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Hot Rods 64 C10 - Daily Driver Build

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by MUNCIE, Feb 19, 2017.

  1. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    This is turning out to be the build from Hell. I have never and I mean never ran into as many issues on other cars or trucks as I have experienced with this one.
    Put about $20 worth of gas in the new tank after adjusting the valves. The pump won't draw from the tank.
    So I say to myself ok that's fair, maybe need to change the line out since the old sending unit was covered in crud. So I made plans to get one in the morning. So then I figure let's try and start it straight from a gas can and bypass the fuel line. Nothing, the clear fuel filter would not even get a little gas. Fuel pump is brand new. Only been on for a few months and probably has a total of 10 minutes of use.
    As a last resort I tried pouring gas directly into the carb and it still would not start. My battery was a little weak from sitting on the shelf for the last 3 months. Got it charging now, but the Fuel pump issue has me scratching my head. Do you guys think the cam might have worn out a lobe? I never could do a full break in because the damn engine would overheat so quickly.
    I'm at the point where if I experience the same results after replacing the fuel line tomorrow I'm seriously considering pulling the engine and just building a 350 or even maybe buying one used and installing it. The build on this block just doesn't seem like it was done right. TDC is not TDC on the dampener. It is actually a little past it. I think the cam may have not been degreed or maybe was installed incorrectly?
    Also the heads are from a 307 and I'm not sure if they allow the right clearance for the valves? New radiator, new thermostat, new fan clutch and water pump.
    Sorry for the long rant guys but I'm in a bad spot, need my truck running. No other means to get to work,nightshift. Any suggestions?

    Thanks,
    Mark
     
  2. I always installed a fuel filter between the tank and fuel pump. There are two check valves inside of a mechanical fuel pump. And if you get debris from a old tank and lines into the pump and compromise the check valves it will not pump. It also might need to be primed.
     
  3. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    I'm going to change the fuel line out and pull the pump. Is there any way to check those valves inside the pump, I'm assuming no without tearing it open?
    Thanks.
     
  4. That's what SHE said....
     
    Woogeroo likes this.
  5. Some fuel pumps are held together with screws and you can take them apart and rebuild them. The sealed fuel pumps are not made to be dissembled.. Do not install one of those clear fuel filters between the fuel pump and carb. They are prone to failure when under pressure. A fire waiting to happen. On the 64 chevy trucks there is a rubber connecting hose back at the cab corner that connects the steel line from the tank to the steel line to the fuel pump. If its old it can collapse inside and not allow fuel to pass. Also if it has a seepy place it can allow the pump to suck air instead of fuel. Now you can bench test a fuel pump. Attach a hose to the inlet. place the hose in a container of gas and manually work the actuating lever. Now one common thing on chev V8 fuel pumps Is improper installation. There is a metal actuating rod that one end contacts the cam the other end pushes against the fuel pump arm. That rod must be held firmly against the cam when the fuel pump is installed. You temporarily install a longer 3/8 bolt into the front engine block boss where a front engine mount would attach. There should already be a short bolt in there. tighten the longer bolt against the fuel pump actuating rod just enough to hold it firmly against the camshaft. Install fuel pump. Remove the long bolt and install a short bolt. Without a bolt in that hole you will have a oil leak. If I was there I could have it sorted in a short time. Its hard to properly diagnose over the internet. Also the wire frim the ignition switch to the coil is a resistance wire. not needed for electronic ignition. cut it off the back of the ignition switch and replace with a copper wire.
     
  6. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Thanks for your help. The FP was pumping a couple of months ago, Hurricane Harvey hit us pretty hard. I got about 3 feet of water in my house so needless to say I have been busy with my home recovery effort and hadn't had anytime to really work on the truck. Been bumming rides fir awhile now. I already pulled the fuel line and Im about to head out to Auto parts for replacement. I will let you guys know how it goes.
     
  7. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Well turns out Auto parts stores only sold rubber fuel lines, no metal. I was like really, don't understand that one.
    Anyway order a new fuel line from LMC. Hope it's in before next weekend so I can install.
    Took the fuel pump (one piece) off and took it back to O'Rileys. Was still under warranty so got a replacement and mounted it. It's pumping, just turned it over very quickly twice to make sure.
    Waiting for a ride to Auto parts store and will replace clear fuel filter with a metal one. I will let you guys know if the valve adjustment is right and if it eliminated my over heating problems by end of this upcoming week.

