Technical (Bought) Probably buying a 62 Falcon....

Taking a look at a 1962 Falcon today - has the inline 6 and the embarr***ment that was the Ford-o-matic, which is probably shot. Car is already cheap and has a horrible "custom" paint job... it'll be primer black in no time if it follows me home - if I can get it as cheap as I think, I'll have another project (4 door + ****ty paint job + transmision problem = slow mover).

A few quick questions:
Owner states that transmission "goes into gear and moves, but not much strength" - any ideas of what to try to see if I can get her drive home-able?

I'm under the impression that the C-4 is a relatively easy swap - and I've found a couple threads detailing same swaps. I'd appreciate some more tips so that when, not if, I do that swap it's relatively painless.

Anything I need to watch out for? While I'm a long time fan of these old birds, I'll admit to not knowing much about them...

Appreciate any input! Goal is to make this thing a fair weather daily driver. If there's an easier swap than the C-4, I'm all ears!

 

The transmission is probably shot,,my suggestion is pull the engine and transmission and install a V8 and a C4. HRP

 

I'd actually prefer to stay with a 6 for the sake of fuel economy. With headers and gl*** packs, the old inlines sound just fine and I don't need a speed demon.

But a built 302 would be a lot of fun...

 

You'll have bellhousing issues with anything but the earliest of C4s.

 

If you don't need much power then you can't go wrong with this deal. Screaming 144 CI if I remember correctly.
302 with C4 is almost a bolt it and the 9" from a '57-'59 wagon is too. The five lug front hubs and big brakes from the Sprint version also bolts in and you can drill the third hole for the idler arm after you tighten the other two.

 

Not what I wanted to hear...

What, other than running away or swapping motors, are my "easy" options?

 

I think your decision to go with a 6 is good. The entire suspension from the front to the rear end was lighter for the 6 that the V8. If you wanted a V8 I would have suggested you find a car that came from the factory with a V8.
Charlie Stephens

 

I believe the bell housing on the inline 6 automatic transmission is 5 bolt,so it goes without saying if you replace the transmission with a C6 you will need a early transmission,most C6 bell housings are 6 bolt. HRP

 

Bought the car, it's being delivered tomorrow. Pics and lots of questions to follow.

Body is fairly straight, she'll be flat black very quickly. Motor runs ok but will need some carb work, transmission may just be torque converter. Interior, minus carpet, is good. P***enger floor pan is pretty thin but all else looked pretty solid.

I'm in the Dallas area - if anyone has parts that'd help shoot me a price....

 

I drive a '60 Falcon, with a 144.

If you want to know how to make it 90-mph capable, without opening the engine, just say the word.

32mpg@65-mph.

 

Speak, great master. Teach me your ways.

What you're describing is exactly what I'm after. Long term goal is to make this a fair weather daily driver. Reliability is #1, fuel economy #2, everything else follows.

 

Listen to Gimpy on this one! He's talking about doing a five speed deal, and some simple mods like a Weber carb and a much improved ignition. That's really all these little cars need to feel 100% different than the pokey, little cars they have the reputation of being.

Now, as far as the C4 deal, there are a few different ways to go about this thing. But your deal is sort of narrowed to one, 'cause with the Ford-O-****pic, we know you have the early style engine, and it's either a 144 or a 170. KINDA... See, sometime in '65 or '66, Ford, in it's ever expanding quest to make life difficult for future hot rodders, decided to change the bell housing bolt pattern on their small, or Falcon six. They went from the small stuff of '60-'65? to the larger stuff of '66?-about '80 or so, but with a strange twist. They also on the later stuff drilled the block for the earlier pattern too, in some cases. The C/4 in it's variants, came into being in '64, just in time for the small bell housing era, then was immediately changed a year later to big stuff.... Sound fun yet?

The place to start with this mess is what do you have? Take a look at the p***enger side of the block. The first easy check is count the freeze plugs. 3 or 5? Three is early, five is late. Three and you are looking for an early style '64-early '65 6 cylinder C4, (The p***word is "Mustang ****s"... They yank good running 6ers five minutes after the ink dries on the ***le.), five and your possibilities get much better. With five you can use any small 6 cylinder C/4 from '66 onward, or in some cases, the earlier stuff too. Also, down by the starter, find the date code. It'll be something like C2De or C7DE or even D5DE. The "C" stands for the sixties, and the "D" stands for the seventies, an "E" would indicate the eighties. The digit after is the year, so C7 would be '67... See how easy Ford made stuff?

