Ehdubya - The photo of Craig's Mountain Road Special was run, I believe, in the Packard Club's magazine c. 1999, and I have attached a pdf of a nice article on Tom Cloudsley's fine looking car which was supposedly restored using remains of the MRS. The 1999 article, by Graeme Craw, says the MRS was built up from bits salvaged from the 3rd series twin six originally owned by Governor General Lord Jellicoe. If Cloudley's car is in fact a resurrection of the MRS, then the car near you has been twice resurrected and is now back to what I assume is its original body style, a touring car.
G.J.G Race Results...... By the way the Car has a big Wisconsin 389 CI T-Head engine very much like a Stutz.
Originally Posted by Michael Ferner Found one more entry for Louis Hoyt and your Duesey, T-Head: July 4 in 1922 at Nassau (NY), sadly no results. Benedict and his "Meteor" were also entered. Hoyt appears to have been a bit of a "character" - searching for his name brought up a couple of interesting incidents, both making the news all over the USA (for several years, actually!). First, his garage was apparently robbed a couple of times, and once the burglars got away with 56 hens, but leaving behind a few spring chicken and a note, saying they would be back once Hoyt had fattened up the little ones! Michael I knew that the garage had burned but did not know that it sounds like it was blown up !!! Could you please send me the link to the chicken story, I cannot find it and it sounds very entertaining. Thanks, T-H
Thanks for the White Plains results! The Hoyt stories are from newspaperarchive.com, so I cannot link to them. Here are copies of two of those short articles that appeared in early 1929.
Re: post 2497. That's Jesse Vincent's model 626 Packard speedster, with Charles Lindbergh at the wheel, and Alvan Macauley at right. The car was run at the Packard Proving Grounds 1928 - 1938, but never raced (Kurtis, I hope you will allow a slight digression from the thread here). A friend of mine acquired what remained of the car in 1990 after it had been dismantled decades before, and restored the car. He tells me it is capable of 120 mph, and runs 4,000 rpm at 100 mph. Photo from MMM.
Google News suggested Shiverdecker rather than Smiverdecker - seems to be a particularly common name in (especially) Ohio but if you try putting 3730 West 3rd St, Dayton into Google Street View you'll find something that looks remarkably like an old gas station!
Just thought I would report in that last weekends carburetor work on the 1911 Mercer Raceabout worked well. Had it out for a test drive for only a couple of miles as it in the high thirties today. Eric's mag overhaul also was a success as it started on the third pull.... so we're happy. It might be in the high fifties late next week and if I can get my helper to bring in a video camera and if he knows how to post one, we can take you along for a ride?? We will see.
I stopped to see the GJG when Tony still had it, there was a sketch Peter Helck had drawn of a body tacked to the wall of the shop. I remember the odd radiator top tank. Tony was a nice guy, I bought a 5 gallon bucket of spark plugs from him, every time I look at the For A Ford I think of him.
This is another Salt Lake City area race car, it is an early Studebaker. I have some other photos I will post that show road races right near the city. Some of them look to be fairly early but not what you would call big time races. I am hoping Rapid Robert will fill us in on the road races and fair grounds action as he knows a lot about racing in the area.
T-Head - Sort of caught me off-guard this morning, but I will do my best - off the top of my head. As those of you who may have visited or passed through Salt Lake City, it is nestled along the mountains of the Wasatch range. In certain parts of town there are a few rather steep hills. For three years, beginning in 1908, then 09 and, I believe 11, the Salt Lake Telegram newspaper sponsored a hill climb. The photos posted by T-Head are photos of a stripped down, stock vehicle entered by a local auto dealer. I believe it is a Studebaker. Anyone could enter a car. Vehicles were grouped in classes based on weight and price. Everything from little runabouts to big touring cars were entered. Various cash prizes were awarded. The cream of the crop of Salt Lake's auto community turned out in force to participate and show of their vehicles, as well as most of the local dealers, eager to promote their particular make. The first race in 1908 featured several novel events, one being an all out drag race, from a standing start, between two rival motorists and their cars; a big Stearns and a Packard. The other was an exhibition run, up the hill course by a local man and his ancient, home-built contraption, evidently still in use and chugging around the streets of Salt Lake. I will try and dig up a few more photos and some more information Bob.
Robert... I found a few photos of a loose knit collection of cars in a couple of different shots but not a hill climb. The Studebaker from the earlier post is in a group of cars one of which is a White steamer. I found this photo also of the very impressive Stearns double chain drive 30-60. Another car posed in what looks like the same location is a big Stoddard-Dayton. Do you think these are the hill climb competors? The last photo is a big White steam car around 1908. It is hard to tell from the photo but it looks like he's going uphill?
Some other photos I found, also from Salt Lake. Maybe these cars also had something to do with the hill climb? The fifth photo of the Buick #10 looks to be part of a road race.
