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1930s Era Champ Car - new project

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER, Nov 20, 2007.

?

Another question: Posi or non-posi?

Poll closed Aug 18, 2021.
  1. Posi for two-wheel traction

    100.0%
  2. No Posi for better handling in the corners.

    0 vote(s)
    0.0%
  1. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    As previously mentioned I went to HF and bought a 4-pack of their foam floor mats to set in my seat pan. I cut one out to fit, either under the upholstery or inserted into it.
    TECH TIP: This material may make a good foundation for any hot rod seat that does not have room for a spring assembly under the upholstery e.g., a roadster or coupe or race car.

    seat 04.JPG

    seat 05.JPG
     
  2. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    I think I want to use an air cleaner. At first I thought a couple of individual 4" elements like are found on tri-powers, but the filter medium is awful small for an engine this big. The early '80s Ford Escorts had an oval air filter element and that looks like it can be made to work. I'll make the housing can from stainless steel sheet. To make the base plate of the housing I smeared a little grease mixed with graphite powder on to the carb openings, then bolted a sheet of aluminum over the openings and tapped on it with a mallet to get an exact impression of the carb placement. I'm waiting for the filter element to show up so I can hammer-form the top and bottom. Stay tuned...

    carbs 01.JPG
     
  3. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 3,354

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    There you go again with tips to plaigerize! I'd be out there before seeing this with a ruler, and other implements, then cardboard, and finally actually make the part, only to have to alter it slightly and make a 2nd, or possibly 3rd. Simple, elegant, intelligent, practical...

    Back of hand to forehead
     
  4. ratrodrodder
    Joined: Feb 19, 2008
    Posts: 414

    ratrodrodder
    Member
    from Boston

    Don't worry, you'll get it one of these days! And then try to remember it all so you can teach it to me, as I'll have forgotten that I read it here in the first place. :D
     
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  5. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Monday morning, and my air filter hasn't arrived. So I decided to take a chance and make the stainless steel tray anyway, using dimensions I got off the internet. After all its the internet, so it must be true. I scrounged through my scrap metal pile and found a billet pulley that was the same diameter as the listed dimension for the filter. I made a plywood clamp of the same size as the tray to use as a hammerform along with the pulley. Then I cut out the metal, leaving a generous 1/4" extra around the perimeter, to fold over into a lip.
    Just as I was finishing up the delivery man arrived with the filter element. I crossed my fingers as I held it up to the tray for a fit check. Perfect! with enough extra space to make a stone guard screen from expaanded metal or such.

    carbs 02.JPG carbs 03.JPG carbs 04.JPG I folded up the sides in a brake. carbs 05.JPG carbs 06.JPG
    I trued up the edges with a "ring dolly". carbs 6.5.JPG carbs 07.JPG carbs 08.JPG carbs 09.JPG carbs 10.JPG
     
    Last edited: Sep 11, 2023
  6. spanners
    Joined: Feb 24, 2009
    Posts: 2,197

    spanners
    Member

    You never cease to amaze me with your skill to nut things out get it done.
     
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  7. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Now the outside cover... pretty much a lather-rinse-repeat of the inside. I need to find a couple of pretty (metric) wing nuts to hold things together. Did I mention these Japanese copies of SU carbs are metric? Nothing interchanges with the old SUs. At least I found rebuild kits for them.

    carbs 12.JPG carbs 13.JPG
     
    HJmaniac and jaracer like this.
  8. ratrodrodder
    Joined: Feb 19, 2008
    Posts: 414

    ratrodrodder
    Member
    from Boston

    Nice and shiny! I like the trick of using the press to hold everything in alignment while you're folding over the lip.
     
  9. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Thanks. If the pulley hole was in the same place as the carb holes it would have been possible to thru-bolt everything together, but they weren't.
     
  10. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    I took a week off from working on the champ car to attend the NHRA Div 3 e.t.finals at Indy. I kept my 20+ year streak alive by not winning again this year. Lost 3rd round of the Friday bonus race when I took a nap. Lost first round of the big race when I cut a .009 reaction time, only to be bested by his .007/dead-on-w/a one!

    Here are couple of pics. Enjoy. Now back to the champ car. My trans guy said my linkage is out and ready for me to modify. Good thing too as my bud broke my roadster pickup trans last weekend at a local nostalgia race so I can drop that Powerglide off when I go to pick up the C4 linkage. Hey, its only money.
    And time.
    Too much time...

    Here's some cropped HAMB friendly pics of my '23T:

    INDY 23 04.jpeg INDY 23 08.jpeg
     
  11. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    I visited my transmission guys and picked up the shifter sector shaft which I subsequently welded up with the new lever, and also welded up a new planetary gearset case for my Powerglide repairs, which I will deliver to them in a few days to finish up the champ car C4 and the Family Truckster 'Glide.

    transmission 03.JPG transmission 04.JPG
     
    Last edited: Sep 23, 2023
  12. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Not much new to report except both transmissions are in the shop for build up.
    I also started to prep a new inline racing block by grinding the exterior smooth. Then file off the sharp corners, then bottom tap all the holes.
     
  13. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 3,354

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Hey it's progress. Don't beat yourself up about it...