You now know the first part of the Ford secret handshake! Congrats! But it still won't get you into the Ford secret brotherhood convention, as that requires a tricky under the left leg thing with out breaking your grasp on a fellow Ford brother's hand or losing your Fez...

Now, as your brain reels with all this **** stored in my head about Falcon sixes, (is it any wonder I can't remember Judy's birthday on any given year?) I will tell you after all of this - DON'T PUT A F**KING C/4 IN YOUR CAR!!! They leak like a colander, and that tall 2.64 first gear makes these things feel like they are neutered out of a stop light with anything less than 3.50 rear gearing.... Which relegates you to the engine SCREAMING at 65 in the far right lane on the freeway - and is an easy way to become a hood ornament for any dip**** in a Hyundai playing with their phone and reading the paper coming up on you at 85. Trust me, I just did this deal a year or two ago simply to remind my self just how hard it ****s. Oh, freeway fuel mileage goes out the window too, just to make it more interesting. There is no overdrive/automatic option for these cars that I currently know of. At the time my wagon was killed by a drunk, I was working on adapting a Volvo overdrive onto the C/4, just in the name of keeping it an automatic simply in the name of keeping something my girlfriend COULD (but never did) drive.

Nope, do what Gimpy is gonna tell you to do is exactly what you should do! Find a pedal ***embly for the manual, an Econoline bell housing, a common Offy adaptor, and put a damn T-5 out of an S-10 in this thing! With it's deeper first gear (and I can't remember if Gimpy is runnin' a 3.46 or a 4.03 first trans) and the 3.20-3.50 rear, it suddenly becomes a rocket ship out of the lights! Having two modern extra gears keep the little six in happy dance range always, then the shift to over drive kills the SCREAMING down the freeway in the right lane stuff I was *****ing about earlier, plus bumps the fuel mileage out the ceiling! If you need any help finding the pedal ***embly or bell, I can help.

There are other things you need to know about with these too. The distributor is the largest load of **** ever created, even worse than the Ford-O-****ic trans. You are gonna need to go later stuff that will be determined by what engine you have, as distributor hole size varied early to late as well. Working with the late engines, my preference is with the '70 and '80 Dura spark stuff. Just this alone will feel like doubling the horse power by the seat of your pants.

The other highly recommended mod is a Weber 32/36 DGV series carb on an adaptor. Cheap and easy as hell, and again feels like you doubled the horsepressure!

Those three things alone put you on the freeway, make the thing feel like you doubled the horse power, and provide you with mileage a new car could hope to attain. And, if you have really shopped and scrounged, you've spent a grand at the most. The last thing to discuss is stopping this thing. ScrareBird from here on the H.A.M.B.. makes about the slickest disc brake conversion for these things that has been conceived, and can be done for about the same money as going through the stock, pitiful, weakling drums.

Welcome to the dark side of Fordism, you're gonna dig it!

 

T5. Got it. Manuals are more fun to drive anyways. Of course, I drive in a bunch of stop and go, but the torque will make the resultant ****ty mileage more fun.

Guess that means I get to start searching for build threads (links are awesome). Seems my dad did a similar thing, guess I aught to call him.


Thanks for the input y'all. Tell me what to build and I'll listen, as long as I keep good mileage. Won't start gathering parts till this weekend at the earliest.

 

Like I said, the minute I have it running right it's getting flat blacked.

 

I like the stars

 

Find a 65 falcon with a "Green Dot" three speed automatic. The comet of that time would be the same.

 

Bought from the Partridge family?... LOL!

Those small sixes can be made to run; I knew a guy 'back in the day' with a 144 in a '62 Falcon wagon and with three 1-barrel carbs, big cam, Clifford research header, and a T10 four-speed regularly embarr***ed small-block V8 cars at stoplights... Sounded great at idle too.

 

Which is a C-4, which is not the best choice, see above.

FWIW, I drove for years a 170-Ford-O and had NO problems at all. Speedy enough away from a light, freeway capable, though the 3:50 kept me down under 80. I'd consider rebuilding the Ford-O, based on my experience.

Failing THAT, I have a blown up Dagenham 4 speed with bell, clutch and flywheel...

Cosmo

 

That is EXTRA groovy!

Check out the thread "Doing Falcons right" here. There is lots of stuff from Gimpy and myself on that thread. "Falcons Done Right" is another good thread to see finished coolness.

