1930s Era Champ Car - new project

Moving on back to the front nosepiece hoop I got the hoop mounts tacked in place. My plans are to add sleeves where the attaching bolts pass through the 1" square hoop to keep it from collapsing. I turned four sleeves then made a wooden positioning jig to precisely locate both tabs the same amount off the front crossmember and tacked them in place. Next I'll drill and sleeve and trim the hoop.

You may be wondering why I am seemingly jumping all over this build. It is because I want to get as many parts tacked in place before I disassemble things to hold a several day TIGFest where I'll finish weld as much as I can.

 

Drilled and reamed the hoop for bushings. Installed and trimmed to length.

 

Its time to make radiator mounts. I'm going to try to do this and leave room for a possible fan, fan shroud, and oil cooler. There's lots of room under the nose piece for this stuff. The mounts will tie together the sides of the hoop and have provisions to pass wires and brake lines neatly through. I started with a pattern that fits over the hoop and located the holes for radiator attachment. News Flash: The radiator holes were not symmetrical so the pattern will help insure a precise fit.


Note how the placement of the mounting holes in the tabs is not the same side-to-side.

 

I made extensions to move the radiator forward of the hoop...

then welded them to the hoop using the rad template to align everything.

 

The top rad tabs needed trimming as expected.

Then weld nuts were added and the radiator is installed. That's how to make a free-standing nose piece support and radiator support.

At least that's the way we do it on Planet FRENCHTOWN.

 

There is one aspect of the steering I have been losing sleep over for about - oh, maybe, the last three years or so, ever since reading the thread "COWL STEERING - JUST STOP"

https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/cowl-steering-just-stop.1101046/

posting, and that is the length of the drag link. I know it should be shorter and lower to minimize bump steer. I am thinking of breaking it up in two and putting an idler arm midway, just above the hair pin rear attachment point. That would mean boring and sleeveing the left frame rail for the idler arm pivot bushing.

And yet...

...I see other cars of that era with exactly the same one piece drag ling cowl steering. Did they bump steer horribly and did the drivers just learn to drive through it, or was it just not a big problem? I may just hedge my bets and add the frame bushing but try out the car as-is with a one piece drag link. That way if I do need to convert it to a two-piece link the hard part of modifying the frame will be done. Making a two piece drag link and an idler arm is relatively trivial especially if the car is already painted at that point. Of course I'll be left with an ugly hole in the frame if I leave it one piece.



BTW, I just love the leather hood retention straps and hope to mimic them.

 

My feeling on the matter is that the bump steer on your design would be minimal and to just learn to deal with it. If the car is going to be driven aggressively on dirt you probably won't notice it at all and even on pavement it shouldn't be a problem. Look at old movies of the drivers "sawing the wheel". Just part of the experience of driving an old car.

 

That is kinda how I view it 64 DODGE 440. Not optimal. But not life threatening if you get familiar with the car and its idiosyncrasies.

I've seen some FEDs with a long drag link that wobbles up and down like a base violin string as they go down the drag strip. Most later cars got two piece drag links to stop that.

 

Had a '41 Mercury 4 door that had the front end raised up with a high arch spring. If you pushed it hard in a lumpy corner it would wander a bit but if you knew what to expect and drove it as needed, it would do just fine.
Seems like many older cars had some bump steer built in them and you just learned to deal with it.

 

My HA/GR has cowl steering with a drag link mid way along the chassis. It was mainly done to change the steering direction of the cowl steering. At just shy of 100 m.p.h it steers straight as, at return road speed it picks up every dip in the road. The front end is quarter elliptic with 7 degrees king pin incline and the rear end is solid mount.

 

I placed the nosepiece over the support hoop. I want the bottom of it to cover up the center of the axle. I'll notch it to clear the front crossmember, but it still needs to go lower.


I used an Ingersol Rand nibbler to cut out clearance for the crossmember. I have a love/hate relationship with the nibbler. It is great for making sweeping cuts and tight radii in sheet metal with no distortion. But it makes a mess with little crescent moon shaped slivers that end up everywhere -
in my drag slicks
in my bike tires
in the soles of my shoes
in my wife's sandals
in my thumbs.
A magnet held nearby the cutter helps but I do not recommend one of these tools unless you have a magnetic broom.

 

Handy tool, but they do make a mess.

 

Those tools would be good for trimming my old person toenails.
Nice work on that front end.

 

This idea is actually from early 50s Frank Kurtis Indy roadsters, so you could say it was done originally by Miller or Dusenberg.

Kurtis put a vertical shaft near the front axle inside the frame with the lower end having a bell crank sticking forward, and the upper bell crank sticking out to the side. The lower arm had a cross link attaching to the spindle on the opposite side like using cross steering in a 36 or newer Ford or as hot rodders do with Vega boxes. The upper arm attached to the long drag link from the steering box. As the long link doesn't have to accomodate any arc travel, no bump steer. Well minimal like a cross steer car would have.

