1954 Chevy Car. Mustang 2 Install help needed

I got a phone call from Michael at No Limit and he has made me feel much more comfrotable with some of my concerns.
The first picture in my post is absolutely correct. NOT ALL of the holes are suppose to have matching holes on the frame. So the way I have it pictured is correct.

I am going to do***ent everything I do from here on out and maybe NO Limit can use it as an instruction manual until they get one of their own completed.

When I had emailed No Limit Months ago (probably 3) they said the truck install was the same for the car. So, that's why i was following the truck install. This is only partially true.

Once I get the crossmember in the correct location. I am sure the bag mounts will be in the proper location as well. I will take pictures to update once I have things together.

Thank you everyone for your help. I should be ready to rock and roll now!

The gap is INDEED NORMAL. Once the frame warms up from a little bit of welding, I should be able to smash down that gap more.

The 18-3/8in measurement is not relevant to the car installation, it is onyl for the truck.

 

By the way. this is one of my favorite post on this entire board!

 

You might do some checking but I have always been told that you shouldn't weld the lower cross member in a Chevy frame. That is why most of the major manufactures have the bolt in lower cross members. TCI, Heidts, Ch***is Engineering and etc. They say it is ok to weld the upper hat in though. Not sure why but that is what they say.

 

Took some components to my uncles CNC machine shop and used his heavy duty sand blast cabinet to clean these parts up. Nice and clean ready for paint. If these parts wouldn't corrode in their natural finish I would leave them looking like this. It looks so nice... I bought stainless 5/16 bolts, washer and nuts to resecure this radiator support to the frame.

I used the bolt holes that are on the crossmember and align with the holes on the frame. These were the red circled holes in some of my previous pictures. I just eye balled the Bag mount location aligning the notches. I will be more precise when I actually do all my fitment and location.

Another shot of the cross member located. Again, this was all a trail fitment to see how everythign was going to look when positioned. I am going to hold the fender up to see if the wheel will end up centered.

The bolts that hold the cross member are only used temporarily. The bag mounts won't currently fit with the bolts holding the crossmember. But, that is why you position the crossmember, weld it in THEN, locate the bag mount.


Another shot of how the bag mount will align with the crossmember. Notice how the curve cut into the side plate of the bag mount matches the curvature fo the frame with a little clearance. This is how you know you have the correct side bag mount on the matching side of the frame.


This shot is used to show how the bag mount sits up against the frame.



One question I do have is: Where should I measure from to make sure that the crossmember is "square"? Can I measure to the front of the frame rail? Or the center of that bumper mount bolt hole?

Also,
Do those of you with a V8 swap run the Walton Fabrication Motor mount? Sounds like a nice piece. It mounts in the same location as the factory mount then you weld in for extra support.

 

I would measure from the front of frame rails on a diagonal back to the crossmember and check for square. Then maybe a long measurment to back or frame rails. Pull as many forward and back measurment as you can. I also found more pics of my front end during ***embley if you need them.
My C.E. set up had the motormounts already installed..cant help u there.

 

Good to see you got things straight, I had the best luck going off of the bumper holes on my install.

Kent

 

Before I final weld everything I would like someone to check my work. Everything is tacked, but I can grind the tacks if I need to fix anything.
The first few pictures are the driver side of the car.

Do I have the correct Uopper control arm on the correct side of the car? Is there even a left and right Upper control arm? Maybe they are the same identical piece?


At first I had the wrong lower control arm on this side of the car. I realized this when I noticed that the holes for the airbag were not aligning with the holes on the control arm to mount the air bag. So, I swapped the lower control arm and it seems correct now.


Here is another view of the p***enger side setup. Do I have the correct bag mount, Upper arm, lower arm on the driver side? Is the bag mount on the correct side?


I know in this picture it looks like the notches are not correctly aligned, but they are. The angle of the picture makes them look like they are not. But, this picture was to demonstrate the bottom of the bag mount curve matching the curve of the frame. Is this the correct bag mount?


I am ***uming these tabs are for the top shock mount correct? My plan to determine the position fo rthis piece is: mount the shock to the lower control arm, then move the control arm until this piece perpedicularly mounts to the frame.


This picture is to show the bag mounts with the crossmember. Just to check the orientation of everything. Does everything look good?


If all is well I am going to call a Pro welder that I know to get everything welded properly. I can probably weld all this myself, but being that this is a structural piece I want to be safe and use someone who has much more experience than I.

