Base + Clear that looks like candy???...with photo example inside

I love this car. What is the burgundy ?

 

It's one of the HOK candies over gold, I want to say Black Cherry but it's been a couple years. There are pics of the whole process in that link. I can dig up exactly what colors if need be.

 

That GM factory color is nice.

That buick is nice and subtle with the dark shade. Black cherry is a good description.

 

Thanks Zman. I'm a long way from final paint on my 50 Chevy project. But, I keep coming back to some kind of black body/ deep burgundy roof candy or pearl idea...Once I get there I might ask you..but like I said..it's gonna be a minute..

 

Here's another thing I've been meditating on...

I have read of colors not matching when spraying candy on separate panels. I have a pickup truck. I cannot paint the back of the cab or the front of the bed with the bed on the truck. It only makes sense that the bed will have to be removed for complete coverage.

What kind of color problems can this cause and how can they be mitigated?

And thanks again guys.

 

HOK candy tangerine over a gold base with clear.

 

I'm not saying this is the color you should use, just that HOK candy base/clears are nice and easy to use. Lippy

 

the new chevy cobalts have a nice candy/metallic color...i just painted a bumper for one using black primer.paint was basecoat/clearcoat and the color was a blue almost purple.looked real deep after a few coats of clear and was a real nice color

 

Dont get too pumped about those old pics and how the paint depth goes for fathoms, they used Nitro Lacquer, using new paints wont get you the same depth or feel.

 

I have seen a couple of modern candy jobs in person that gave me an honest to goodness *****. If done correctly, it is like looking through layers of paint that seem to be a foot thick. Which is why I am so fascinated with candy and also why I added the abyss comment.

I think the lack of depth of modern candy comments are true. But only because of the difficulty of the job and it not being done 100% perfect 99% of the time. If you get it right and gaze upon it in bright natural light, be prepared to change your drawers.

 

I think if you realy want candy take it to a pro this type of paint job is one for those who know what they are doing and have been doing it for a while. But in saying that if you think you can do it go for it just make shure you take your time to get to know the product you choose to use.Listen to the advice of those on the H.A.M.B. and you should be fine.Remember to have a very clean enviroment and equipment this dose make a difference to the end result. Good luck.

 

Oh I am sure there are guys who can come close to the Nitro look.
A tip I was once told by and old timey painter is: Base coat, one wet clear coat then 'dust on' another base over the clear and then clear over that, he says it gives it that extra pzazz.
I like having to change my drawers on such occasions

 

I'm a profesional painter and have only done one candy job. What I was told to do by an old hot rodder/painter was to add a little bit of the candy to the silver base coat I was using and that would help with the coverage and the blotchyness that you can end up with. I also added a little pearl to the candy coat. The truck turned out really nice. The color is so bright you can see an orange glow/reflection on the pavement when it's in the sun. I'll poss a pic if youd like but It's orange and OT (s-10 blazer).

I'll be painting another guy's roadster in the next few months that he wants to do candy. We have looked at other colors but nothing is quite the same as a nice candy color.

 

You can get pretty close to the look of the old lacquer candies, but they will never look the same. The nitro lacquer was the best, for looks, but not longevity. Super clear and brilliant, and the toners were such pure bright colors...but they faded REAL fast in the sunlight. OK for indoor show cars, but not drivers. YOU also had to put on LOTS of coats, base + candy + clear. That made for a pretty weak, brittle film when it dried, and prone to cracking.
The modern urethanes don't look quite a good, but they hold up WAY better. A way to make them look a bit better, is to put more clear in the candy and put on more coats, but Kosmoski told me it also makes it harder to get even coverage....if you use more clear, to make it more tranparent, or even if you put in KK concentrate, to make it cover faster. His ratio of toner to clear is supposed ot be optimum for even coverage. I only use the KK for door jambs and artwork, where it is not so critical.
And yeah, Bill makes a good point, with the price of materials, as mistake in painting candy can cost you $500 or more in materials. And the part about looking good in the booth and terrible outside, absolutely true! I had a Kandy Teal job I did on a 69 Camaro that looked perfect in the booth, even looked perfect in the bright sun. But it was really blotchy when viewed in overcast skies. Most difficult job I've even done to get that color right!

