Technical 54 chevy 235- no longer firing up

Well none of the parts stores between my work and home have any of the parts... said i could order and have them in by next monday at the latest...

Will try to check spark when i get home.

Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Now there is no spark at all...

When i went to replace the lead from the coil, the nut is rusted in place on the distributor. It wont loosen or tighten- just spins all the way through. The condensor and point contact slide out fairly easy and the lead from the coil was fairly easy to remove too.

All of the parts will have to be ordered- so at this point my question: should i buy a new electronic ignition distributor or go back original style? I think i saw an HEI electronic ignition/distributor setup for 150-159, then would still need to get new cables. Roughly 100-120 to order the orginal style stuff and not including new distributor... just trying to figure out pros and cons... would i still need the coil with the electronic ignition/ distributor too?

Here are the pics i took tonight by worklight... i made a new lead from coil to distributor- red also, but nut was rusted so couldn't tighten down...

Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

I recommend an electronic conversion. Pertronix, etc. About $65 from Summit.

 

Did you say, you are getting a new or remanufactured distributer ?
Yours looks so badly rusted, have you looked underneath the points plate yet, regardless ?

I agree with the Voodoo man - For my daily rides I got remanufactured/good/working distributers and installed the simple/reliable Pertronix conversion over a decade ago and I never looked back.

These first generation sixes were never designed to be any more efficient with the later generation GM HEI and don't really need it even when modified for racing.

The simple first generation Pertronix gives the same reliable magnetic trigger, but without the less reliable electronic HEI module that was designed for the second generation sixes to get better spark efficiency for these higher rpm engines.

 

Well there's an issue which is going to reduce the spark. Rusty electrical connections can run one day & quit the next. Just cut that screw off & replace it.

If the stock points & condensor are OK you should be able to clean this up and make it work OK.

That being said, electronic ignition is nice to have.

 

Just ordered the pertronix 1168LS ignitor, 40511 flame thrower 3ohm coil, and a set of 706101 7mm cables for a six.

I am going to be using this original distributor. Will clean it up more when i get everything in.

hopefully it will fire after all this. I also got yhe compcams tdc tool for a couple of bucks to get it ready to check timing too once i can get it running again.

Now its just waiting til parts come in... Will let you guys know how it goes.

Joe at pertronix said i could just knock out the insulator to run the wires and leave it open... just doesnt sound safe. Did you guys take it out with your setups? maybe some pictures of your setups with the pertronix would give me an idea of how to run the wires.

Also- will the plugs stay at .035 gap, or change?

Thanks for all the info guys! It is an aggravating situation, but i love learning new things as i go!

Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

As I recall, my kit came with a grommet for the wire.

 

The grommet just fill in the hole left by the bakelite insulator, or just protect the wires from the edges of the distributor?

By the way- i found a replacement insulator if anyone needs them:

http://www.steinertractor.com/ABC500-delco-distributor-terminal-insulator-square-shoulder

Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

I just used a regular wire & filled the hole with RTV silicone.

Just don't leave it open as dirt & water will get inside the distributor.

Also the wire will chafe on the metal hole.

 

I am going to try and cut the bolt out, but i think that insulator is going to break apart when i do.


Sent from my SCH-I535 using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

It's probably not such a good insulator as you think, all covered in metal oxides from the old metal touching it, it might be practically a semiconductor.

Is your car a 6 volt BTW?

 

No- its 12v

Sent from my SCH-I535 using H.A.M.B. mobile app

 

Look at the ballast resistor. Should be on the firewall for Fords, but I dunno about the stovebolt Chevys at all. The Chevy may have a resistor wire in the loom instead. It'll be fatter & look different than the regular wires.)

Anyhow, that resistor cuts your ignition voltage down after the engine starts & you release the key. This preserves the points.

When the resistor goes bad the car won't stay running.

 

As Ulu said, look for ballast resistor. If it doesn't have one, get one, as straight 12 volts will fry the points in no time.

 

It was pitch black and raining when I got home, so did not get a chance to check for it. Is that resistor needed for the electronic ignition conversion as well?

Finally got space cleared in my shop for it... just have to get it cranked to get it in.

 

I don't know about your system, but ballast disappeared when electronic ignition became popular.

The ballast is in the running circuit but not in the starting circuit.

So starting, you get full voltage to the ignition, but when running the ballast reduces voltage by about half, to preserve the points.

