Elephant question-One bite at a time! You're moving right along,Ben.If you want to box the frame, I have cardboard templates.I just lay them out on 3/16 flat stock, and cut them with my 41/2 " angle grinder with one of those cut-off wheels I gave you.Then I use a grinder to fine tune them.Any scrap that's left, cut into pieces 1 1/2 " wide X 4" long- tack weld these on edge inside the rails as a spacer, then you can use (lots of) 6" C clamps to hold the boxing plates in place.With those dimensions, it should leave a "shoulder" between the frame rail and boxing plate that you fill with weld, and grind down to a nice radius.Fine tune with an air angle grinder with Roloc discs. Like Mama's Pizza- Atsa nice! You can see one tack welded on the driver's side of this rust bucket I'm " rustoring". Also, to step the frame, a 45* cut, offset, then plated is an easy way- wheelbase stays stock.Once you start doing that sort of thing, remember those diagonal measurements!! (Taken many times)Keep up the good work ( and stay warm) Mike
Well, no video because YouTube screwed me up, but I rebuilt the carb. Kinda wierd how the carb is so simple and common, yet the aftermarket parts were not exactly the same... I also found that I have a zenith 2, and I need the choke rod part of the mech. I am getting the frame blasted this weekend. Until then, I have just been thinking of new things, and I found a good thread on how to lower the front end while keeping the stock brakes. http://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=12576 What I need to know is if I could run a two or three inch drop axle, a posies reverse eye with the three leaves out, and still run stock brakes. Also, what axle width should I look at?
Reverse eye spring & a 33 to 36 axle should get you down 3" ish. I still think that you should do juice brakes if you're gonna put some heat to that banger and plan to drive it around here. What wheel and tire combo do you want to run? I did a little research on running mechanical brakes though, this thread on Fordbarn was interesting. It's got a couple good options, the simplest of which to improve braking is to spend some money and get the cast iron drums for the stock A brakes. The other option that seemed somewhat popular for running later wheels & tires was to step up to 35/36 brakes in the front (which may end up cheaper). http://www.fordbarn.com/forum/showthread.php?t=52940
Well, the frame is off to blasting. Hopefully will get it by next Friday; if I am lucky. Now, I already shared this with Pat Manta, but this is what I am thinking. Overall process will cost me about 550 I believe, but this is what I am thinking for the frame. Also, what do people do when boxing with the middle cross member? I want to make sure no moisture can get into the inside of the frame; unless I should be making weep holes... Anywho, take a look. Now that I have your attention, what is the best way to go around making the holes? Right now the holes look good at 2.5 inches; but the die is 3.9 inches dia, and I don't know if it would fit in between the rails. I was just thinking of using bimetal hole saw bits, but I don't know how long they would last. Any tips would be appreciated.
Ben, I'm going to need to get mine blasted soon, where did you send yours? If your dimple die won't fit inside the rail, I'd be inclined to settle for drilling it rather than altering and potentially ruining my tool (those things are expensive). Save the idea for another build another time. If you obsess over this one detail, you'll find that you've spent too much time and thought on it when there are many other things you could have gotten done with that time. When it comes to drill bits of any kind, I've learned the hard way to always buy 2. Otherwise WHEN you break one, you're stuck until after you stop what you're doing and blow an hour of your working time going to the hardware store. I'd hit overlapping surfaces that are going to be welded on/near with some weld-thru primer then clean the exposed surfaces that are going to get the weld put to them. Weep holes are not a bad idea, IMO. I met a 4x4 guy who had a fully boxed frame in his 70's Jeep. He had bungs at the front and back which he used to fill the frame with used motor oil and then drain out the back. He also had sealed crossmembers that he used for air tanks. I thought that was pretty clever. It's probably not necessary or a good use of time on your build but I figured I'd share.
