1952-59 Ford 54 Customline Build Thread

Hope the wipers are working,50% chance of rain

 

So cruzin along down the road. Stop at the 1st rest area to check fluids and such. There was oil all over the top left side of my engine. I'm guessing valve cover gasket. It wasn't a lot of oil, but enough. So we cleaned it up and headed down the road. Pulled off at the next rest stop, about 30 miles down. Leaking again, so I tightened the the valve covers. I dropped my socket on the ground and when I went to pick it up, I noticed a puddle of oil under my car. My oil. So I got out the jack and jacked it up. Oil dripping from the bellhousing..... main seal is my guess on that one. Now I'm stucck here for 6 hours until my brother brings the trailer. Very very lame. But I guess I can align my drivers door an mess with the speedo cable. Its all about the journey right?

 

Major bummer...but I've been there. Glad to see that you're keeping a good sense of humor. Are you going to trailer the car to the event, or just get it back home?

Good luck!

 

Gonna trailer it there. Stay the weekend and then head home. Is it hard to replace the rear main? I've never done that before.

 

You have to drop the oil pan,NAPA may have a tool by Lisle for removing it and installing it without dropping the crank,the original rope seals ****ed and were always prone to leaking in a Y-block,Fel-Pro now has a neoprene seal that is a big improvement when you install it put a dab of RTV on the ends let it set up for 10 minutes and bolt it back up.Those rope seals coined the phrase" Old Fords don't leak they are just marking their spot"

 

So now that I'm home from the show, I've been thinking about what happened with my car on the way there. I am a complete *****. The whole thing was my fault. I blocked off that road draft tube.... and never installed a pcv valve. GENIUS RIGHT?! So all that pressure was building and building and pushed that oil right thru the seals. I'm gonna go buy a PCV valve tomorrow and install it. Hopefully that will fix it. Just have one question though. Do I get one with a hose that goes to the carb? Or can I just get one without?

Rocky

 

Complete *****? Naw, just a guy in a hurry, that's all.

There are a number of good threads on PCV systems, many of which I've contributed to. I'd suggest you do a search before you spend any $$$.

The idea is to vent the pressure buildup, as you say, but also to keep the engine clean by removing the combusion byproducts which include carbon and water vapor a**** others.

As I recall, raceron's Y-block has a very good PCV system on it, conceived and built by streetdreams as I recollect. There are many considerations when planning a PCV system, especially one for an engine type which never had one originally. This one's got 'em covered: Y-Block & Flathead Vent Tubes vs. Positive Crankcase Ventilation System

Okay, Ron, it's your turn to chime in here...

 

These are the pics I have showing how John installed the PCV on my 292:​

​

​

 

Ok, So the valley pan is the best way to go? It looks like a clean and simple install. Then a hose that goes into the baseplate or a fitting in the carb?

 

My oil cap has a tube in it. Can I just hook up a hose from there to the carb? Would that kinda be the same thing?

 

You'se gots ta have an innie place (where the clean air goes in) and an outie place (where the dirty air gets ****ed out). You can possibly use the oil cap tube (if the cap is otherwise sealed as per early Corvette fillers) as an outie place (if you use an early GM metered orifice-style PCV fitting or early GM screw-in valve under the carb), but then you gotsa ta find an innie place.

You've got to have a PCV valve of the proper size (capacity) to guard against blowing up the motor if you get a f**t back though the carburetor.

You've also got to be aware that the PCV vacuum fitting under the carb will amount to a vacuum leak - a big one! - and you'll need to compensate for it. If you're still running that Holley it's probably got a PCV intake port and may even be jetted to use it. If you're not sure, Holley has a very good tech department as well as on-line tech ***istance.

Probably better to have it like Ron's: The oil fill is the innie place, the PCV valve in the valley cover is the outie place. Best if the innie and the outie are on opposet sides, or ends, of the engine. Ron's is perfect.

He can probably give you the number of the PCV valve and grommet, and tell you how to compensate for the vacuum leak on an engine of this configuration if you use a manifold tap (a last resort as it must be done just right or it will draw from a single runner, as streetdreams says) or a plate under the carb. I've got the program down for Chevys, but not for Y-blocks.

 

This engine business hurts my brain. I'll talk to Ron about his and see what knowledge I can pick from his brain. Thanks for all your help!

