Projects The bucket of ugly! A de-uglifying thread...

Ahhh, that's nothin'! You should come down to South Phoenix one of these days when we go to Pete's for fish and chips...

 

Nice 'stache!


jerry

 

My silliness knows no bounds, as you well know.

 

Been over a week of silence, Is it orange now?

 

Nope, had to put the paint deal off... The good news though is that "endlessearth" has his truck back and is happy as a clam! I have spent the last 5 days louvering stuff like maniac trying to catch up. If my luck holds, tomorrow will be my first official day off in about three months! If it does indeed hold, I'll get my shocks done tomorrow, and my front tires balanced so I can finish sorting this front end once and for all. We'll see...

 

Happy as TWO clams!

 

Hey, Chip;

"brought to you by the letters G and T... The formative consonants in the term Gin and Tonic, nature's most healthful drink. I look at it this way - Because of the quinine content there is absolutely no chance of me EVER contracting malaria. It's lime content also protects against scurvy! How could you ask for anything more!!! Did I mention it was warm in these here parts today?"

I suppose I should mention, to help you feel better, that on Tues & Wed, we (about 40 mi north of St. Paul) got ~ 16" of wet, heavy, snow. Temps ~ low 30's. White miserable **** from hell, indeed. It'll be here for a bit, too, although the temps will get better soon. Don't drink much, but hopefully, the Perfect Margaritas I like, (w/ *lots* of Key Lime Juice) have *some* redeeming value... besides tasting good... . Although I could live w/o the effects of the alcohol - which I don't like. I still can't believe that you don't have an insulated garage w/an air conditioner!!!! .

Marcus...

 

nrgwizard,

Went to dinner with my family tonight at the Royal Palms here in town. They had the misters cruisin' away when we came in at about 5, as it had been about 96 or so all day, and it was a perfect 85 when we sat around the fountains on the patio. The purpose behind this dinner was a farewell to my aunt and uncle who are heading back to St. Paul early next week. He was telling me about the snow, and showed me a picture of his brother's property in North Branch, and almost as much snow as January! As is tradition, we had to snap a picture of him and I in the perfection we were sitting in and send it to said brother in North Branch.... The message that came back ALMOST made me forget that his brother is a preacher!!! Guess you folks up there have had enough!!!

Now, if ya ever get out here, hit me up and I'll take ya to a joint that makes without doubt the best Margaritas on this planet... And nope, no A/C for the shop. Just grew up that way and kinda tough when it comes to heat - 'till about August 21st or so when it has been 100 or much more 24/7 for about two months.

 

Well there you go then!

 

I hope I'm not hi-jacking, but today, I got to look at a gennie T up close. I was cruisin' the Heights area of Houston and came upon a gennie Model T parked in front of a law office or realators (forget which one). It seemed like a picture pic op.



I was marveling at the differences and actually smiled quite a bit. But then I noticed the seating position in the original T.



Does this explain why some guys made their seats so high in their T Buckets? Were they just following the original seating position? All these years, when I've seen T Buckets with the seat so high, I figured they did it for the leg room, not a nod to originality. When I was building mine, I set my seat high and it was comfortable, but it looked dangerously close to spilling me out, if I ever took a sharp turn. So, I lowered it as much as I could.

With the seat in the original position, a persons knees wouldn't be bent like they are in most T Buckets. But again, it looks like you'd fall out at the first turn. Any thoughts?

We now continue to Louvers thread.

 

I have surmised the same on several occasions! I think possibly just copying the factory stuff was the quick way, so do it. Later, I'm pretty sure the tall-in-the-saddle thing was more intentional though, as lots of the early sixties cars seemed to have very minimal interiors that you sat down in.

 

But also look at how the steering column sits so far back. This would dictate sitting high so that the steering wheel would be properly placed.

 

As crazy as this will probably sound, when I had made my seat at that height, it would have been more comfortable than it is at present. I fit my T Bucket fine, but I'm flexible and don't have a gut. I've gotten used to it. If I gain some weight and get creaking joints in my older years, I could ALMOST see raising the seat to about this height. The steering column would lengthen to accommodate that position. I'd also add a door. Seat belts would be a MUST, but by then, I'll probably be driving at normal speeds.

The down side to the stock seating position is, it looks like you're sitting ON the car, instead of in it. And that's just not acceptable for a hot rod that is capable of going faster than stock. Never the less, I now understand where those guys are coming from comfort wise. The stock position makes good sense.

 

Nice work on the friction shocks! Are they on yet?