    Mark
     
    Truckdoctor Andy likes this.
  8. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Been looking into other options for my drivetrain. A company offers different strokers like a 383 for about $3800. Don't really need that but they do offer a 350 build for $1800 - bare bones. For a good low end and plenty of torque what lift should I look for in a engine? 280 - 288 or is that too much?
     
  9. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 21,509

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    I built a pretty sweet running .040 over 350 for my 66 Suburban, camshaft was a Comp Cams 268, had a very mild rumpy idle, moved that heavy truck down the road nicely.
    Decided to upgrade it after a thousand miles with a 280 cam and Edelbrock aluminum heads but has never been fired yet so I have no idea if it was the right move.
     
    MUNCIE likes this.
  10. Buying a crate engine is not going to solve the issues you have. To put a old vehicle back into service and have it be reliable you have to rework the fuel ,electrical and brake system. Then the suspension and driveline needs to be in good condition also. The gas tank filters lines all need to be clean. and the fuel pump be good and the carb likely needs rebuilt. Then theres the cooling system that need to be in proper working order also.
     
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  11. southcross2631
    Joined: Jan 20, 2013
    Posts: 4,412

    southcross2631
    Member

    Fix what you have. Make sure it runs every day . Enjoy the ride and start gathering stuff for your new motor.
     
    MUNCIE likes this.
  12. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Appreciate all the info and advice guys.. I have been working on this truck in hopes of making it a daily driver. Replaced all suspension, new brake lines, hardware, drums , bearings etc.
    Wiring was in good shape only had to replace one harness and it came with a brand new aluminum radiator., amongst other parts. Carb is good, pulled it off my SBF in my Falcon. Wanted to go with a smaller CFM. Differential appeared to be good so I just changed the oil.

    Don't really have the money now for the crate but maybe sometime next year. Collecting parts and fixing what I have is the direction I want to go. Anxiously awaiting the weekend to get back on it.

    Mark
     
  13. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston


    Got it running but still overheating some. About 69 degrees out and after 5 minutes or so the radiator started to get hot to the touch. Pulled thermostat and inserted it into a pot of boiling water. It opened and closed under cold water so I know it's good.
    Installed the fuel lines on the rail and by the tank, no leaks from the the tank so that's a plus. I cracked opened the rad cap while it was idling and I noticed it would burp up water every now and then. The water would pop up and then drop.
    Do you guys think I might have air in the system? Or is it time to pull the heads. The valve adjustment seem to quiet down the rockers quite a bit. Probably one or two could use a little more adjustment but it's better than before.

    Mark
     
    Woogeroo likes this.
  14. It sounds like your getting compression into the coolant. could be bad cracked heads cracked block or head gaskets.
     
  15. Woogeroo
    Joined: Dec 29, 2005
    Posts: 1,274

    Woogeroo
    Member
    from USA

    I'm no expert by far, but check the 'weep hole' under the water pump - if water/coolant is coming out from there, the pump is bad and may not be circulating the water through the system. Just a thought.

    From the video you have the shroud and everything, so it should be pulling the air across the radiator, unless it is clogged up with debris or something.

    Do you have a temperature gauge on it that shows the actual water temp? If so let us know what it is.

    If you think you have air in the cooling system and it just won't come out, you can take it to a mechanic shop, they have a machine that can get it sorted out.

    -W
     
  16. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Thanks I will continue the good fight.
     
  17. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Original water pump was leaking from the weeping hole. This is why I replaced it with a new unit.
    Don't have a temp gauge just the original C & H. Radiator came with the truck and is new. From. what I could tell prior to installation it was clean and free of debris.
    It does not leak from anywhere on the block or heads so Im hoping nothing is cracked. It is almost all the way advanced because anything less and it won't start?
     
  18. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Also any way to determine if the block or the heads are cracked? That way I can know which direction to go.
     
  19. Most parts stores and radiator shops sell a chemical that you add to the coolant. it will change color if you have a combustion gas getting into the coolant problem. Now its possible your timing could cause overheating. Check to be certain that the vacuum advance is working and the mechanical advance is working. You possibly could have a loose timing chain. If the timing chain has slack the cam timing will be late. Pull the dist cap and watch the rotor. turn the engine and watch until it starts to move. then turn the engine the other direction until the rotor starts to move. If you have the engine turning any appriceable amount before the rotor starts to move you need to replace the timing set. also a clogged exhaust or a stuck heat rizer on the exhaust can cause overheating.
     