 

The last 2 photos did not show, It all seems to be working...the mount for the upper control arms is unlike any other I have seen being sideways...camber adjustment will be interesting, shims im ***uming? The upper arms can be similarbut the bottoms are side for side. Make sure you have full turn on your steering while figuring out your shock mounts...so your tires dont rub on anything...mine is tight thats why I say this.

 

That is one hell of a gap to fill with weld, especially since the frame is much thinner than the new crossmember. Looks like a real nice kit, but why not curve that just a tad, if they intend the kit to be a weld in?

 

Once I start welding and get some heat into the frame. I'm gonna hammer it down to help fill the gap. That should help.
But I do agree with you.

I wish No Limit would chime in here or finish their instruction manual pretty quick so I can verify that I have done everything correctly.

I shot Michael another email and haven't heard back. I'm going to have to call again, the next chance I get.

 

First, I would like to apologize for not checking the website periodically. Second, I would like to let everyone know that my duties at No Limit include: every aspect of this business.
My ***le here is parts production manager. I'm responsible for keeping the shelves full of the parts that you guys might be ordering.
-I have to order all the material for all of our parts, as well as cut, notch, bend, and weld all of our parts.
I have to program the flow jet for new parts that we are research and developing.
I work on projects; and I also try and help anyone that stops by, calls, or sends an email.
Unfortunatly, I am not sitting at a desk in front of a computer to check the forums every ten minutes because I have other responsibilities. So I try my hardest to make all of the parts for the thousands of customers that we have and at 4 o clock I will check the web forums.
If I dont post everyday I'm sorry.
For example, last night I had a customer drive all the way from Arizona just to check out the shop and look at one of our custom ch***is that we build. Did I mention I build ch***is from scratch whenever I'm not on the phone or fabing other parts. The customer showed up at 4.30 and I answered all of his questions and gave him a tour of the building. He left at 6 pm. So i did not have time to check the Four different web forums that we regularly check. I'm sorry I didnt check them when I got home.
I cooked and ate dinner and then I worked on my 41 International pickup project. The only time i have to work on my own stuff is after work. I also enjoy working on my truck more than i enjoy web forums. So you probly wont catch me on the forum after 6 o clock. Again I'm sorry.
If anyone has any questions you can call me at No Limit from 8-5 and I'd be glad to answer any of your questions.

 

I'm sorry I don't have better instructions for this kit. I Just got off the phone with a guy that is going to make a DVD for the instructions. I should have the DVD available within a couple of months.


WCRIOT your question regarding the Walton motor mounts. They work great with a stock suspension. They bolt in and then you weld them to the side of the frame. They do not work with our front suspension. The steering shaft coming from the rack going to the column will hit the Walton motor mounts. Another reason I don't like to use them is the way they are designed. If I had two five gallon buckets filled with water and I picked them up I could probably hold them for close to an hour without setting them down. If I took those same buckets and lifted them up so my arms were parellell to the ground I could probably only hold them for a minute. That tells me that things suspended in mid air dont have anything to support them so over time they may start to bend towards the ground, meaning your motor will start to sag and stress the side of the frame they are welded to. I prefer motor mounts that are placed directly under the motor to eliminate any chance of sagging.

No Limit offers motor mounts that are a direct weld on to our crossmember. They position the motor far enough back that you still have room for a radiator and fan shroud ***y. I use our motor mounts with a walton trans crossmember. The trans crossmember needs to be modified slightly. We moved our motor back as far as possible using a stock firewall. Waltons was to far forward for our taste so we modify the trans crossmember to pull the motor back a little farther. Again this is so we have enough room for a radiator and fan ***y.

 

WCRIOT Everything looks great in the pictures. The upper arms are identical so there are no left and rights. The lower arms are different side to side. The shock mount goes to the back of the arm. Again in the pictures everything looks great and you do have all the correct pieces.

To install the Shock mounts you will simply bolt they shock to the lower arm. Bolt the upper shock mounts to the shock. Thick leg in front and thin leg in the back. This will place the shock at a slight angle. Swing shock up to frame so upper shock mounts rest comfortably. Tack them in place and stroke a arm just to double check. We designed the shock to bottom out just after the suspension stops articulating. So you should have an 1/8 to 1/4 inch of shock shaft showing with the suspension laid out. If you have any questions or concerns with this please call or wait patiently for me to reply on the forum.

 

TCI says it's 16" from front bumper mount hole to axle center line.

