Well it's interesting. When I first start the car after sitting and take off, the trans shifts fine. First 5min or so, 1-2 shift is ok. Then it starts hanging up. Wondering if the fluid level is low and after it slings around in there something heats up enough not to work correctly. I noticed the fill plug in the trans was loose and weeping. I'll get some fluid and make sure it's topped up. Manual calls for SAE 90. That still recommended?
I have an idea you need G3 gear oil not the latest type G4 but don't remember for sure. I think the newest oils can attack the brass parts in older transmissions. Have asked about this on the AACA web site, will report back if I get a good answer. Trans plugs are usually standard pipe plugs, available at any hardware store. If you want to be pernickity you can use a bit of teflon pipe tape. The plug will seal better and come out easily next time you need to check the oil.
That is a sweetie, love the interior. They had style back then. I was reading thru your brake adjustment and you showed the book illustrating using a feeler gage, you spoke of giving that a try. Did you do so? Is it possible? Here's a '49 I'm working on, its a hoot.
Got this reply on the AACA for what it is worth: " For my money, 90 weight is fine. However, the transmission and overdrive (if any) should get straight mineral oil, now known as GL-1, available at NAPA. This is NOT EP (extreme pressure) gear oil. Post-war Willys owners manuals with Borg-Warner transmissions specifically stated to use "straight mineral oil" in transmissions and overdrives, not EP oils which were recommended for differentials. For the diff, use GL-4 EP oil, NOT GL-5 as commonly found almost exclusively in parts stores these days. GL-5 is recommended for anti-slip differentials. And never use GL-6 (synthetic) in any unit with yellow-metal components. I learned that the hard way...a major lube company Ph.D. chemist was WRONG."
By the way my service data book says use 70 gear oil in summer, 50 in winter. I guess this would be GL-1. Hypoid 90 recommended for rear axle, summer and winter. This suggests trans oil is different from differential, and is not hypoid type lube. Might as well drain and refill the trans, lube is supposed to be changed anyway.
I haven't done the feeler gauge method yet. It pulls a little when you first step on the brake pedal, but not too terrible. Great looking car!
My Owners Manual calls for 90w in warm weather and 80w in cold weather. So I can get Mobilgear 600XP 150 in 90W from McMaster Carr: http://www.mobil.com/USA-English/Lubes/PDS/GLXXENINDMOMobilgear_600_XP.aspx Suggestions?
Nevermind I just realized that the stuff from McMaster is EP, and the manual specifically states no EP oils. Probably just go with the straight 90 GL-1 from Napa or TSC. Just wish there was some from a more high quality manufacturer available. The guys on the bobistheoilguy forum also mentioned this Amsoil synthetic motorcycle oil that's specifically recommended as a replacement for SAE90 GL-1. Probably just stick with what the car was designed for like I did with engine oil. http://www.amsoil.com/shop/by-produ...anced-synthetic-motorcycle-oil/?code=MCVQT-EA
Don't overthink it. It's a low-tech manual trans in a '47 Nash and not really that demanding for lube requirements. The brand name is less important than making sure it's a mineral based lube and NOT a synthetic.
The cheap oil will be fine. If you are concerned you could add some Molyslip. Or just change it regularly as the book says.
Well it wasn't the fluid. Got the Napa 90W GL-1, and did a full fluid change. Not sure what was in there, but it smelled funny and dissimilar to the new oil, but didn't look all that dirty. Topped the trans up and went for a drive and it still doesn't want to shift 1-2 without double clutching. I'll go through and try to adjust the shifting rods next.
Been busy with work and family lately, but two of my wife's uncles have requested to come visit in a few weekends and ride in/drive their late father's car. Both of them are quite emotional over the fact that it's being cared for and loved again. I'll find time before then to inspect the shift linkages and re-adjust the brakes so the car doesn't pull when you hit the brakes like it does now. When I was under it changing the trans fluid, I noticed that one of the exhaust hangers was broken and that the exhaust system had a lot of play in it. I was able to source a NOS hanger from a Nash parts guru (Brent Havekost). He's the same guy who had the NOS water pump rebuild kit. Also, now that the lights are working, I couldn't help but snap a few pics in the dark last night. One thing I don't like is that the tail lights only serve as running lights and turn signals, and the signals are weak. The only brake light is in the center of the trunk lid. OK at night, but during the day, I really wish the tail lights had brake light functionality. A family member of mine is an electrical engineer and is working on LED boards that will fit inside the existing housings and function as running, brake, and turn signal lights. I'm excited to see the final product.