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  20. Woogeroo
    Joined: Dec 29, 2005
    Posts: 1,274

    Woogeroo
    Member
    from USA

    ah, I missed the water pump replacement somewhere in there. :D

    Hmmn.

    -W
     
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  21. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Ok will try that. I decided to remove the thermostat this morning and see if it helped. It still went up to "Hot" in about 2 minutes on the gauge but the engine ran fine for at least 10 minutes.

    It was advanced almost to the end but I backed it off. Reason being was it would never start anywhere else. I deadvanced it some and it's firing up now. During the 10 minute run with the cap off it didn't burp up any water this time. Also the radiator did got hot but not like before where you couldn't even touch it for a second.

    Running open exhaust manifolds now because I haven't had it running long enough to even attempt to drive it before. Just jacked up the rear and the trans (TH350) will go into gear but the truck won't move. Trying to figure that out now.....
     
  22. Woogeroo
    Joined: Dec 29, 2005
    Posts: 1,274

    Woogeroo
    Member
    from USA

    transmission - check the fluid of course.

    There are the cooler lines that run from the trans to the radiator too... unless it has it's own cooler or something.

    Also, check to make sure the vacuum line from the carb/intake to the transmission is still connected/in good shape. Mine slipped off once, not too long after I got it... after I had been rooting around in there doing something else, it only shifted into 1st tho'.

    After that there is the assembly on the... passenger side I think of the transmission, that I am totally forgetting the name of right now... that goes bad sometimes, but I've been told is user replaceable. Might look up some th350 info somewheres. :D

    -W
     
  23. Its called a modulator
     
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  24. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Hey guys,
    I think the issue is with the torque converter. There are no bolts on it to line up with the flexplate. When checking the fluid and engine is idiling it's cold.
    Fluid level good, line to modulator connected. But some quick background on the trans, never been run or on the street by me. For all I know it could have been just their for mock up when I bought the truck. Old guy said it was a 2 speed PG. ended up being a TH350. Owner passed away two weeks after I looked at it.
    I think I'm gonna pull it this weekend and go from there. At this point it wouldn't hurt to replace or rebuild it to be sure. The converter moves back and forth about 1/2 inch if I rock it. Probably not seated all the way in on the pump shaft.
     
  25. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    I was thinking I should try and bolt the converter up to the flexplate just to see if it engages. Does anybody know where and what type to get?
     
  26. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Got the torque converter bolted up and finally hit an accurate reading on the trans fluid level. Had it idiling and found that the two trans lines weren't smug at the radiator so I tightened them up and they stopped leaking. The third and final leak was coming from the kickdown cable, tried tightening the bolt still leaked.

    So I decided to unloosing and see if there was an o ring or something missing? Turns out the end of it is broke off in the case. Frighing sucks!! It seems a little too long anyway. From the mounting hole for the bolt to pass through on the actual cable to end is 45 inches. That is not extended either. The actual black plastic cable between both mounting parts is only 30 1/2 inches.

    So for one going to see if I can dig out the broken shaft piece without dropping the pan. Second anyone know what length should it be. Is there only 2 sizes for our trucks short & long?

    And lastly can I get from auto parts? Or should I go to a trans shop or order online?

    -Mark
     
  27. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    I dropped the pan and ended up disconnecting this lever and from there tapped it up and out. Forgot how much the crossmember bolts, in particular the last two are a PITA to slide in. Just gonna drill out the holes a little to get that extra 1/8 th of clearance.

    I will let you guys know if a kickdown and if the transmission engages after that. Hope to take it for a small spin around the block if it does.
     

    Attached Files:

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  28. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

     
  29. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Got my parking/signal light harness in and installed it. Need to find some bolts for the housing's. Also going toreplace my light switch. Just waiting for my next day off and I will jump back on it again.
     
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  30. MUNCIE
    Joined: Jan 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,423

    MUNCIE
    Member
    from Houston

    Got my kickdown installed and no leaks. Jacked up the rear and went through all the gears, transmission engaged. Managed to back it out of the driveway and drive it up and down the block by putting it in drive and reversing it.
    I live about half way down our cul de sac. Only problem is it kept back firing when trying to start the engine through the carb and catching on fire. I would have to smother it and then try to restart it. What do you guys think might be the cause? Should I advnce my timing a little?
     

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