    Let us do it for you!
     
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  14. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    I found a very rare Ford 300 racing block. It will find its way into a 300 buildup with an equally rare one piece cast iron crossflow head.

    Some folks port and polish the insides of their engine. I do the outsides.

    block xflo 02.JPG lol
    block xflo 01.JPG
     
    Last edited: Feb 11, 2025
  15. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 3,354

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    And you're going to paint it? It's so shiny! Clear coat it!
     
  16. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Paint outside.
    Glyptal on the inside.

    I already bathed in Metal Prep. No longer shiny, but rust resistant over the long haul.
     
    Dave G in Gansevoort likes this.
  17. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 3,354

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    What's your favorite engine color? We were partial to Cat yellow. Yellow motors scream!
     

    Attached Files:

  18. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    .
    I've done everything from Basic Black to T*tty P*nk.
    In every case they were "almost enough" power.
     

    Attached Files:

  19. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 3,354

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Thank god I'm color blind at the blue end of the spectrum. I couldn't tell you what the color of the 3rd engine pictured is even if you held a gun up to my head! The flames look neat!

    So a six cylinder question for you: what is/are the best years to look for a 300 Ford six? Not asking for me, asking for a nephew. No really, I am...

    Best year(s) for heads, blocks? He's not after killer power. At least I don't think he is...
     
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  20. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Well, according to my niece, and the www.fordsix.com website blocks are virtually all the same from '65 through the nineties, with a few minor differences. Before '87 they were carbed. EFI heads can be retrofitted to HAMB friendly carb(s) and ignition. Best to look at that website lest we get into O/T territory non HAMB related.
     
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  21. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    My trans guys got back to me with news. Not good.
    My C4 trans case is corroded at the band piston bore and it is beyond repair. It must have been submerged in water at some point. Maybe a hurricane victim? So a new C4 case is needed. Fortunately, they have a used C4 case that can be used to bring my tranny back to life. Pitty, since I had ground all the casting flash off the old one and drilled and tapped the case for studs to hold the shifter consolette. I'll have to do that to the new case when I get it back. I will also add a drain plug and a pan magnet, as well as crafting a new dipstick.
    Patiently waiting...
     
    Last edited: Oct 6, 2023
  22. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 3,354

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    Well, look at the brighter side: the case is clean and empty. Ready for mockup duty...
     
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  23. ratrodrodder
    Joined: Feb 19, 2008
    Posts: 414

    ratrodrodder
    Member
    from Boston

    Correct, not killer power, just frame twisting torque up to around 5k rpm...
     
  24. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    I got my transmissions back from Accurate Transmission. Once again they did an excellent job. They even modified the shift lever I provided them because it needed additional clearance to work. In addition to using a new case they added a neutral / backup switch and supplied me with special 90* fittings for the trans cooler lines to make it easier to package the cooling lines around the gas pedal. Very pleased.
    I had to re-drill and tap the case and make new mounting studs for the shifter console. Then I finessed the shift linkage so I can cycle the shifter through the gears to correctly set up the reverse lockout. It shifts like a hot knife thru butta.

    When the trans is back in the car I'll have to make cooler lines and make a dipstick tube assembly.
    shifter 33.JPG shifter 34.JPG shifter 35.JPG shifter 36.JPG shifter 37.JPG shifter 38.JPG
     
  25. Man how did I miss this….nice work and very cool project
     
    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER likes this.
  26. AmishMike
    Joined: Mar 27, 2014
    Posts: 1,286

    AmishMike
    Member

    So the little ball on right in pics ( spring loaded ? ) snaps to left prevented shift into neutral, reverse & park? Am I seeing it correctly?
     
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  27. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Almost correct. The shifter will move through 1-2-3-N before the lever bumps up against the retractable rod, preventing the shifter from being shifted into R or P. To engage R or P it is necessary to lift the spring loaded knob up and slide to the right to allow the shift lever to move rearward.
     
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  28. AmishMike
    Joined: Mar 27, 2014
    Posts: 1,286

    AmishMike
    Member

    Got it thanks. Guess u not drag racing so going to n would be ok. But then why bother with reverse lock out at all?
     
  29. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    When I'm in the car on the track and suited up with driving gloves and arm restraints it is not impossible to accidentally nudge the shifter into reverse if it gets snagged. Shifting to neutral while drifting into turn one is one thing; shifting into reverse is quite another. Could end badly.

    In addition, it may be advantageous to shift the trans into neutral - while sitting in traffic for example.
     
    Last edited: Oct 14, 2023
    lurker mick and AmishMike like this.
  30. THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Joined: Jun 6, 2007
    Posts: 5,935

    THE FRENCHTOWN FLYER
    Member
    from FRENCHTOWN

    Wrapping up some simple detalis on the transmission.
    I made a dipstick and a dipstick tube and a dipstick tube hold down clamp. In addition I fitted up two special fittings the transmission shop gave me for the cooler lines. They are right angle fittings that are indexable. They will be useful to keep the cooler lines out of the way of the gas pedal and throttle linkage.

    transmission 05.JPG transmission 06.JPG transmission 07.JPG transmission 08.JPG
     

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