​

 

CHEV54 Most GM cars from 1970 to the late 1990's use a shim style alignment. The reason we use a shim style is because over the last 25 years we have had hundreds of cars and trucks with alignment issues. 90 percent of the issues start out something like this. A guy comes in and says hey I just had my car aligned last week and it drove great but all of a sudden it wants to pull to one side, so I took it back to the alignment shop and they said it needs to be aligned because one of the arms moved in the slotted alignment hole. The customer will usually try this a few times but hes back at the alignment shop once a month because every time he hits a bump or railroad track the 4,000 pound car decides to push that arm farther into the slot. You could put a washer under the arm, have it aligned, and then weld the washer to the slotted hole so that it never moves again. What? Weld on my freshly powder coated ch***is? Never.

We never want a customer to experience that problem so we use a shim style adjustment. Now some of you will think that might not be enough adjustment. GM had no problems aligning there front suspensions because they were so accurate with there suspension design they only needed a little bit of adjustment. Here at no limit we have done our homework and the suspension is so close to perfect we only need a small amount of adjustment.

I never understood why you would need an adjustable arm. If you built the arm correctly the first time you would not need bushing adjusters on the arms or two slotted holes in the upper mount to achieve alignment.

 

Ok im not sure what gap your looking at. The one I see is thinner than the material were welding. I actually took a tape measure to the computer screen and I measured one of the welds on the no limit upper mount It measures a quarter inch wide on my screen. If you measure the gap in the ch***is the gap is 1/32 of an inch. This tells me that my weld is about four times wider than the gap you are trying to weld. Any PROfessional welder should have NO problem welding that gap. If they do there not a pro. Also you can start to weld the parts that dont have gaps. This will create heat. By the time you get to the gap it should be warm enough (heated from the welding) that you could clamp it with a vise grip to close the gap, and then proceed to weld up.

I would like to curve the plate but my bandsaw does not cut curved shapes. I would have to cut the crossmember spacer with a curve on top so the curved plate would weld to the spacer with no gap. Also its not that big of a gap. Weld it up.

 

Heres a car that we just finished up. Its a 51 chevy with our front and rear suspension This is a coilover setup with an Ls2. I have a ton more pictures im just not good with the computer. I will try to post more pics later. I also have some of a 53 chevy with our air bag suspension front and back. I will try to post more pictures today or tomorrow. Unfortunatly i just sat at this computer for like 3 hours and i got nothing done today. Im tired of looking at the screen. I need to go build something. later guys have fun talk to you tomorrow.

 

sorry i forgot the pics

 

Great idea..it makes alot of sense actually, I just have not seen the average bolt/weld in front ends designed like that...thats why I ***umed you shimmed the mounts to get em rite! And I here ya on keeping them inline, I think I jus delt with a bit of the same. Either way its a pretty clean and good looking kit! Sounds like you keep yourself busy..thats a good thing in this economy...best a luck to ya!

 

CHEVY54 Is that your car in your avatar. If it is I would like to give you props on building a pretty sinister looking car. Youve got the right chop and the right stance. Looks great. Happy cruising.

 

Thanx Mike...yes, me and a few good (talented) buddys of mine back in the Northeast and 5 yrs of time created it ...now Im rollin it out here in Sunny SoCal....well maybe after this week! Funny Sinister is the nickname we all joked about!!

 

ive got the No Limit kit on mine... was a super easy install... people were great over there.. especially Michael... i refer them all the time...

 

Thanks for the positive feedback. Micheal does a great job and is very helpfull to our customers. I'm glad WCRiot is on the right track. As for MKilger, he holds a grudge against us. I had to evict him some years ago for not paying his rent. 4 months of freeloading is long enough. Too bad he has to poison the forum with this ****. Thanks for all your support, and have a great Christmas, and New Years.

 

This is the low profile lock nut that I have used for the steering rach mount. Is this the correct nut and bolt?

Again, This is the powersteering mounts that I used. Bolt with washer. Correct?

Here is what the steering rack looks like hung on the cross member. It's going to be interesting how I get the steering rack to mate with my original steering column.
Is this the correct orientation for the shock? The reason I ask will be pictured below and I will go into more detail.

Here's the thing that is confusing me. If my orientation of the shock is correct in the picture above. The thru holes on the top of the shock is much smaller than the bolt that goes into the weld on tabs. There were no bushings or adapters included, so I'm confused as to what is going on here?

Here is another picture demonstrating the bolt that fits nicely in those upper shock mounts and the hole on the upper side of the shock.
Dust seal orientation correct? This seems like the only way it will fit. but I would like to confirm all this.


