I know it may be more resto-related but I've always felt they were more like a kustom than a stocker. I can't recall how to nail it down that it's a true S/R or just an aftermarket tonneau. I recall something about a tag and some special seat work but that's all I got. I'm going to try a google but if anyone here has good info I'd like to hear it. They relly are kool cars for their day, doncha think?
If you can wait until tonight (because I'm at work now) I can give you more of an in-depth education than you'll probably want. Or, go to www.vintagethunderbirdclub.org and browse their Forum's archives for '61-'63. Better yet, get one of my books on T-birds, "Thunderbird 1955-1966" or "Thunderbird 50 Years" for a good historical recap. BTW, I do have access to S/N info to tell whether an early Sports Roadster is legit or not as I maintain a registry for '55-'90s 'Birds for Vintage Thunderbird Club Int'l. Alan H. Tast AIA Technical Director/Past President, Vintage Thunderbird Club Int'l. Author, "Thunderbird 1955-1966" & "Thunderbird 50 Years"
One of my favorite 60's cars for sure. Dead giveaway to the fakes is no grab bar on the dash passenger side. They probably exist, but I've never seen a fake with it. M code engine, also fender skirts are not on the real ones (they didn't fit over the Kelsey-Hayes wires). Just a few things I can think of off hand.
I do not know what to look for exactly to find out if it's a true S/R or not but someone on here will. I must agree with you the 61/2/3 S/R birds are very cool cars totally stock and make great everyday drivers and awsome freeway flyers. I must admit I love them even more when they are kustomized. That beeing said I am almost finished with building a 63 R kustom for my wife and a 60 R kustom for myself.
Kool stuff fellas. Very helpful. I'd argue the 'M' code info though. Production numbers make those less than 200 from both years. They're the 'holy grail' version like certain 409 cars and such. Thanks again.
Generally, look for body code 76B, but there are exceptions... From the World Wide Webs.... http://automotivemileposts.com/prod1962tbird.html How To Tell If It's a REAL Sports Roadster The 1962 Thunderbird Sports Roadster models are among the most prized of all Thunderbirds. This has led some to create roadster clones from standard convertibles. The problems Ford had with invoices during early 1962 production create a "gray area" that has allowed some to be duped into thinking they are getting the real thing. The first Sports Roadster built was serial number 2Y85Z 105844, assembled on September 13, 1961. Between that number and date, through serial number 2Y85Z 114640, some 558 factory Sports Roadsters were built. All of these roadsters were invoiced and sold as convertibles with optional Sports Roadster Package, using Body Style Code 76A. Most of these cars were painted Rangoon Red, with Black Vinyl trim. The first Sports Roadster built, that was actually coded as a roadster, was serial number 2Y89Z 127027, built December 11, 1961, using the new Sports Roadster Body Code 76B. However, this last date is currently under question, as there may be one built earlier in the month of December. Through the rest of the model year, Sports Roadsters would be correctly coded. All Sports Roadsters left the factory with the fiberglass Tonneau Cover; red, white and blue Thunderbird emblems on both front fenders, (centered between the bumper and wheel opening, below the script); a matching emblem on the Tonneau Cover, between the seats; a color-keyed Passenger Assist Bar mounted on the padded instrument panel in front of the right passenger; and 5 Kelsey-Hayes Wire Wheels with Knock-Off Spinners. No, you could not get rear fender shields on a roadster! There wasn't enough clearance, and they were not provided. This also goes for ANY Thunderbird that left the factory with wire wheels. There are after market wire wheels, considered safer by today's standards, and they can be modified to fit cars with the fender shields in place. However, this was not done by the factory. It seems there are more Sports Roadsters around today than there were in 1962, so before you pay top dollar for that Sports Roadster, do your homework. Make sure it's the real thing. SPORTS ROADSTER VIN AND BODY CODES: 2Y85Z105844-2Y85Z114640: Body Style Code 76A—Invoicing shows Thunderbird Convertible with "Sports Roadster Package" listed as an option, or Convertible - Sport Roadster 2Y85Z114641-2Y89Z176031: Body Style Code 76B—Invoicing shows Thunderbird Sports Roadster
I couldn't risk spending more time replying to this at work for fear they'll cut off my internet access . Most of what Nappy copied from automotivemileposts.com is correct. There are other ways to ID an early Roadster provided you have its build/ROT sheet and/or its factory Gate Release in order to verify installation of the tonneau cover and wire wheels, but in all instances the grab bar on the passenger side of the dash and no fender skirts/retaining pins should be present. There is one unique feature for early '62 T-bird convertibles/Roadsters that help to further ID an early car: large cast iron weights ("bricks") in the rear corners of the trunk and "land mines" in the forward front corners behind the bumpers. These are supported by steel brackets and served as vibration dampers. Most of these were removed over the years as their usefulness was overestimated. As for the seat, the up/down action was deactivated by unplugging the power leads for this action so that the seat did not push up on the tonneau cover. There are small differences in how the tonneau was formed at the front sides depending on when it was made that I won't go into here between early '62, late '62 and '63 iterations. Mounting hardware was changed from no exposed T-screws and use of mounting tabs that slid between the rear seat cushion and upper seat surround on the very early cars to deletion of the tabs and use of the T-screws and threaded inserts in the upper