Great start on your project, my frame looked about as rough as yours when I started my project. The second one turned out to be worse when I got it sand blasted (not as cheap as you might think) and found my frame now sagged under its own weight. Bugger. quite a lot of what looked like dirt and rust turned into holes especially around the engine mounts where water often gets trapped. After a lot of searching for something local that would be useable I ended up keeping the cross members and buying a set of repop rails from Dagel's. They are made out of 3/16 steel so don't really need to be boxed which saved me a bit of cash and a lot of time (theoretically). I have all the original brackets so now I just have to drill the holes and rivet them back in the new rails. I'm in the process of making something flat and sturdy to jig everything for welding back together again. I know what you mean about keeping the original rails, they do look cool. Anyway, hope you find a solution that fits your requirements, good luck with your build!
Oh, for your frame notch I tried a slightly different approach to the Tardel book . As I had the frame apart I could use a chop saw to get the cuts even and used a piece of cut down rectangular tube for the kick Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
Thanks. I have not boxed or fish plated it yet. I think I will box it and build the brace to the rear cross member into the boxing plate Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
Where is the build thread? Maybe there is something the OP can use. Did you split your original frame, or is it repop rails? How much does repop rails cost? Compared to blasting? Is the OPs frame back from blasting? Looking foreword to update from him!
I had my frame blasted by Dave at Prep Rite up in Tewksbury (978 453 006) That set me back $220. New repop frame rails were about $450 plus the ride. They're made out of 3/16" rather than 1/8 like Henry made 'em. They are drilled for the body mounts with weld nuts but the rest of the holes are down to you. The frame I had sand blasted was the second I'd picked up only to find problems when I cleaned it up. Oh well, now I know what to look for, cracks in the spring pad in the front and rear cross member, rust through the engine mounts, stress cracks in the rails around the body mounts etc. Ford made more than 4 million of them so they are out there in good shape still, just not so much up here in the North East it turns out! i'm using Dagel's rails and Henry's cross members. I think it'll be pretty solid when its done (eventually) as I'm going to be running a 283 I thought I'd go with over engineering it.
I also went to prep rite. Seems like the place to go. If all goes smoothly, I am going to have it thermo sprayed with primer too. However, I am not going to z the frame; don't like the look or the thought of needing to mess with the length of the torque tube. One question I do have for everyone is what is needed engine wise to go higher compression, other than your obligatory chromoly studs? I was thinking that 5.5 compression should be good for me, but I want to keep it kinda period, so not really a Snyder head. I like winfield heads, but would kinda want a steel one and those are pricey... EDIT: also wanted to say the poor old man that ran Amherst nh swap meet died. We may no longer have a place to go
The Z only raises the spring mount to lower the car but does not change the wheelbase or the length of the torque tube. There are a number of different ways to accomplish this operation. One of them is to cut the frame rails diagonally, then stack the pieces and add gussets. It's been done this way since before God invented dirt. Simple and no cost. And since the body fits down over the Z it cannot be seen. The only visible evidence is that the crossmember sits higher in the trunk. Check it out.
Hey Ben, Your project is deja vu for me. My first car was a a slick little 31 tudor. Paid $250. Drove it as a Sr. in high school. Mechanical brakes were a riot! Of course, wish I still had it! That car influenced my life... learned history and how to use a few tools. Spring is on the way - any good swap meets in your area? Swaps are part of the adventure. You got the Tardel book so your'e on the way. Take plenty pics. Looks great - keep us updated...
Hey Ben, not sure if I showed you this or not, going back to your engine setup, but Lakeheaders.com (Gear Drive Speed & Custom, an Alliance Vendor) has a pretty cool setup for bangers.
I heard that police heads were not worth the effort however. What do I need to upgrade internally too, such as a cam? I love the look of the lakester headers. However, I like the sound of a double y header setup and I want to keep the hood on it. I was thinking of making a double y lakester header that dumped the exhaust at the base of the cowl. However, I was considering resonance issues, so I don't know what I am going to do. Once I get my frame back, I will see if I can z the frame. I am still not sold on it though. Still thinking of drilling and dimpling.