It is a simple matter to change the light sockets from single filament to dual filament bulbs, and wire the tail lights, brake lights and turn signals in the conventional manner. Check that someone didn't use 12v bulbs by mistake, that will make the lights very weak. You can brighten the lights by painting the reflectors with white paint. There are also brighter LED type 6v bulbs you can buy.
The "odd" smell of the old fluid may have been the result of someone filling it with rear axle "hypoid" rated lube. It has a distinctive, pungent smell right out of the bottle due to the additves it contains. A hypoid axle gear set requires lube with an EP (Extreme Pressure) additive. With a hypoid style gearset, the mesh between the pinion and ring gears is such that the load between gears attempts to "wipe" the lube from the faces of the gear teeth. The EP additives help to maintain lubrication on the contact area of the teeth. As mentioned in your owner's manual above, it's required in the rear axle but is NOT to be used in the manual transmisson. The trans likely has only spur and/or helical cut gears that don't require the extra EP additives. There's a chance that the extra lubrication provided by the EP additives was preventing the synchronizers from working properly. Too much "slippery" in the lube could prevent the blocker rings from getting a good grip on the hubs. I doubt it's done any real damage and by changing to a non-EP lube it may drive out of the problem after some gentle driving cycles and maybe another fluid change.
Hmmm... I had one just like yours in High School that I also bought from my Grandfather.. !! I always loved the button on the floor board (just like the dimmer switch) that changed the radio channels... Does yours have that ??? Nice car you have
Wow, I hope you're right. It definitely smelled like hypoid rear end gear lube. Good thing I bought enough of the mineral oil to do another fluid change. Thanks for the explaination!
So now that the car is running and driving, I figure I need a basic toolkit for the trunk. Things like spare bulbs, oil, spark plugs, SAE wrenches/sockets, and some basic tools. Thinking about what toolbox to use, I remembered that when we cleaned out my wife's grandfathers estate, I got his old toolbox and a few of his tools. Now that we have his car, it's perfectly fitting that we use his toolbox for the trunk! It's a well-worn old Made in USA Huot box. Looks right at home in the trunk wouldn't you say?
Your prognosis may be proving correct. I've driven the car 3 times since the fluid change, and each time the trans has shifted progressively better. Last night it only refused to go into 2nd once. I'll drive it a few more times and change the fluid again.
WOOOO HOOoooo!!!! If that fixes it I'm going to have to mark down this date on the calendar! Definitely give it a few more road trips before you do another drain and change. I think, ideally, you'll get better results if you can drive it enough to get the lube up to operating temperature for a spell. Take a 20 or 30 mile trip at 40 or 50 mph if you otherwise trust the car to not have any other problems. And draining the fluid hot might help get more of the old lube out. The old tool box looks right at home back there, and Huot tool stuff is a bit collectible. You need one of those old 1 gallon tin anti-freeze cans to go in the trunk with it too.
Ha! I've driven the car almost daily this week, and the transmission is definitely better. Still not perfect though. It almost feels like when I shift 1-2 and it won't go in like the clutch might still be engaged, I put it in neutral and push the clutch back in and you can feel it (or something) release, then it goes right in. It could be just the increase in use that's freed things up. I'm going to make sure that everything is lubed up and that there's not a grease zerk I'm missing, adjust the rods, and do another fluid change. In any event, it drives nice! Took it to work this morning. Car looks awesome sitting there in the parking lot...
