File a lien, charge real money. That would run closer to 10K in most shops, maybe more. At $45 per hour, a 40 hour week is $1800
NO WAY GREG??? posession is nine tenths of the law. Keep that thing untill you get it settled! I did that once and it worked... I got paid. The cops couldnt take it because it was on private property. Tuck
Sounds like you need a HAMB thrash, and take it APART, then tell the guy to come get it! That might be fun, but reality says file the lien if you want the money.
correct me if i am wrong but if you file for a lien on it and he doenst pay within a certain time then you will be able to legally own his car
Tell ya what..I will send a check fer 5 k and that will be your money. BUDDY..I have a 32 pickup with your name ALL over it....your work is drop dead killer.....like Tuck sez..possesion is nine-tenths of the law...tell the "owner" to cough up a little more than $500.00 bucks......... when can I send the transport?
yes i did....i told him $18 an hour plus material...but when ever i got any money , it went for MATERIAL!...i kept thinking that i'll just keep plugging away on it,between other projects , it will come in the end......
The way I see it you are in***led to the amount you two agreed apon. If there was no houlrly amount agreed on,or a set price for what you have done thus far shame on you. But from the work I've seen from you on here and the amount of experiance you seemt o have I think this might not be the case. But you really didn't say either. bottom line is you do still have the car. ANd is does look sweet. I'm sure will give you what he owes you. Oh and I'm sure you work too cheep I know I do
Sorry man, $18 an hour is ********. The guy that came and replaced my folks hot-tub power cord gets $75 per hour. You are already workig cheap. STICK HIM FOR THE FULL AMOUNT at $18 an hour, then raise your prices!!!!!!!!!!
So, give him an itemized list of what he still owes you for the materials then. You do have reciepts, don't you?
That would be criminal if he gets that car back for that kind of money. Did you have an hourly rate set when you started the work? Did you keep track your hours? If so your on solid ground to keep the car until the bill is satisfied. If you didn't do those things and "sorta, kinda took the job on with no clear parameters you might be screwed. Did you mention a "ball park figure" to him when he dropped the car off? If you did and that's what he is going on, good luck getting any more money out of him. If any of the above are true, this might get chalked up a learning experience. Truely a sad conclusion. Frank
Interesting post. Without really knowing how this business relationship started and what financial parameters were set to build the car, it looks like the car owner is telling you what YOU should charge him. I hate guys like that. Don't turn the car over to him until a fair and equitable(for you) payment is agreed on and the bill is paid for in advance. Then figure out what went wrong and draw up a better way of doing buisness on future builds. Good luck and your work looks killer. Joel
yeah , i know it's my fault....but,i did tell him what things will cost..and i did keep VERY accurate records i normally get a substancial payment dowm to work with, i didn't in this case i usaually don't do it this way..i just didn't keep him up to date on his payments..i was using it as filler work....live and learn anyway , it was a fun project , and i did get me to meet someone who wants me to build a `32 ford 3 window..i can't mention his name here..you would know him...AND the budget will be a bit higher here's a shot of the dash..i think it came out nice
Sounds like the guy was a friend (or at least good acquaintance), and you took the project on the side to help him out and get some extra money for yourself--zero problem with that. Remind him you agreed on $18 an hour, show him what he's paid, and whip out those meticulous records! Show him he's got his materials covered, but still owes you for the labor. He's going to *****, there's no way around it. Work it out with him and then send him on his way. Before you talk to him, stash the car somewhere else, and don't have the discussion with him inside your shop--he'll go off the deep end when you start talking about giving him a deadline to get the money together and then sees "his" car isn't on your property. Get that car out of your shop immediately--even if that means hauling it 8 hours to your in-laws (I don't think I'd cross a state line with it, though--then if things don't go your way, it could get really ugly). If the guy is a friend, you're gonna lose him. But friends don't cheap out on a bill and have a car completely built for less than 2grand, including wiring, plumbing, fab, paint, sound deadener and you know better than us all the other stuff you did... If the guy's at***ude really goes south on you, stick it in a rental storage unit, and charge him the storage fee. -Brad
I am sure you know this, after reading all the posts, however, the most buisness way is to get a deposit up front. work from that until it is exhausted, then, prior to more work or parts, ask the owner for additional up front money. Keep accurate hourly charges, material and parts costs, then you are working on his money and not yours. You get paid or work halts.The car DOES NOT leave your shop until all charges have been paid. In this case, it is my suggestion that early tomorrow, you should file a mechanics lien on the car just to protect your interests. If your customer is an alright guy, he will come to terms on payment. Another person I know had a similar situation. He asked for payment, gots lots of excuses, and finally let the guy have the car. When asked why, he said "If he can live with it, I can, too" I have had work done on the 62 in that format, and the welding on the frame and suspension for my 47 is being done the same way. I like it that way, keeps me and the mechannic both honest. And, in the end, we will still be friends. Jim
$18 an hour!!!!??? boy have i got some work for you!! i could sit back and do nothing and still make money. ...you need to raise your rates holmes! i would'nt let that car go anywhere, and i would seriously concider stashing it somewhere where he can't find it. a storage unit would be my choice and add the storage to his bill. he'll pay up... i'd apply for the mechanics lien IMMEDIATELY. even if you THINK this will come to a conclusion soon. cover your ***. if you did'nt cover your *** in the first place and actually discuss the price, yada yada yada, then i'd tear that sum***** ALL the way apart, push the pieces into the driveway and tell him it is outside waiting for him. even if you did'nt discuss the price, or an hourly rate, in the begining he is obviously trying to screw you. thats no friend i care to have and nobody i'd care to do business with again. and he deserves the inconvienence of having it torn down to it's basic pieces and the added cost of having someone else (who we hope charges him HUGE money) put it back together. if you put the lien on it and he don't pay, you own it. i'd be hoping he does'nt pay.
