Cheers Andy. I may just see what can be made of it . Have you any experience of setting up the repro gear sets ? I have read elsewhere that the crown wheel carrier bearing needs a fair bit of shimming to have to set it correctly . Like wise the CW side bell had 1.67 mm of gasket shims . Ive never seen ore that 3 on the thin paper shims fitted on most of the ones ive done previously .. Im only talking about 6 in total so my experience isnt vast .. Thanks again.
Just a random thought here, but given the path the pinion gear set it looks obvious that the offset numbers of gaskets in the stacks (1.67mm ??!!?) on the face side of ring gear would have stopped ***embly right then and there. Should have, at least. Memory tells me that once 'colored in' (white lead, do you Scots use that?) the stacks of gaskets will be much closer to each other in thickness. THAT IS, IF the gear tolerances from this manufacturer are 'ballpark close' with total value from face-to-gear specs vs. the OEM gears from Ford. As Andy stated, I agree: The same gears can be adjusted properly, with the right contact path and wear in just right. I recall stacking and counting those paper 'shims', but NEVER something like 9 to 2. Usually 6 to 4, something like. Ratio of proportion is what I mean, sorry. Good luck, and 'Hoot Mon'!
Random thought. The early pinion bearings had a smaller od than the later ones. I would check to see if the conversion flange piece has a small enough ID to keep the pinion from moving out?
I have to admit, re using the scarred pinion is a revelation for me . Ive always thought that once the patth of the gears have took a set then thats it .. no going back there for a second chance . However If there is a chnce of them finding a new set or mesh then im willing to have a go .. My initail thought would be that afetr a short time the axle will need re adjusted once any unevenness from the initial incorrect mesh has worn in .. basically doing the job all over again in a few hundred miles time so your always chasing your tail . Im happy to take a chance if we cant sort some alternatives . Truth is the original plan was to fit a beefed up 40 rear end with 9 inch axles and bearing ends .. However , the purchase of the 40 rear axle , a freshen up, then the kit to convert to 9 inch bearing ends and splined axles was prohibitive at the time .. Now with the 34 axle rebuild on the cards my buddy has revisited the idea of the beefed up axle . However costing again has shown that the winters no change is fairly cost effective if he is considering the mods to a 40 . With tht in mind , offsetting the costs of a modified rebuilt rear, the winters does seem like a decent deal. shipping and duty might kill it stone dead .. but hes working on the numbers .. Regardless if he does bite on the winters we still need the car back on the road meantime . so we will visit the options
That crossed my mind. The open drive conversion is a speedway option and the open flange is probably a standard part across the early and late banjos.. I haven't checked, but I run through a couple of ideas to cover that eventuality . If it turns out to be bearing working its way out of the casing I thought about a spacer between the flange on the banjo and the open drive conversion flange ..a 4mm plate profiled to the shape of the flange, but with a centre hole size suitable to stop the bearing walking out of the banjo casing .. It did take a bit of a push from a 2 ton capacity bottle jack to push the pinion and bearing out of the casing but that was stone cold . with some heat in the casing , the pinion trying to ride out of mesh and the vibration on the overrun , there is a good chance that's going to vibrate the bearing out of the casing ??? Thing is my buddy said he pointd out the noise on the very first road test with the fella that did the work. If everything started well and set up properly the initial run in good mesh would be the one that would cause the pinion to walk out of mesh to a point where the contact was such that there wasnt suficient friction to allow it to walk any further ... Only the friction between the pinion bearing and the casing retained the pinion in its new position.. Good call .. there isn't anything I saw on the speedway flange that would act as a retainer for the bearing. worth further investigation .. If thats the case it might shed some light on an earlier issue . When the car came to me there was no rear suspension. I traced this to the prop being to long and not allowing any slip at the gearbox yolk. It was solid . and effectively locked the rear suspension. Removing the prop which meant levering it out of the rear UJ yolk released the tension in the drive train and allowed the rear suspension to work freely. I wonder if all these issues are connected .. sounds like it ..