seat surround for most of production. The retaining clamp and footman's loop are also key spotting features between an original and reproduction cover. They key thing to remember is that unless the third-fourth digits in the VIN are '89' and the body code on the data plate is '76B' you'll really want verifying documentation it's a Roadster, otherwise assume its a more-common convertible. Most '62-'63 'Birds out there, and a good number of '61s, have tonneaus and repop Kelsey-Hayes wire wheels on them: even when new people could buy these from dealers and install them. A different-styled fiberglass tonneau was offered in '64 as were wire wheels, but a uniquely-ID'd Sports Roadster was not made past '63, and likewise a grab bar and the Roadster emblems were not offered for '64. Sales really fell of in '63, so even though there were plans to offer a '64 version only the tonneau and the 14" wires got through. Regarding the "M"-series Tripower, this was available on mid-late '62s and early '63s through December-early January '63 regardless of model, then dropped from the option list. The standard engine for a Roadster, like any other '62-'63, was the 300 hp 390 "Z"-code with a Ford 4100 4-barrel. The VIN identified the engine in the 5th digit with an "M" instead of a "Z". The "M" was available on hardtops, Landaus, convertibles and Roadsters, but more "M"-series Roadsters survived over the years as people recognized them as being desirable. The kicker is that factory documentation didn't survive to count how many non-convertible/Roadster cars were built with the "M" and I suspect there were more than a few hundred built of all models. Alan H. Tast AIA Technical Director/Past President, Vintage Thunderbird Club Int'l. Author, "Thunderbird 1955-1966" & "Thunderbird 50 Years
I guess I should clarify. What I meant was if you have an M code, convertible 61-63 it's probably an SR, but that alone doesn't make it an SR. I've not seen M codes in convertibles in anything but SRs, but I could be wrong about that.
To quote Kay Keyser - "That's right-you're wrong!" The M-series Sports Roadsters get all the ink, but there are regular convertibles, along with hardtops and Landaus, that got the tripower package. At present I have in my databases for '62 48 hardtops, 15 Landaus, at least 18 convertibles, and up to 129 Sports Roadsters (some need to be verified). For '63 there's 32 convertibles accounted for with the "M" along with 23 Landaus and 37 hardtops, to add to the 37 known Sports Roadsters (there acutally may be another 3 from production records I have access to, though). To speculate further, since actual production totals have never been found from Ford and invoices for hardtops/Landaus were never saved, and assuming that production percentages hold true with currently-known examples, it well could be that between 3000-5000 '62-3 T-birds of all models had the 6-packs, but that again is an educated guess.
Just to "chime in" on an older post. . . After 40 plus years of researching and documenting these M-Code 'Birds, I think I've got a pretty good handle on what's out there. No doubt there are a bunch that have probably been destroyed over the years. I currently hold the "official" data base on these cars and have, to date, documented 320 of these 'Birds from both years combined (199 '62s and 121 '63s) of ALL body styles. '62 SR - 120 '63 SR - 37 '62 Hdtp. - 46 '63 Hdtp. - 32 '62 Convt. - 20 '63 Convt. - 29 '63 Landau - 13 '63 Landau - 23 I doubt VERY MUCH that in excess of 1,000 of these were ever built, let alone 3,000-4,000 due to the "personal luxury" market the Thunderbird was geared to, and the lack of advertising regarding the high performance option on these cars. I have documentation that many of these tri powers were actually removed by dealers just to sell the cars off the lots, or replaced on warranty to satisfy customers. There are also a lot more set-ups in the collector and performance market for sale than were probably ever put on cars at the factory. Ford does have figures on some of their performance parts and have stated that they sold over 7,000 of the tri power set-ups over their parts & service counters in the '60s. . .now how many were the more common "stair-stepped" Galaxie set-ups and how many were the unique, "flat" Thunderbird set-ups is anyone's guess. Both used different carbs, some different linkage pieces and different air cleaners. . .although some old road tests of new '63 Galaxies actually show the fancier 'Bird air cleaner. Some of the early "Roadsters" in '62 were actually coded as an "85" Convertible, but caused invoicing problems at Ford, so they were given a separate body code and "89" identifying number. All of the M-Code Roadsters were, however, in the series with the "89" number. Hope this helps some. . . Author '58-'66 Thunderbird Authenticity & Restoration Guide Registry '61 Pace Car Thunderbirds Registry '62-'63 M-Series Thunderbirds Registry '63 1/2 Monaco Special Edition Landau Thunderbirds
This is an interesting topic. I have a '63 convertible that has the roadster options. When I bought it, I wasn't completely up on how to identify a real roadster. While out driving, a fella stopped me and was looking at the car. He told me "All roadsters were Y89. Yours is a Y85, making it just a convertible." As he looked, he noted the grab bar, as well as the lack of skirt tabs. He said if someone made it a clone, they paid attention to details. I contacted the guy I bought it from. He said his uncle had the car for years before passing, and told him it was a dealer created roadster. Not having any documentation with the car that verifies that, I'll take it with a grain of salt. Were roadsters so popular back in '63 that a dealer would make a convertible into a roadster? If so, then how would one determine what is truly a real roadster. Personally, I think I'll stick with the code determining the car and just enjoy my look-a-like.
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