 

WTF? A paint party and I missed it!

Kandy vs KBC, tough call that breaks it down to ability and final use of the car/truck. Lacquer vs urethane, don't fall for it! Urethane has advantages that lacquer never will have, but it also has issues that lacquer never has. The worst of the issues is the wt or viscosity. You think the 'thane's dry and ready, yet it's still "moving" as it sets up. Any low bodywork, any shapes that form valleys, all will be darker over an hour later. Don't ask me how I know! I'll go on record to say that if you want a gennie and pure kandy that won't fail even after your best efforts, go lacquer. "But damn Jocko, we can't get it no more!" ********.

PPG DCA468 High Performance Clear is still around. Unchanged for over 30yrs, it's still the clearest and deepest of finishes and still requires old world care and feeding. Big secret kids, most basecoats are a lacquer base. They dry fast, have little to no "clear" binder for shine, and other than DuPont, most every one will stay still under lacquer clear. Bases that require a reactive reducer or a basemaker for solvent are excluded from this, and a trial is ALWAYS warrated to ***ure compatibility.

If you want KBC to look more like the real deal, simply use more reducer and the right ground coat. In my experiences with KBC (kandy base) it's as easy to "stripe" as gennie kandy if you don't pay attention, but it's easier to fix. Adding some to the clear is also a kool idea, but in certain colors, the more silver of the pearl bits tend to stand out from the color being "rinsed off" by the extra clear or reducer. In the right color it's not a bad look. If you do this with a dark color it can look like you got some light colored dust in the paint.

Ok, **** all that and let's get back to lacquer. Pick your ground coat and get an OEM mix from PPG in LACQUER BASECOAT. Some places still have it, or the "Global" line is also compatible. Better yet, and finacially sound, try Shopline base. Silvers, golds, "minty" colors, all make a good base. I prefer fine bases to avoid the "b*** boat" look. Before any kandy goes on, CLEAR THE METALLIC BASE. ***uming it's laid out nice, you like the body work, and your pattern is done to your standard, the clear before kandy will lock it down and prevent the kandy dyes from bleeding into any irregular poly (I hate that look!). If you really wish to punish yourself, lay down like 4 coats of clear, let it dry for 2-3 days, then block it all down with a paint stick wrapped in sandpaper finishing to maybe 1500. Now you have a smooth and even surface that has a tooth to help hold your kandy in place and a barrier to prevent bleeding...and a touch of extra depth as a bonus. You'll see that 3D effect in the 1st couple coats. For lacquer clear as kandy, you need to be the mad scientist and get Kandy Koncentrate. That's a tint that you can make your own kandy with since HOK has totally dropped their lacquer system.

For my purposes I'm going to green (yes indeed 'olds, GREEN ****S!) and plan to simply dump the whole can of KK in a gallon of DCA468, then blend it into the remaining cans of clear needed to finish (guessing 2 kandy and 2 straight clear). This will give you a consistant blending of the kandy by gang mixing it before the job. Straight clear will need to cover it all once done. I won't rehash the application process. Just get a good night's sleep, eat well, and have an ***istant on the ready to help with mixing and watch the hose, etc., and trust me that a helper is a MAJOR ***ET to laying down a good kandy.

Nothing, and I mean NOTHING, has the depth of finish that a fully surfaced lacquer job has. There's some warnings due that have always applied, as well as 1 or 2 new ones. 1st, the new HVLP guns lay down waaay more mat'l than us old *******s were used to with lacquers. Where 15-20 coats were required for kustom work (lots of final surfacing), you now need to stop at 9 or 10. Yes you newbs, I said 10! It ain't urethane, and if you monitor your consumption, logic reminds you of what's been applied. Too much or too heavy, solvent pop or sags and runs. Too much solvent will get trapped below the surface for weeks. A slow-dry solvent has advantages and dangers in equal amts. Flash time is important too. I was told by a painter who used to do several kandies a year (and they looked real good too), that his trick was to over-reduce a bit and wait longer between coats. Experienced painters can "see" this in their mind if you think about it for a few minutes. I could go on and on, and I probably already did, but these few ideas can go a long way toward removing the pain of a pure kandy finish. I figure to do my kandy green will take the whole week just to get the finish on. Figure the base, the clear, the surfacing, the kandy, the clear, the surfacing, the clear, the surfacing...