 

Not quite yet. I used Ronnie's counter sink yesterday (cause mine is now an item formerly known as a countersink...) to do the number on the mounting holes and pin holes. I'm heading out in the next few minutes to help a new Phoenix transplant Nitrobrother, who's Model "A" I thoroughly incapacitated on the hot rod 100 last weekend, get that running again, then if there is any energy or day left I'll work on those and shoot a bunch of pictures. If not, I think I will work on my stuff tomorrow instead of the planned louvering hell that holidays usually bring.

I did finally get the front tires on this thing balanced correctly yesterday... DAMN! What a difference!!! I buzzed it up the I-17 last night, and all but at about 70 or so it's smooth as silk. Back to the tire shop Monday and re-try the left front and I think I'll be there.

 

I've never been a fan of friction shocks!,so fail too understand why guys keep making them. They didn't work well then or now. But as for design just for looks your's are looking like a nicely made design wise at lest. If it were me I'd have some back up tube shock ready to go later after having your fun fighting with friction shocks!

 

Fred, can you imagine how silly one would look with the tall windshields if they sat low and only looking through the bottom 12 inches. JW

 

Hey, Chip;

Someday, I'd like to take you up on that offer... .

I live in North Branch - I can relate to "the I hate the f'n snow" mentality. . Snow is only good when lightly falling on Christmas Eve, & New Years Eve, & in pictures - where I'm *not*! .

Rather funny response, I think most preacher-types are rather well-versed in "choice" words. .

I get the deal of no ac in the gar, as I don't have it either, & don't use it in the house, but there are a few days when it's nice to have.

Take care.

Marcus...

 

Yup. That tall seat would damn near dictate the entire look of the car.

 

On the contrary, I have made and used several sets of friction shocks over the years, and very much prefer them to tube shocks on these cars. I have yet to find a tube shock that I felt was valved lightly enough to let everything work very well. That includes having a couple of sets custom made for me by Bilstein. With the spring tension being variable, as well as the friction material being variable, (I've used both leather and rubber) I find that I can really tune the action and it doesn't try to over ride the actual suspension movement as a heavily valved (for the application) shock does. I'll get these on and play a bit and write a very subjective write up about them.

 

Thats interesting!
I've been working at the back of mine making some big changes and haven't got to the front yet, but one of the changes I had planned up front was to replace the friction shock setup.
I'm still not pleased with them being mounted off the lower spring clamping plate and thus close to the midline of the car, but I think I will wait for your write up before I write them off!
I DO like how they kind of vanish visually compared to tube shocks.
Looking forward to the info!

 

Friction shock were state of the art for race cars from the teens all the way up into the forties. Their use wasn't dictated by simply, "that's what there was", because hydraulic lever shocks and even tube shocks have been with us almost as long. No, they were used because you can tailor them to the car they are going on and the purpose they are being used for almost magically. Just a change of friction material can soften of stiffen the action quickly, and the same can be done via a heavier or lighter spring.

For friction material, I have used leather and rubber in mine over the years both to good effect. I have also seen clutch and brake friction lining used, cork, even linoleum. As far as spring, the sky is the limit. I have always used valve springs in my setups, but I would love to find a source for the scalloped Bellville springs used in early friction shocks to experiment with them. Especially on this car where space is at a premium.

Now, there is a few types on the market that make very little sense to me. A number of sources sell a cast aluminum based unit that is ***y as all get out, but relies strictly on bolt tension to provide any friction qualities. You tighten it down once, drive the car around the block, they loosen back up and do nothing. The good news though, is that with a longer stud, some friction material and a spring, they can be made to work quite well as I have done with friends cars in the past.

 

Reminds me of a conversation I had with Von Franko in the early '90s when both of our roadsters were just built. I mentioned my chromed used swap meet front shocks were pretty much worn out. Didn't have much left in them. He said that is what Ts needed and worked better with worn front shocks. I tend to agree with him.

 

Try mcmaster carr under wave washers.

 

Ya, tried that one already. The Bellville's I'm referring too are the deeply scalloped type that you see in real vintage friction shocks. Got to admit though, your response sent me back to McMaster-Carr's catalog!

 

Do you mean something like you can get from these suppliers ?

http://www.schnorr.com/?gclid=CPrRuMS48L0CFYdlfgodI1oAWw

http://www.keybellevilles.com/belleville_springs.html

Maybe not, I think they produce mostly industrial stuff although they may have something that could be made to work ?
Or maybe they could make something ?

 

Could be, but the links you put up are just telling me they sell Bellville and disc springs. I'll try again tomorrow and really see if I can find out if they have what I need. Thank you for the link.

 

These are cool...

Steve

 

Those are cool!!! I never though about looking to foreign car stuff as a source...

 

I had them my first time around and liked them. They seemed to do what they were supposed to. I switched to a conventional front shock because I could afford a good set up and they looked cooler.