The banjo gears do not wipe against each other like a hypoid. It is just a push contact like transmission gears. That why I think it will smooth itself out and live. Maybe you can get a flange inside diameter measurement of a 34 flange from a member here.
Unsure weather this will help, but their is someone on the nsra selling a complete 32 rear-end. I don't know weather they are the same. I think he is in London
Cheers Murf. I asked about that a couple of weeks ago in the hope it was an option, its a 4 cylinder one unfortunately . different banjo casing
A anticipated , the speedway open drive conversion lets the pinion bearing walk into a recess, unlike the 40 which covers the outer part of the bearing and holds it firmly in the banjo casing .. looks like a modification to the speedway parts is on the cards .. a weld at 12 , 3, 6 and 9 oclock and a dress up in the lathe should work fine .. pic 1 40 TT end ( left ) and Speedway open end conversion (right ) note flat face of 40 and recess on speedway pic 2 34 bearing sitting in the recess in the 34 open conversion this is exactly where it was sitting when I removed the conversion flange . There was a corresponding gap between the pinion gear and the pinion support bearing . Pic 3 40 pinion bearing in 40 banjo , note the bearing is flush with casing pic 4 view inside 40 TT to bearing, outer bearing diameter covered by TT holding bearing in place
We are looking at the pricing to procure and fit a winters No Change in the car , It ticks all the boxes my buddy had at the outset but his plan was to re jig a 40 casing to suit the Hot Rod Works late bearing and shaft conversion . However the cost of procuring the parts, machining costs, machinists reliability to do the job properly , was weighed against the cost of a winters NO CHANGE and it was stupid not to opt for the new axle which benefitted from all new gears and have a locker into the bargain. Im now tasked with putting together the spec for the rear end .. the amount of numbers to consider is giving me a headache .. add that to the options and it just escalates to a Migraine .. A stock winters comes as 56 inches flange to flange . We would prefer to retain the width of the present axle being 58 inches . The car will be running wires as it is now so the Lincoln brake option with bowling bros drums was optioned in. The good thing here is it keeps it simple and the drums don't increase the width . If we try to save a few pennies and opt for the Torino brakes , there is a saving, but we would required additional cost to add spacers to the flat drum face to support the wires . in which case a 56 wide axle would be fine but the brakes will look modern and the wheels will run on spacers Hmm nah He has also asked for a dual bolt pattern which isn't a problem .. Every change seems to incur a knock on effect To make things worse , Hot rod works do an axle end that will accommodate the big bearings and accept early ford brakes. This would be a great option if winters, when the made the axle to spec width, could fit the Hot Rod Works bearing ends to suit the early ford brakes we already have , We would then have the perfect axle and save the cost of the brakes and a chunk of shipping and duty too.. I need to lie down.. Any ***istance with specification would be graciously considered In the meantime, a rebuilt axle of appropriate spec will be put together to get this back on the road ASAP , why do I do this to myself ?
Your Winters setup will require all the bracketry too, so don’t forget that expense and time. I think the Lincoln brakes are a sure upgrade over Ford, but it might make you want to put them on the front of the car too.
The bracketry will be my responsibility the savings will be in the axle being virtually bomb proof and the justification being its what he wanted when he embarked on the journey .. The upset has been the number of issues with the car to get it to a reliable driving roadworthy standard .. Its just got a bit muddied along the way .. Perhaps an upgrade to F1 bendix brakes on the front and we can use all his current /old brake parts to juice his 3 window 34 .. yup seriously..
I ***ume the no-change will also require a closed drive conversion kit, or can you spec it with that from the start? The 10-spline kit for my QC was £385+vat!
Its open drive Mark. the 32 runs a T5 .. they only do the No Change in open drive so its fine . I think I have a good idea what will pan out but it doesn't hurt to cost it, the future beckons.
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