T-Head - The first photo with the cars out on the open road was taken in 1908, but is likely a local road race staged by local enthusiasts from Salt Lake out to Saltair, a bathing and amusment resort that existed on the shores of the Great Salt Lake. The other three, the Stearns, the Stoddard and the White Steamer, are from the 1908 Telegram Hill Climb. The White Steamer of J. F. Dunn won its class and then proceeded to beat all the other gasoline autos, winners in each of their classes, in the final event, a Free-for-all, contested for the Newhouse Cup. The course, which can still be driven today, was a mile and a half and the steamer won with a time of 1:40 sec. The first event of the day was for electrics, with 3 entries, won by a Fritchie with a time of over 5 minutes. The Stoddard won its class, but a protest was lodged, claiming the car to be a race car and not stock. The attatched ad, from the Deseret News, placed by Stoddard dealer Sam Sharman, rebutts the claim. The other photos are all from the 1910 (not 1911 as previously stated) and last race run on public streets in Salt Lake. The big car in the photo is a Thomas, entered by the local dealer. The car took top honors that year. The photo of the #10 Buick is not a hill climb photo, but at this point I can't identify when and where it was taken. I have been trying to for several years. Public enthusiasm waned after 1910 and the hill climb was no more, but it looked like a ton of fun while it lasted. Bob.
A scene of the 1908 Dieppe Grand Prix and the Coupe des Voiturettes 1907. Both were depicted on a panel of ceramic tiles in an exterior arch at Michelin House, ca. 1905-1911, in London, England.
I saw a reference in an old newespaper to a Kline racing and guess this is one in the 1915 York Pa road race and Benning the same year The 2 pics below are dated c1916 and Burman in the Cutting suggests 1916, the earliest positively dated pictures of the Jimmys are the 1916 Thanksgiving day Benning meet and the last May 30 1917 and no Duesy. The disappearance of the similar car above which featured prominently in earlier Benning meets coincides with the appearance of the Jimmys. These two below are at odds with each other and the pictures above, The Reilly car looks most like a Jimmy but couldn't have been built in 1914 if it is. though this claim to Junior seems to have been revised The 1919 pic at the link below shows an awful lot of silver to be acquired in less than 3 years so I wonder if it's Jimmy Jr either and if the Klines themselves used anything but Kline power. http://www.philreillycompany.com/Cars/KlineKarSpecial.html http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kline_Kar There's a family resemblence here, could this be Jimmy Kline junior and senior seated in the earlier car 1915? edit: Burman lined up with them would 1912
I also have wondered about the Kline car and the Jimmy and the Jimmy Jr. I do know that in the first photo of the car the polished body is new. I also seem to remember that it came with an old body that was on the chassis when it was restored (early 90's). The car went from California were it was restored to Germany for a while and it is now back in the states. I have helped the present owner with a part or two and know that he has made some corrections to it and I think they may have restored the old body and put it back on. Race cars can change a lot over their useful life and the polished body may have been a copy of one that it wore at a different point in its life. I do know that the car is the real thing. The second photo of it is a Milwaukee last summer when it and the sixteen valve Duesenberg were both on the track again together for the first time in a long while.
David, when you see a Duesenberg powered 4 with this style exhaust are they the same 8 or 16 valve engine? Did Romer and Revere use these engines or different ones? Question #2, is there a name for this style exhaust, many cars in the 1915-20 era used systems that look somewhat like it. The Porter is one that comes to mind.
Quote 37kid; David, when you see a Duesenberg powered 4 with this style exhaust are they the same 8 or 16 valve engine? Did Romer and Revere use these engines or different ones? Question #2, is there a name for this style exhaust, many cars in the 1915-20 era used systems that look somewhat like it. The Porter is one that comes to mind. Same style for both the 8 & 16 valve engines but the tubing up from the ports to the megaphone on the 16 valve cars are oval and about 3.5" long. The eight valve engines had round tubing. I do not know of a name for this style of exhaust. All of the racing cars both 8 & 16 valve were special racing engines. They later sold the rights to the Rochester Engine Co. who made the engines that were sold to the assembled car builders. Some of these also found the way into other racing cars also. Rochester Duesenberg 8-valve on left, racing 8-valve on right. Color photos of a Rochester Duesenberg Engine in an Argonne by Banjeaux Bob. The car is in the Fountainhead Museum in Alaska. The last photo is of a six cylinder which may have found its way into a few Roamers.
T-head, I'm guessing here but it doesn't appear as though the connecting rods would be over about 1/8 thick. Pretty cool, thanks for the pics inside. You know that's what I want to see.
That's really neat Bob.....have any pistons to show people? What size are they like 2"? I think that some of these small and beautifully made Miller parts are like sculpture. I work on a lot of big early cars and in comparison their parts are the size of Dinosaur bones.
Thanks for posting the pattern photos, T-Head! Unfortunately, our country has lost many of its small foundries and the fabulously skilled folks who worked in them. Foundry arts were once taught in high school shop and early racers often cast their own parts. <O</O As an apprentice I had the chance to work in a foundry and a pattern shop. A lot of art, science, and skill goes into making good, sound castings. <O</O I was taught that the keys to making sound parts all ended up in the scrap bin: gates, risers, and chills. Chills are the steel parts inserted in the sand to speed cooling in thin sections. Gates are the places the molten metal goes in and they need to be in the right places. Risers are vents that allow the impurities to float away from the part. It takes experience and many revisions to get everything just right. We often poured twice the weight of the part to insure the castings were free of porosity. <O</O Youve done a wonderful thing in preserving this history. <O</O Chuck Schultz <ST1<?xml:namespace prefix = st1 ns = "urn:schemas-microsoft-comWinfield</st1:City>, <st1:State w:st="on">Illinois</st1:State>
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