 

No. There's a right way and a wrong way to do a PCV system on any engine. The fitting on the cap is for whats called a closure hose, which runs from the cap to the air cleaner. Its purpose is to re-introduce clean air back into the crankcase as it's purged by the PCV valve.
The best place to install the valve on a Y-Block is at the rear of the engine, into the valley cover. There is usually a stamped flat area there, or on TBird covers, a hole where the road draft tube attached.
If you have the cover off, I'd weld up a little cage on the inside of the cover to install some wire mesh to trap oil vapor, although if you can't, a longer tube going to the carb base will suffice to trap the oil and let it drain back to the engine. You need to put an approx. 1 inch diameter hole in the cover to install the rubber PCV valve grommet, or a fitting to attach a 3/8 in diameter rubber hose to. The valve should be close to the engine, and the length of rubber hose to the carb base should be higher than the valve to allow drainback.
You install the hose at the carb base to allow equal distribution of vapor to the cylinders, putting it in a fitting in one of the runners loads up single cylinders.
On a p*** car engine, remove the road draft tube from the front left of the engine and make a plate to block it off. Make sure your oil fill cap is the vented type with washable screen, and block the tube attachment you have on your oil fill cap. Use a PCV that you can reference to a similar size engine, like a 289/302 Ford, 283 Chevy, etc. A factory valve or style is best. The " universal" parts store ones sometimes flow to much or too little. You'll need to reset your idle mixture after installing any working system.
Basically, a properly working system allows for evacuation of combustion blowby and water vapor from the engine crankcase in a controlled manner, and allows for fresh, clean air to replace whats removed.

 

The more I think about this, the less I think the lack of a proper PCV system is your problem. If your oil fill tube is not blocked it's not likely that internal pressure caused your oil leaks. The oil fill tube would act as a road draft tube to vent pressure build-up. It might also vent oil fumes and such, but it would provide an outlet for any blow-by pressure. Just a thought.

 

Missysdad, thats what I was thinking. Thats the reason I never tried a PCV system. Streetdreams, thanks for all the info. Im starting to understand this all a little better the more I read about it. Gonna wait for Ron to get back to me on the parts he used. My daily ****ped out on me and I need this thing going asap. So I'm thinking of just reinstalling the road draft tube for now. Thanks again guys.

 

The road draft tube will work for now, but I would really update your engine with a good, functioning PCV system. Otherwise, you'll never clear the crankcase of water vapor, blowby g***es, etc. Not a good thing.

 

X2 ^^^ Streetdreams is 100% correct. My old blue shoebox had a stock flatty that ran good, but was packed full of gooey sludge from crankcase buildup. New oil would turn black in minutes. I don't think anything short of pulling the motor apart would get rid of that gunk. By evacuating the carbon and water vapor proactively, a PCV-equipped engine stays very clean throughout its service life.

 

Ron is gonna get me those part numbers tonight when he gets home from work. Then it will be my project for this weekend. I can not thank you guys enough. I threw the draft tube back on this morning. Didnt drive it to work today cuz I wanna take it around the block a few times and make sure its gonna be ok. I only work about 10 miles from home so its not that bad. Ive been contemplating upgrading to a 302 or 351. I have enough y block parts to sell off and maybe get a couple hundred bucks out of them. But I did just get brand new goodies for the y block and havent driven it much. Thinkin about driving it while building a newer engine. Again, thank you guys.

 

Yeah, my Y-block is set up for a pcv, only it goes into the intake opposed to the carb, it seems to work fine anyway.

Y-blocks are fun to look at, and fun to drive with if you can appreciate them, but a small block ford is a helluva lot quicker. If you're gonna look into engine swaps, may keep an eye out for a Fe. Just a suggestion, and with all that said my car will have a Y-block in it as long as I own it, they look neat and my car will never be a performer. Just depends on what you're after I guess?

 

Okay, the PCV Valve is Motorcraft # EV155. The grommet is kinda unclear; it's got the Ford Engineering prefix # E6DB on it so maybe a Dorman #42048 or 42049 would work (see link: http://rockauto.com/catalog/catalog.php ) - BUT - check them out with your good neighborhood parts guy to make sure the valve fits the grommet, and that the grommet diameter fits the hole size in your valley cover.

Hose is up to you; John sleeved mine because the PCV diameter is smaller than the base plate diameter where the hose fits into it. Here's a couple pics:

​

​

Hope that helps!​

Ron​

 

Ron, that helps a lot! I dont have that base plate for my carb and Im still running a little 2 barrel. How can I get it into the intake? Just drill a hole? I'm really not trying to be a pain fellas, I just have never done this before so I want to be clear on what I'm about to do. I will do the hole in the valley cover, then one into the intake?