Down here in Texas I ran into a simular situation.I was brought a chopped 30 model A that was an old rod that was found in a back lot of a business. The guy acted like he was Daddy Warbucks and money was no object.When it came time to settle up, he acted as if I were some sort of a damn charity. Point is... I learned not to agree verbally when It comes to any business. Always no matter what have them sign a contract that way if they pull any of that **** you are that much better off to take legal action.
This is why sometimes I hate working on other peoples cars. Guys watch these stupid cable shows and think we can build hot rods from scratch in half an hour. If you told him $18 an hour and kept great records then sit down tonight,add up what he owes.Do a really nice job on the bill/invoice. Go to his place and present it to him.Tell him for sure he is to pay you in full before the car leaves.CASH only. If he *****es do the lien thing but first I'd go home and take the grill,wheels and other spensive chit off the car.Take the parts to your neighbors,brothers,friends or whatever. I had a friend that I clipped his truck for him.He asked me if I could put motor mounts and trans x-member in it for him too.He shows up to get the truck.I say you owe me x-amount of dollars extra for the motor and trans mounts.He goes balistic and tells me that hes not paying for the extra work.I tell him fine hes not getting the truck then.I'm standing on my floorjack waiting for him to buck up.The trucks on stands.Hes spazzing cuz I won't let him use the jack so he can take his truck.I tell him and his friend to get out of my shop.He won't leave.His friend knows I'm in the right.Finally the guy goes outside.I shut and lock the doors,light the torch and cut the motor mounts and trans x-member outa the truck.I let it off the stands,opened the doors and pushed it outside. He was ****ing spazzing.I told him he didn't want to pay for em so he wasn't getting em.I didn't even help him push it on the trailer. I charge $40 an hour plus materials at my shop and thats cheap.Some of my friends ***** when I tell em I can't give em a deal. This guy should have been paying you weekly or bi-weekly. A good customer/friend should be paying you regularily without you even having to ask for dough. I find even guys who believe to be carguys don't have a clue when it comes to building a car from scratch.They need to come to the shop and work on it for a day or two,then they'll clue in how many hours it takes. 36-3window,your hourly rate as of tomorrow morning should be $40/hour.Except for this guy......Shiny
Just stick a gl*** body on it and keep the steel...tell him its done and come pick it up. That should about make it even!!! ....Seriously, you have the upper hand...don't fold...make him pay what is fair, or don't give it back. I also agree about stashing the car somewhere else. Why be a "nice guy" to an obvious ***hole?
I have a handful of friends that build cars for a living.They all have stories of non-payment,slow payers and typical gold chainer a-holes.Some have even found themselves in court.A well known shop that I frequent had a customer that could not understand how his car became so expensive.The shop estimates their work at time and materials,with a ballpark finish price.This particular car had some changes made by the owner and suddenly the cost was about 20 grand higher.They offered him to come help do some work for a few days..he did and they were paid,no questions.Once someone actually understands the amount of work required,most will agree to pay.I agree that $18.00 an hour is wayyy too cheap.On average,most shops charge at least $50.00 an hour,and I know for a fact that Brizio charges $100.00 an hour.Let's face it,shops with employees that have more experience building cars actually are a better deal,as they already know how to to the job correctly in a shorter period of time.
The Jalopy Journal
