Hot Rods Another Attempt at a Definition

During the course of an internal rant about fast electric cars I was led to make a discovery which might point to a better working definition of a hot rod:

A hot rod is a car to which modifications were made, which the OEM would not dare to make.​

It seems to me that that idea of daring is an essential part of it. I'm not saying that a hot rod should be unsafe or unpleasant to drive. I'm saying that it ought to do what it does well because you know what you're doing, even though if you didn't it would most certainly bite you in the ass.

It requires daring; it requires courage, skill, commitment; it requires the fortitude to forfeit comforts which are not important for the sake of the feats which are important. It rewards your being brave and pure of heart, as it were. And we want hot rods because brave and pure of heart is what we'd like to be.

If a car will put out for a scumbag with a credit card as easily as for a verray parfit gentil knyght, I just lose interest. It's not my car any more.

Have at it.

 

OEM, well, anything, is rarely about being "daring", so I wouldn't even bring the OEMs into any definition.

"... it ought to do what it does well because you know what you're doing,"

The above seems to imply the current owner is also the builder. While that is sometimes the case, it most definitely is not always the case...and probably something for another discussion entirely, the old Bought vs. Built argument.



IMHO, the definition of a hot rod needs to be broad enough to encompass a wide variety of vehicles, yet needs some clarity and specificity to ensure there is some cut-off point or minimum amount of changes from stock which qualify it as a hot rod.

"A hot rod is a car..."

If only cars can be hot rods, it already fails the most basic test.

 

Plymouth dared to make the prowler. But that never realy worked out that well.

 

A bit o/t but the Hemi Darts, the Ford Thunderbolt and Pontiac lightweights among others could be considered "daring" they were all about going fast.

 

Agree that the definition is a little too non-specific. That definition means that all Kustoms are also Hot Rods.

 

I think the Prowler was made "on a dare"

 

"Daring."
"Willing to give up some comforts."
"The manufacturers would never..."

 

Now that's a HOT rod!

 

There was a discussion on garage journal last year comparing fast modern cars to hot rods. It was actually a thread about hot rodding dying out.

What came up for me was that hot rods have soul. In that discussion, those who like modern cars think they have soul. To me it's a different definition. A car that goes 0-60 in 2s or less is no more interesting to me than a refrigerator. It's an appliance, but its existence is kind of... bland. People here probably know what I mean. A modern car can be fast and fun, but it doesn't have that character, that soul that makes it feel like it's alive underneath you. Taking a 70+ year old vehicle and making it do things it was never intended to do, making it faster than it was ever intended to be gives it soul. It has character, it has a personality. If you replaced that hot rod with a different one with the same modifications, it wouldn't be the same. A modern car of the same model is the same as another one of the same model. No soul.

 

I have asked this same kind of question towards people in the music industry, it seems that 40,50, 60 years ago we had many superstar musicans and bands then what we have today and the question is "what is the difference" There isnt any allowed freedom of expression, its a controlled to make what sells
Hot Rod: Freedom to express yourself in your vehicle

 

I like that definition. Making something that appeals to you versus making something that appeals to the majority of consumers.

There's a lot of interesting stuff in the music industry because how their money is made is changing so their product is changing in length, content, and quality.

 

When you have managed to revive an old car that had been given up for dead 50 or 60 years ago, it has a special feeling, some say that the car has some "soul". The only way that car was ever to see the light of day again was through you, or someone else who has the same interests later on. The average person would just try to make money from it, and buy another refrigerator or new plastic appliance car. I've never seen anyone drive a Nissan with an ear to ear smile, when it has been back on the road after 50 years. What shits me is when the "press" report a crash between a truck and a "Hot rodded Toyota"!

 

A modified stock car is a custom
All hot rods are customs



but I give a rats rectum less when anything is called.

but society has to label any and everything
this topic is fun to watch on other sites.
“ I’m building a 2020 xxxx hot rod”
The only important part of that is the “I’m building” part

 

I don't think Ned intended for us to start labeling stuff.
We have the label. Hot Rod.
I think it's more to do with expressing the spirit of the thing.

 

Hey @rztrike
I am glad that you brought up that comparison and observation.
As a musician, I have always been truly amazed at the guitar playing style of Jeff Beck, I am fortunate that I got to see him perform live, twice.

He was a true innovator, and he copied no one's style, the rest of the world tried to copy him.
Jeff Beck was a true Hot Rod person as well.

I was always impressed that he did his own work and modifications and repairs on his Hot Rod's.

​

Jeff Beck will be missed no doubt.

In today's world, I would have to say that "Joe Bonnamassa", embodies the spirit, of what Jeff Beck was all about, and lets face it, Joe copies no one, he has a style that is very fresh and is great kick ass rock and roll and killer blues and jazz fusion all combined to make some great music, that make's me want to drive fast and take chances !

 

A hot rod is a purpose built car with soul
So is a custom (Kustom) whatever
Steetrod
Pro street
Restomod
Drifter
Tuner
Rat rod ( dare I say )
Low Ryder ( rider ) whaterverman

the list goes on and on and on .

wjen I worked a Jaguar I drive a lot of fast luxury cars , jags , Bentleys , rolls Royce AMG’s etc etc . Did a mechanical restoration on an xj220

these cars are magnificent superbly engineered bullets that stop and corner completely outside of our realm of imagination of what anything built “ back “in the day could even remotely accomplish.

there are a blast to drive and put a smile on my face but lacked “soul” that thing you can’t touch , can’t smell , can’t really imagine . But when it’s not around you resent its absence.