 

I forget exactly what I did, I'll take a peek when I mess with my car on thursday, I don't remember drilling a hole, but I may have.

I know the valley pan you want for this is the later ones with the rear exiting breather. They aren't specific to T-birds, just any engine after 1957, its PERFECT for pcvs.

 

I really dont want to buy another valley pan. Cant I just drill a hole in it?

 

Nope, I wouldn't know how is best way to tap the manifold to ***ure it's equal. Perhaps John or Eric can advise on how-to?

Worst case, perhaps you should consider getting a carb spacer with a port on it? It may be easier - and more effective - than porting directly to the intake? I didn't check availability of them, but just a thought.

 

Are you running a 3 bolt or four bolt 2 bbl carb. If it's a four bolt, you may be able to use a spacer from a SBC Chevy if the port is available.
Since I consider it heresy to put anything GM on a Ford, I'd look for a later 2 bbl intake for the Y-Block that runs the 2100 Ford 2 bbl carb. '59 - '62 Fords and Mercs w/292's had them. Bolt on swap, better carb, and, you get the spacer or means to install one.
Drilling holes into intakes and valley pans whilst installed on the engine is not advised.

 

X2 ^^^

But...in an earlier post you showed a Holley carburetor you planned to use. That would be the really clean way to upgrade your performance a bit and give you a clean and proper way to plumb the PCV valve into the intake system.

As has been thoroughly discussed in other threads on PCV systems, you can't just plug the PCV hose into any handy vacuum port.

Vacuum ports which supply vacuum to operate systems such as wipers, distributor advance, etc. are closed-ended and do not create a vacuum leak. As such they can be put pretty much anywhere vacuum is available with no negative consequences.

PCV ports, on the other hand, are open-ended and do create a vacuum leak. You must be very careful where an open-ended vacuum source is placed so that the resulting vacuum leak does not cause negative consequences.

The primary problem with a poorly placed open-ended vacuum port is that it will lean out the mixture locally, not generally. A local vacuum leak may not greatly effect the operation of the cylinders which feel it, as in cause noticeable missing or poor idle, but it will cause those cylinders to run leaner than all the rest.

Again, this may not have terrible consequences...but it easily could.

Running lean causes the effected cylinders to run hotter than the rest, leading to detonation (also known as "knock" - which is when the overheated air/fuel mixture spontaneously explodes too soon, rather than slowly burning when ignited at the proper time, which is very hard on the lower end bearings, etc.) and unusually high cylinder tempertures which can burn valves, break rings, melt pistons and do other things you really don't want.

A proper PCV vacuum tap distributes the vacuum leak over all the cylinders. Aftermarket 4-bbl carburetors do this by plumbing the PCV port to draw equally from both secondary carburetor throats below the ****erflies.

OEM and aftermarket carburetor plates do essentially the same thing.

By distributing the vacuum leak over all the cylinders, the lean condition can be dealt with by simply re-jetting the carburetor if the engine runs lean. Surprisingly, it may not run lean in any serious way. The only real way to tell is to read the plugs and see what they say.

See... That wasn't so hard, was it?

 

Rocky,I thought you were going to run that Holley 4 barrel? it would have a PCV port in the back to hook up to.

 

I built this "bolt down" version of the PCV elbow for a valley pan with the rear port draft tube. The basic "tee" shape was a copper 1/2 x 3/4 x 3/4 water tube fitting from the Ace plumbing department, flat washer base and a selection of bench warmer grommets. The PCV was from an early sixties 292 truck and it really flows too much air. Made life miserable when trying to tune the idle air.

A fellow suggested I try a different PCV that was made for a smaller six or four cylinder engine (which would work if you were patient) - but I ended up putting a "throttle" orfice in the line to the carb to get just the right amount of air flow down the oil filler tube.

 

OUCH!! BRAIN OVERLOAD! Hahaha jk. I really do appreciate the PCV lesson I've gotten over the last couple of days. Now maybe I can try to explain it to someone someday and not sound like a goober. Looks like the best route for me to take with this is to clean up that 4 barrel intake and put that holley carb on it. That way I can just run from the valley into the port on the holley. Boy, owning an old car sure is fun! I'm sure this I will have more questions. Thanks for the information and patience!

 

There's a valley pan on eBay, says for a 55, 56, 57 Ford. Kind of pricey, opening bid $75. It has the opening for a breather.
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/1955...r_Truck_Parts_Accessories&hash=item35b03bcdfb