And that's not the final cut and polish!! We can pick at these ideas together if you like. I'm always open for paint talk.

 

I am a robot. I am a robot. I am a robot.



Any answers to my question about painting the bed off the truck in order to get the back of the cab and the front of the bed? Will this cause me problems? How can I mitigate potential problems?

Thanks again.

 

if you have a paint supply house near you ....check out these 2 toners.... chroma base 862 transparent red & omni m134 violet... both look close to the color your shooting for.... add binder and go.

and for the by the numbers guys , back in the day , you didn't pick up a quart of candy...you made it up as you went...lol

 

I do have a supply place nearby. I'll check it out. Thanks!

 

I don't think separating your cab and bed will be a problem. The contours of the bed are so different from the sides of the cab/front fenders, I don't think anyone would notice a difference if there was one. If you had Cameo bedsides, it would be a different matter.

Be sure you paint the cab and bed at the same time, in the same room, though. Minor differences in humidity and drying time can make for noticeable differences in the paint.

 

^^^^^

What he said...

 

what he said he said...

 

I think you will regret it in the long run if you don't go for the candy job. You have been talking about that color forever and I think you will forever question if you could have pulled it off. You proved that you are up to a challenge with the caddy mill. Plus you have some good people around you that will help you out. I am always available to make mistakes on your stuff. lol

Also, talk with Bagshaw. His old man has pulled off some killer candy jobs and I am sure he will give you some good tips.

 

theHIGHLANDER knows his ****... and his paint too. Thanks for always taking the time to share your experience with the mouthbreathing m***es... Seriously! Everytime you post it automatically offsets a 1/2dozen fng worthless s10 frame swap, or what color should I paint my wheels **** posts! Thankyou

 

In my youth, 40 coats of hand rubbed lacquer was the zenith! Todays base/clear paints don't really come close... You dont foget the depth of those old custom jobs once you've seen them.
Even the old enamel jobs were different. They carried their color on the outside, not under clear. There IS a difference!
You cant match the new stuff for durability though.
Go candy and post us lotsa pics, OK?

 

Boy-This thread has been a real education- I'm far from ready for paint on my RPU but all this in information will really help when that day arrives. The HAMB rules

 

Uh, you skipped right over acrylic lacquer...

 

I heard this from a "geezer" myself, not that I have any candy experience. Highlander, check your pm's, if you want a lacquer paint party, have I got a deal for you!

 

Kevin, thanks for reminding me how cool that chevy is!! I'd almost forgotten, lol.


And thanks chopolds and highlander for the advice and tips. I've still got some time to meditate before paint.

 

Sorry, Acrylic is pretty close, but still no contest to nitro. In fact, HOK was born, when Jon found that the toners and pigments, in an acrylic lacquer system did not meet up to his expectations, and comparison to the nitro candies. He recruited a chemist friend to help him work out formulations,, new pigments, and toners to try to get the quality of
Acrylic candy up to Nitro specs. I believe he did it, or came close enough, even for HIS high expectations. So Acrylic, at least the high quality HOK candies, hold up better, and look about as good as the old nitro ones. I've only seen nitro in the can, never used on a car, so I have no personal experience with the old nitro vs. acrylic. Just the tales my old boss told me, and listening to Jon's stoy of starting HOK. I used to do HOK lacquer candies up until about 1989 or so, when I switched to urethane.

 

chopolds, I really think the tried and true DCA 468 is up to the task if, and it's a big IF, one's willing to do the work. 'Thanes can be made to look awesome too. Try to get a customer to pay for it though, and be ready for a case of Ben Gay muscle cream!

This is urethane with no glaze or wax, but cut and polished:




Lincoln door. Just sayin...