Back to the T-5 deal, the deeper first gear is what is gonna net you enviable mileage in light to light to stuff as well. The ONLY thing modern cars have done that I think is beyond *****in' is they have figured out transmissions and gearing. That's what makes my girlfriend's new Honda Civic accelerate out of lights harder than anything with 120 horses in 3600lbs ever should. Apply that same thought process to a car that weighs 2400 pounds with about the same horse power and things get fun real quick!

Don't let anybody tell ya that you HAVE to put a V8 in these things to have fun! They have a very nimble, quick handling feel with a six up front that goes away when you slip a V8 on to the mounts. That same light, nimble handling can be vastly improved upon with just a couple quick low buck/no buck mods, too. But get it running first...

 

The/ a six staying is non negotiable.

If I left the paint job, I'd have to start smoking ms Jane again, and I don't think my employer would like that.

I've been going through the Falcons done/doing right thread. Only about a million pages to go on each.

Maybe I'll tear into the ford o matic and see if I can make it work right. Consensus seems to be if I swap, go t5?

I'll take some mechanical pics tonight, and see if I can get her to idle right.

 

I drove one just like yours for something like 15 yrs.' liked it very much. The trans stopped shifting and caused the engine to over rev. Change or repair the trans. I liked the 170 cu in engine, they even had speed equipment for it back then.

 

Gearing is the key. However, modern cars also have one thing that few have considered: drive by wire. With this, they can alter the ratio of foot feed to actual throttle opening to make the car 'feel' peppier than it really is. Used to drive a new Sentra a bunch for work. Off the light was great, but the party was over at 80 mph....not a function of gearing, a function of 'gots no mo' power'.

Agreed, too, with the feel of a six Falcon vs an 8. And the six has greater torque down low for off the line kick.

Cosmo

 

Check out fordsix.com they will have tons of advice on the 144 through the 250 ci sixes.Great bunch of people there.Just like here on the HAMB.
Good luck.Have fun.Be safe.
Leo

 

That can be a cool car. Definitely has potential.


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Well, Chip beat me to it.

The first two things that you need to do to the engine are the carburetor and the distributor.

In this case, you need to do both, but you can do the distributor first, just not the other way around.

The distributor is a vacuum only unit, run by a special valve in the carburetor.

These distributors ****ed when they were brand new, now, your's is worn. Putting a Pertronix unit in it will NOT HELP.

Unfortunately, the easiest upgrade appears to have been discontinued. That was a DUI HEI unit.

Ford Falcon 144's and 170's have a smaller distributor bore that later Falcon sixes. They also have a smaller, 1/4". oil pump drive shaft, versus the later 5/16" one.

There were Mallory distributors, but those are rare.

About the best thing that you can do is get a DUI HEI, or a Ford Duraspark II, and have a machine shop match it's dimensions to your original distributor, and then swap the oil pump and oil pump driveshaft.

Once you have the distributor and plug wires replaced, you will notice that you seem to have about an additional 30hp.

It is an insane difference.

After that, when you have time, or finances allow, put a Weber 32/36 on a Cl***ic Inlines adapter.

I can give you the jet numbers, which were selected via a wideband Oxygen sensor.

Once you have done that, you will discover that you can handily p*** people on the open road, hitting 90mph, if you desire.

Even without the T5, this makes a HUGE difference.

I am running an S10 T5. I picked the wrong one. I have one with the 3.76 gear set. 5th is a little too tall. I have a spare 0.89:1 5th from the 4.03 transmission.

Like Chip mentioned, the 144 needs the 4.03 ge****t, with the 3.56:1 rear gears. The 144, and likely the 170, could use the lower gears.

The T5, with the 4.03 ge****t is from the 1982-1985 era.

I have a spare 0.89:1 5th from the 4.03 transmission, but I have not put it in, as I am building a torque monster 200, backed by a T56 6-speed (with MUCH lower rear gears).

Check your door tag. These came with more than one ratio in the rear axle. There is a section marked axle. There will be a number there. Post that number, and I will tell you what the ratio is.

Look on eBay for the seller Dr4Falcons: http://www.ebay.com/usr/dr4falcons?_trksid=p2047675.l2559

He has WAY more than what he has listed. He will have all of the small parts for the clutch linkage. Just send him a message, and he'll hook you up.

He runs a Falcon-only dismantling yard, just across the Bay from me. Super nice guy.

 

Hi,
This should be the forum all the falcon buyers or owner mostly use
http://www.tffn.net
It has great info, though some of the guys here are helping too.

 

Keep that Peter Max paint job! It's cl***ic!!!! I have the matching inflatable pillow....

 

*****in' paint job as is!!

 

Leave the paint. It will be easy to find in a crowded parking lot.