How many miles does the car have? I don't know how long they tended to last, but maybe the synchronizers are starting to show their age from normal use. The hypoid/EP lube may have just magnified the issue a bit. You said the car had set in storage for a while. There may be a bit of rust and crud on the transmission input shaft splines that's not allowing the driven disc to move freely on the splines when the clutch is disengaged. Even though the pedal is fully depressed the disc may be just slightly dragging on the flywheel. Also, how's the clutch adjustment? There should be a little free play at the top of the pedal when your foot's off it. But if there's too much free play it may not allow the clutch to fully disengage when the pedal is pressed to the floor.
The car has probably 130k on it. Engine was replaced around 80k, but there's not a lot of definitive information. By "storage" I mean, the car bounced from non-climate controlled garage, to barn, back to drafty garage. I should go through the clutch and transmission adjustment procedure just for good measure.
Haven't posted updates in a while because I've just been enjoying driving this car. Yeah it leaks a little after being put back into service, and it's certainly not perfect. But it makes a great little driver and is surprisingly reliable. Starts every time, and actually gets really great gas mileage. Fall colors are in full effect, so I drove to a few local barns to snap some pictures.
Nice Simoniz job. Keep it waxed like that and the paint will last forever.Did it take much work to bring the finish up? They were a great family car. Nash was proud of their comfort, ride, and features like Weather Eye heating and ventilation, and coil spring seats. In addition to being a comfortable car, they were economical. Unusually light being one of the first cars with unit construction body and a small efficient engine that runs on low octane regular gas. The down side was they were never a performance car or speed demon's delight. But for having fun with your family, just about perfect. Hope you and your family had some nice times this summer.
Well I should've been typing this update in early spring, but other projects took over. We rented a large storage space to fit the Nash, one of my motorcycles, and all the parts I've accumulated in my basement shop. In November, I decided to take my '76 BMW R90 which was completely stripped down to a pile of parts and bolts and put it back together to ride in the spring. I got the stripper-model Stepside Chevy that I learned to drive on and subsequently went through the entire suspension lowering it 5" front and 6" rear. At which point my dad asked me if I wanted his old Jeep Cherokee (how do you turn down a free Jeep?), so I've been four wheeling like crazy this summer. But I managed to get the Nash back home from storage on what was one of the sketchiest drives I've ever taken in it. It was very difficult to revive, even after cleaning the points and using half a can of ether to get the engine to fire. Once I did manage to get it running, I decided to hurry up and drive it the 4mi home. It stalled three times in traffic, but I finally made it home. It's been really hard to keep running. After I start it, it would start running rough and eventually stall out while idling. I decided to go through the ignition in the hopes of making it easier to start and more reliable to drive. I purchased and installed a Pertronix ignition and coil, and installed it with a fresh set of plugs. I must say, not only was it incredibly simple to install, but the results were dramatic. The car starts up much easier, and runs extremely strong. I still get the odd pop-misfire at idle, but it revs easily and pulls strongly. Cliffs Notes: was a slacker, finally got Nash running after installing electronic ignition. BMW: Chevy: Bonus pic of Chevy after my late uncle purchased it new. Found this picture after he passed: Nash last fall: And the Nash at home: So over the winter, I tried to go to storage once a week and start the car, let it warm up to operating temperature, move it forward and backwards, and basically keep it running. That worked until it got really cold and the engine didn't want to start. Realizing that I still had the 30W oil in there, I stopped trying to start it. Based on advice from a few other old car owners I've talked to, I'm going to switch to a high-zinc 10W40 made by Lucas that's formulated for cars like this. Hopefully this will allow me to run it year round and not let it sit for any period of time unused.
Great family history. I hope your not running Ethanol. Really bad for carb. cars. If your using Ethanol be sure and change ALL rubber fuel hoses to fuel injected hose. Its @7.00-8.00/ft. but well worth it.
I try to run ethanol free from the local marina, but I have to fill up 5gal cans. My last fill up was traditional 93 octane. I have upgraded the rubber hoses, but still wish there was a station near to me that sold ethanol free.
Your bring it out of winter nap hassles might just have been old gas that went bad. The ethanol fuels do not store well. Good to see you getting more problems figured out and having fun with the old car.
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