The rotor already had the bearing races pressed into it. So, my plan is to disregard the bushign races that came with the bearing kits and only use the needle bearings from the kit. This is pretty straight forward and I can manage. I probably need to buy a bearing insertion tool though.


Here's the real kicker. The holes on the caliper don't match the holes on the upright. I don't know what I am missing here? how the hell is this suppose to mount to the upright?


Here is another picture to demonstrate the issue I am having here. How is this caliper suppose to mount to the upright I have?


If I flip the shock upside down. Then that small bolt hole will have another large screw that mounts to the lower control arm. Again, I don't see how this would work. Even if I used a smaller bolt, there is no bushing or adapter to make this work.


Should I have a washer between the rubber bushing on the A arm and the crossmember?

Don't know what these are for? Factory extra? HAHA

 

1. the rack mount bushing goes 'IN' from the 'back' side of the rack, so that the shoulder of the bushing is in between the rack and the mount. Oil the bushings and they slide right in. The nut is correct, but the washer should be a large, USS, washer.
2. The shock is correct. If you push the bushing out of the top, the I.D. will be 5/8, and fit the bolt nicely. You have the correct orientation.
3. The races do NOT need to be changed. Just pack the bearings with grease and install. the grease seale will tap in with a flat plate, or you can get a seal install tool. (small hammer and patients works every time.)
4. No washers go between the arm and crossmember. Just tighten the crossbolt to 60 ft/lb. on final install.
5. OK, this ones on us. Those are not the correct caliper. OOPS. give us a call and we will arange return/replacement with the correct parts.
6. Hey, looks like extra upper shock bolts. Merry Christmas. lol.

 

do you guys use dropped s10 spindles in your kits?

 

1. Great I kind of thought so about the bushings. I will find the correct washer.

2. I will bring the shock to my work and use their press. You are obviously referring to pressing that METAL bushing out and leaving the rubber bushing in there.

3. If my seal is orientated correctly I am pretty confident that I can get it to install completely without destroying it. The bearings are suppose to be a little bit of a tight fit on the spindle correct? They don't just slide right onto the spindle. Which again makes sense to me.

4. Good to know. Thanks. makes more sense since it is such a tight fit.

5. I will call you guys tomorrow when I get the calipers boxed and ready to exchange. I hope the rotors are correct!!!

6. Thanks for the Xmas present.

Oh by the way. I never got the bolts/washer to secure the bags to the control arms. I bought grade 8, 3/8-16 3/4" long bolts with split washers. I had to run a 3/8-16 tap into the 3 holes that are on the bags.

I will post progress updates tomorrow or friday once i have everything completely mocked up.

Thanks No Limit for the help. I'm eventually going to create an instruction manual and post it on the hamb and Ill email you a copy from all the lessons I have learned while doing this install.

I'm happy with the product.

 

#1 The meal sleeve needs to be pushed out but leave the rubber one in place. A vice and two sockets will push that out no problem but a press is even better.

#2 Yes the seal is in the correct orientation. When installing wipe the seal and the seal surface with grease.

#3 The bearings do fit a little tight. I have found in the shop if you take a red scotch pad and buff the spindle spudd intill the black coating is removed the bearings go on much easier. covering the spindle spud with grease will also help them slide on. We bought 5,000 pair of those spindles. The first 3,000 worked great but for some reason the last batch of spindles are a little tight.

#4 S-10 spindles look very simular but they are a hybrid spindle. We are using the mustang geometry and ball joint tapers but instead of a ford spud we opted to use a GM spud so that you dont need special bearings and race adapters to put a gm rotor on our mustang spindle. Since we put the GM spud in there why not also include the GM caliper mount that is one piece. Verses the bolt on caliper mount that every other mustang II kit uses. So we have made a spindle that will out brake our compe***ors and replacement parts are easier to get.

#5 Im sorry you had to run a tap into the bag. Ive never had that problem and as soon as i finish this post I will go check the bags and make sure they dont all have the same problem. Thank you for bringing that to my attention.

Its cold outside and welding sounds warm and fuzzy right now.

 

I pressed those metal bushings out of the rubber bushing on the top of the shock. Those came out super easy.

I also put the brake calipers in the mail today. Fedex ground should get them there in 3 business days.
It's holiday time at most business but, lets see how fast No Limit gets the correct calipers shipped back to me? Not, that I need them too quickly...

 

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~*******Subscribed*******~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~