I made acrude sketch of the idea andit is in that thread on cowl steering...just stop near the end of the thread. I'd post it here but can't find it! I hate computers...

 

Yup. They are also really good for chopping tops when you are removing metal in sweeping arcs and around curves like rear windows.

Saw it Dave, and the animation posted there too. That is what caused my insomnia on the subject. If I do a two-piece drag link it would have to be with a horizontal idler axis to keep clear of the hair pins.

 

EEeeeeew!

And thanks.
The grille opening will get further definition of the shape and along with lowering the bottom I'll make a stainless insert with vertical bars. I made a stone guard for the original Whippet shaped nose years ago and I'd like to use it too in front of the grille. Sorta like this midget that belonged to a friend (R.I.P. Roy).

 

The nose opening was opened further to within about 1/4" of net shape. I have decided to add a tunnel inside of the nosepiece extending rearward a few inches. It will stiffen up the opening making it easier for the grille to conform. The grill would then need to be affixed using rivnuts. I'll make a wooden buck to form the tunnel which will flare outward at the back.


Instead of a dead perch I will be using a Panhard bar to locate the front axle. It will make the car better suited to driving on the street. I tacked in the bar mounting bracket. The other end attaches to the shackle bolt on the batwing.

 

This wood buck will help me form the opening tunnel insert. The insert flares outward a little toward the rear so a little bit of shrinking will be needed. The tunnel may even help with the cooling.
I made a paper pattern for the metal blank.

 

After staring at the front opening I decided it was a teeny bit too big. So as much as I didn't want to, I made a sliver like patch to bring it back into proportion. Then I cut, rolled and beaded the tunnel pieces into their rough shape. Additional minor massaging is needed before welding into the nose.

 

The nose tunnel got tack welded in. I need to trim the outer edge to the contour of the nose, and edge weld it in.

 

BTW, while getting a drag car ready for a nostalgia race (Thompson Gasser Reunion) I discovered a crack in the header primary pipe pictured above. Add that to my list of TIG jobs.

 

I finish welded the tunnel in. I left about a two-metal-thickness piece of metal sticking out to make it easier to weld with a minimum of welding rod. Boy, that really stiffened up the front of that nose. Warpage was minimal - nothing a skim coat of filler won't cure. I look forward to building the grill - after the chin piece is made and welded in on the lower edge of the nose.

 

That's really turning into a nice looking nose.

 

Thank you 64.
Reinstalled on the chassis

 

TIGweek continues with the finish welds on the front hoop.

 

While my attention is turned to the radiator I decided to look at the thermostat housing. A stock one rises vertically out of the head. I need one that makes a right hand turn to keep the hood line clean. So I fabbed a plate to bolt to the head and hold a 'stat. I need to find a right angle aluminum bend of 1.75" O.D. I'll save boring out the middle of the plate until I find a bend so I can bore it for a tight fit prior to welding.

 

Here you go:

Aluminum Elbows: 90 Degree Mandrel Bend 6061 Aluminum Tubing (verociousmotorsports.com)

Verocious 90 Degree Mandrel Bends, 6061 Aluminum - Mill Finish
Part # : 0906116
Price : $30.10

Other sizes available

*

 

Thanks Mike. Now that I know they are available I'll look around locally and do some comparison shopping.

Boy, that tubing bead roller looks handy. I need one. Maybe I'll make one.
I wonder if I can just make up a set of tiny dies to use on my sheet metal bead roller? Hmmm

 

The idler arm like you are thinking will work. We did it on the dirt modifieds back in the 70s just like you said. Our frames at the time had a 2x4 main rail down low and typically 1.5 od tube upper rails roughly 12 to 15 inches higher. And the 3 or 4 bar front ends usually mounted just in front of the headers to a square tube vertical in the chassis. So in effect the lower 2x4 frame rail was about 8 inches below the center of the front axle. So putting a pivot boss thru the frame with an arm sticking straight up worked real good to break up the drag link and align the pivot points. On one car the pivot pont was about 3 inches in front of the 4 bar mounts, which gave the same arc radius when we put it all together. Another car, we lined the split link point up with the rear of the 3 bar left side link. Same result arc radius was essentially the same for both the axle linkage and the steering linkage.

So long story short, put the pivot point in. If you decide you cannot live with the bump steer, add the arm. To hide the pivot make a gizmotchet that fits thru the pivot tube and hold it in with round head brass screws, and make up a story about it being an old speed secret!

 

Thank you Dave. I think I will do just as you suggest. It sounds like you nailed the ideal bump steer solution if I am picturing it in my head correctly. I'll probably sink a 1" I.D. tube through the frame and cover it over with a polished aluminum plug if I decide not to use it. Maybe even add a bogus "zerk" fitting in it to add to the bewilderment LOL.