From who? They're generally less expensive to get a hold of and easier to find than an old aftermarket head and boost your compression from 4.2 :1 to 5.2 :1. There's one on eBay right now that hasn't broken the $150 mark yet. You can get a Winfield (repop I assume) for less than $400 (6.1, 6.5, 6.7, 7.1, & 8.4) from vintageford or Red's Headers or earlyfordstore, etc., so if you do opt for one to save $, make sure you don't spend close to $400 on it. Check the Alliance Vendors too. You will need to have a matched gasket for any head change. As for internals, anytime you increase the compression you're going to want to check for clearance. If you change the cam and head, you will very much need to. When you get the frame back, throw the front and rear end back under it and just look at it. If you can put the wheels (and tires) on it you want to use, that's the thing to do. Get your stance visualized. You can use wood blocks under bare wheels to simulate tire height OR you can make rounds out of 3/4" plywood in different W&T sizes you want to try. If you decide you want rake, you can always add more rubber on the rear or take it away on the front. Since you're only dropping your front axle 3", I'd imagine you don't need to kick up the rear of the frame. You should be able to just run a T spring and drop the rear down to match. I just asked @bgaro about how he set his spring up the other day on his build thread. If you want to get lower, ditch the 19" wheels and get some 16's so you can get your circumference under 28" and can run wider wheels & tires. The Model A wheels are only 3" and that limits you quite a bit. I did take a look around Coker and found what I think would be a cool Big & Little combo for the 19's though: Firestone Bias Ply Blackwall 500/600-19 (for the rear) Tread Width: 4.80, Overall Diameter: 32.00, Rim Width: 2.50 - 3.00 Firestone Blackwall - 475/500-19 (for the front) Tread Width: 3.90, Overall Diameter: 29.80, Rim Width: 2.50 - 3.00 That would give you about 2" of rubber rake and wider tires out back.
I actually have v8 wheels that came with the car, only have two 18 inch wheels. As for profile, I have been looking at photos and I love the stance of the "hell's messenger". I want that level suspension with a larger tire in the back. As for what I did today; not much. I did unpack the rear spring which involves some magic of sorts... You will never guess how I got off the main leaf before the rest...
Huge question: I was going to get tam to get some patch panels for me. Right now I am looking at rear patch between door opening and rear wheel well. Howell's makes some 12 inch patch panels, and I thought getting those would get me back to super solid metal. I called tams and he said that normally people only replace smaller panels. Looking at my first video or two, which size patch should I get; 6 or 12? Also, how good is a Howell panel? Thanks!
No "slats", juat no. What you described will make a major failure point in your frame. Just drill holes and put a mild sink in them before you box. After you box, run paint inside with ome of those snake tips. I'd ditch the cloth wire where you won't see it. I'd also just rewire and re socket those lights. Alternately, I may have a pair of bulbs that fit in my sell pile. Try to knock the pins out ofthe brake rod ends but if they don't move with a little heat, drill them.
Decided to just leave the brakes in there and just have the hole line up on it. Then it will just weld above and below the line and it will look good. Those brass things are never going to move... More on to my current project... Nothing six hours can't handle...
Nothing new from me due to it still being freezing, but I do come armed with a question! I am going to a swap meet tomorrow and I am looking for some cheap treads so I can wheel things around easily, as well as just looking at dash panels. I have not seen anyone ask the question, so here it is. Is there any way to run a closed cab dash panel 32 style while keeping the original fuel tank location? I love the shape and aesthetic of the 32 dash, but really don't want to move my gas tank. Any ideas?
The 32 style dash they make for the A doesn't rely on that tunnel bracket thing the 32 has to my knowledge. Should be fine.
nice build ben, i hope you don't mind my 2 cents. first, ask around for parts. mike has a bunch but he also knows many people within a half hour drive. example: i have a nice center crossmember that i would have given you so you wouldn't need to repair yours for 6 hrs. second, swap meets. april 11 or 12 @ new england dragway, april 19 @ fitchburg airport (a must), may 2and3 @ xfinity ctr mansfield. also up in arundel maine every other sunday starting soon. third, have fun and build it the way you want. enjoy see you around, ron
You should definitely hit Fitchburg, Ben. It sounds like a bunch of HAMBers are going. I'm setting up a table there myself. I hear there's going to be lots of Model A stuff there. It'd be good to go to make contacts even if you're not buying. How was the Swap & Sell, btw?
Ben: I was wondering about you the other day, glad your still after it. I suppose winter has slowed a bunch of guys down, its been really bad in some areas. Tim
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