steering try and adapt there are several setups listed on ebay does anyone have any experience with any of these
the Olds frame does not allow an easy install of a MII. you would need an MII "clip" that installs like other clips, except it is made for your Olds. I would imagine Fatman makes one for just about every car out there with a frame that will not accept a regular MII
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