Electronic ignition, having no points, doesn't have this issue at all.

 

Alright- thanks!

I just got the Pertronix Ignitor in saturday... apparently they split the shipping into different boxes, so still waiting on the coil and new plug wires. Should have them in the next few days. I was planning to clean up the old distributor this past weekend, but was in the low 50's and wet. So I know the paint would not dry very quickly. So worked on getting my wheels ready for powdercoat.

 

Electronic ignition is in and she fires up! Pics and more detail when i am done adjusting carb idle.

Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

rebuild the stocker and put in trunk when the pertronix burns up.

 

There ya go! Glad you got her back to life. Another HAMB miracle!

 

Thanks! It feels good to have her running again for sure!

Ok- first note: the igniter 1168ls doesnt have a magnet sleeve, which made me start checking to see where i dropped it. Instructions clearly say the ls models dont use magnet sleeves.

So i take out the condenser, points, and old coil. The clean out the inside of the dizzy as best i could with contact cleaner. Then had to bust the insulator out with a screwdriver to get some kleins in to cut the bolt(rusted nut). With everything out- i mounted the new coil. I had to modify the mount to fit the new flamethrower coil. Not pretty, but functional for testing. The mounted the igniter and ran the wires with supplied grommet. I left the wires uncut- just crimped my connector on the end while testing. No ballast resister in my system either by the way.

After everything gets connected, i jump in and turn the key.... and a faint click... battery is dead. So pull out the batrery charger and set to engine start and turn key... fires right off with a couple of pumps of the throttle.

Now my battery is charging and i have something else to get straight: the first thing i did is rebuild the carb. Now it runs as long as my foot is on throttle. Take it off and she dies. Posdibly from the weak battery? Was hard to get it cranked then run around and adjust idle before it died. So that may be it too. I have a new remote starter switch, but didnt think about it since it came in with the rest of this ignition stuff yesterday. Any thoughts about the low idle?



Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

And it isnt letting me post the pics... here is another try.

Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

***uming you adjusted the valves for proper lash, adjust the timing, then adjust the idle set screw on the carb linkage after it's warmed up. Make sure the choke opens upon warm-up too.

When you have time, ditch those crimp connectors. Use soldered connectors instead.

 

Have not adjusted valves or timing. Found this in the shop manual to try tomorrow with the battery hot again... are you talking about the idle adjustment screw- or the throttle stop screw that hits the fast idle cam?

I plan to trim the wires and route them cleaner and solder them when i have more time. Hopefully this weekend.


*edit: my plugs are still set at .035 and read sonewhere that they should be changed to .040... is this true?


Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

I dont know why its not letting me post pictures. Trying again for shop manual info:

Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!

 

Points ignition is .035.

 

Just talked to Carl at Pertronix. He said they recommend going to .045 with the new 3.0 Ohm Flame Thrower coil.

If using the stock coil it is suggested to stay at .035

 

got the idle working last night. Still have an issue when she chokes and hesitates if you punch on it rather than ease into it. Maybe need a little more fine tuning?

Have some OT stuff to do this weekend, so doubt I will get to do anything to her. I do alot of favor vs favor swapping. My wheels are at the shop waiting to be powder coated for one of these favors. Now I have some that are being called in this weekend.

I did take her for a spin around the block and other than the not shifting into high gear and suspension making it feel like driving a brick... went smoothly haha. I got back and checked all my gaskets and carb had no leaks, so new gaskets are sealing nicely.

I have noticed two canisters under the hood- one is oil filter I am pretty sure... the other is... power steering maybe?

Old pic from when I first got her, but only shot with both canisters.

 

There you go - Pertronix Ignitor is the way to go.
I had both of mine for over 15 years combined and never a problem.
I am using .042 gaps and solid core spark plug wires with NOS AC resistor spark plugs.

I had a Rochester B carb once that had the same symptoms.
The accelerator pump spring was too short/weak and squirted too much gas.
Replaced it with a longer spring from a spare carb and problem was solved.

The RochB accelerator valve is vacuum operated, so the spring needs to match the engine to work properly at part or wide open throttle.
If the spring is too weak it will open too wide, too soon and flood the intake, giving too rich gas mixture and the engine hesitates/stumbles until it can recover.

Also check for vacuum leaks at the vacuum advance.