Soul.

there’s something about no abs , traction control , airbags , 10,000 position power seats electric steering , lane departure heated cup holders and all that other jazz while comforts and a little nicety take away from the actual driving experience and make you a passenger along for the ride .

my 40 merc creaks and groans , no power brakes or steering , wipers are meh if your stopped at a light to long you get a slight whiff of unburnt hydrocarbons
You mash the go pedal and she screams and the ass end sinks down and the hood goes up like a cutter through ice . Both hands on the wheel keeping her straight .
And the biggest shit eating grin on my face every.damn.time .

love driving my old cars .


More into cruising and 50’s -60’s luxury liners then an actual “ hot rod”

to me a suicide door lincolin , 50’s Chrysler imperial or a 60’s caddilac just scream luxury and style .

something new cars lack even with all the options and bobbles and filigree .

simply put .

soul.

built or bought , a car that’s “ yours” amd not optioned out from the lot . Something you built from an idea or “ bought” because you have an idea and cash but not the means is still the same thing .

your buying “ soul”

alright , enough off my soap box , put the glass of scotch down and time for bed


My dogs looking at me funny

 

Yes they do...

 

I looked up "Hot Rod" on Urban Dictionary...I can't post the definitions here. Needless to say, they were of no help to our discussion.

 

I can totally relate to the new performance cars just not having soul. I had (note past tense) a 2006 GTO with an approx 500 rwhp NA engine. 6-speed manual. It was very fast and would put a smile on my face every time I planted my right foot and bounced the tach off 7k. But the car had no soul and barely got a notice at the gas station or wherever. So I sold it. Contrast that with any of my HAMB era old hot rods where you can't just stop for the quick gas or go anywhere without getting a thumbs up, a smile, or nice comment and discussion about the car. The old cars make me feel great, and make others happy. The car's soul speaks and people respond.

 

Hot Rod was a Quadrajet air cleaner lid flipped upside down.....then stomping on the gas....the sound was Hot Rod music to my ears ....

 

Some freedom titles I recall: Wolverton Mtn, The Streak, Help me information give me Memphis
Charlie Brown, Red Baron, When You're Hot You're Hot, Take This Job and Shove It,
Smokin' in the Boy'sRoom.

For cars I got: Nash Metro, Avanti, BugEye Sprite, Imperial, Biarritz, Pacer, Lark conv, Storm.

 

Can someone please tackle @Ned Ludd to the ground and take the can opener away from him.
Another can opened and worms everywhere........

 

Surely "not stock" is part of the hot rod essence? It is in some way a response to the OEM, no?

I mean, as a driver. Hopefully the builder would have gone through all the hot rod's particular hairinesses, and the owner would have verified them.

Yeah yeah OK, vehicle. Or whatever.

That's because Mopar didn't — probably legally couldn't — leave any of the daring to the owner. In trying to build a car which said hot rod they ended up building one which said "hot rod", the scare quotes so predominating that the message became not a hot rod, in any way, shape, or form.

Indeed. But they made them in tiny numbers, doubtless because they didn't dare to make any more than they did. I'm sure the corporate lawyers would have weighed in.

3wLarry (while we're talking about soul, may his rest in peace) always ragged on my "big words", but in my experience it's the little words, like soul, which cause all the trouble. When you want to be precise you use a big word, because it most likely means one thing and one thing only to your audience. If you want to be really precise you write three chapters on exactly what you mean by your big word before even getting to what you want to say. I'm not going there, but I am trying to pin this thing down more satisfactorily than "you know it when you see it."

What do we mean by soul? I'm throwing in the suggestion that it might have something to do with daring, in a certain sense, and calling for responses about aspects I didn't think of, because that's how eidetic reduction works according to my boy Edmund Husserl. So, the soul of (possibly/at least) some vehicles is about a sort of hairiness which appeals because simply being able to handle them (never mind well) becomes an expression of a kind of personal integrity. Am I on to something here?

@05snopro440 suggests that uniqueness feeds into this, and I totally get that. The daring modifications set the build apart, or else the OEM would be doing exactly the same thing next year. And I agree that no feat of performance quite does it on its own. A car could be an accelerative singularity capable of moving at all possible speeds simultaneously (0-60 in 0 seconds) and still miss it completely. And it's worse if it does it while behaving like Dad's Oldsmobile: what sacrifice could I possibly make, what sublime heroic geste, to top that? There is something almost evil in that.

 

Do those terms have patriotic associations for you? They don't for me; I was thinking "knights in armour" etc.; or that naïve, quaintly archaic, Quixotic schoolboy sense of honour. Personally I have no time for patriotism.

 

You guys can fight over the definition of a hotrod all you want, but when I think of the word "hotrod", in my mind's eye I see an early roadster or chopped coupe. No fenders. Bigs and littles. No hood. Big hot motor. Loud. I have a '27 T roadster (slightly OT) that hits all the points for a hot rod. I call it my hot rod. I also have a '26 T coupe (my avatar) that has a hot motor, bigs and littles. But it has fenders and a hood. It's not a hot rod. It's more of a body restoration with frame, suspension and drive train upgrades. A resto mod, if you must label.
I bet there are a whole lot of guys that see the same hot rod that I do in their mind's eye.

 

But if we're talking in those kinds of terms, surely our conception of "hoodlum" is very much a heroic type, in fact just about the same heroic type as the knight-errant? That is, an outsider cast as a villain, working to show up the debasement of a context fallen from the very values he represents? Or is that stretching it? Or do you see what I'm on about?

A hot rodder wrenching on a nasty '27 T might not be a very big story in the scheme of things, but isn't it the same story?

 

To me, only the simplest of definitions is best. A hot rod is any vehicle that has had its performance enhanced by modification or upgrading from its original components.

 

why does everything have to be defined?
Who cares?
Trying to put vehicles in a specific box is silly.

 

So we know what we mean by the words we use. And because it's interesting to see what you get when you start pulling things apart.