Last week at the local cruise night, I met a man who lives about 20 miles from me, who is building a 31 Chev coupe. He did a lot of looking at my roadster pickup, and began asking some intelligent questions about the Vega cross throw steering and the 305 motor mounts.---Upshot of it all was, he asked me if I could help him with his steering box and mounts for his 350. Since my own rod is finished, and I like to build, I went out to his place today to see what he had. The rod was someones abandoned project, with 4" dropped I-beam and parallel 4 bars, but no steering box installed. There was absolutely no way that a Vega box would fit with the existing side mounts, so I built some temporary "dummy mounts" off the front of the engine, burned off the existing side mounts, and installed a Vega box and mounting plate with an aftermarket Pitman arm. I am going to utilize the tapped holes in the front of the 350 block (these holes were originally used for the mounts on 283 engines), and make new flame cut brackets coming out to the sides of the block, where they will have a round base pad added, and use a 37-48 Ford rubber donut style mount. I will flame cut new brackets which will run from the underside of the donut to the inside of the boxed Chev frame. I ordered the mounts from Vintique this afternoon, and as soon as they arrive here, I will model them using my CAD software, and model all the flame cut brackets that I will need to make. I will post drawing details, solid models, and digital pictures of this build as I proceed, as it will work for any type of old frame which is running a small block Chev.
The mount your describing sounds a lot like the Hurst mount we commonly see in pre 48 Fords with Chevy's in them. They work pretty good. I keep one around for a full size patern and have probably duped and modifyed it 20 times over the years. The Wizzard
This will be very similar to the Hurst mount plate. I am not sure how the Hurst mount plate tied into the frame. I did a web search for Hurst style mounts, but the ones I seen didn't really clarify that issue.---they appeared to be rigid mounts with no rubber isolators.
Okay guys---You may not recognize it, but this is a solid model of the 350 block setting in the 31 Chev frame rails. I haven't put much detail into the model of the block, as I don't really care what any of it looks like except for the area where I am installing the new mounts. The four holes in the block are actually the holes as they would appear in the front of the block. I want to build the mounts symmetrical, so the block is shown as extending 2 1/2" beyond the tapped holes on both sides of the block---(this is to accomodate the bosses on the fuel pump side of a 350 block).---more to follow.
The Hurst front mount went to the stock Ford Donut style rubber pads. They also had a 3/8" thick spacer that went between the mount and block. This made the mount plate clear the Fuel pump boss. Hurst also made several type frame to mount plate pads that also used the stock Ford Rubber pads. I also have one of those. Again these pieces are just a good place to start from when doing Odd motor/ch***is combinations. I could take a photo of the 2 mount parts with the rubber in stalled if you like. I just can't post photos on this board. I'd half to E-Mail them to ya. The Wizzard
Wizard---Thanks for the offer, but I think I'm okay. The Vintique mounts have a pretty good picture in their catalogue, and the real thing should appear here later this week. I'm a design engineer, and do this sort of foolishness every day (for the last 41 years), so I'll probably be able to figure it out as I go.---If ya see me doing something dumb though, let me know---Brian
Does anybody have some nice clear pictures of the rear engine mounts that 283 motors had at the rear of engine/front of transmission? I can't say as I have ever actually seen such animals. I'm sure I must have, because I used to race my 60 Impala with a 283 in it, but that was 40 years ago, memory dims, and a motor mount isn't something you pay that much attention to unless it breaks.
here are the mounts in my '31 coupe. note that i cut it up a little bit -- the bolt holes that mount to the frame used to be verticle and now they're at a 45°.
The new flathead motor mounts from Speedway, part #78-6038-s came today, and since I was home for the day I modelled up the bracketry required to install them. I know you can buy a similar mount from Hurst, and I am aware of the controversy about using front mounts on a chev V8 that doesn't have mounts at the rear of the block. This is a freebee for a friend, he has the plate and the torches already. As this develops farther, I will make my own decision about the need for a secondery set of mounts on a chev V8 which will not be used as a drag car.
Does anybody have accurate dimensional information on a cross section thru a 350 block, right at the side mount bosses". I work in Solidworks 3D cad software, but can convert almost anything---or develop a dimensionally correct model from scratch. I don't really need any inside dimensions, just the outside of the block.---Thanks---Brian (I don't have a spare 350 block here, or I'd run out to the garage and measure it)
My friends car is not running a mechanical fuel pump. This design is not at this point "cast in stone". This is a "work in progress", and it may yet end up with secondery mounts off the bell housing area. It is not my intent to do a friend a favour, and by so doing cause his transmission to break. I had to go to a town near where he lives this morning, so I made up a pair of wooden brackets based on my design, and dropped them off at his place to do a trial fit and check for any clearance issues. I am not disregarding the advise from others on this column----I appreciate the advise, and am working towards a well engineered solution.---Brian
My 2 cents worth. I've seen this style front mounts before and the end results. There was a reason Hurst made both sides in a one part mount. Torque, 2-3/8" bolts on sheer, and cast iron threaded boss. The Wizzard
Wizard---plain to see there ain't no flies on you. I plan on using a plate to tie the two front mount plates together. There are some clearance isues to fit everything in between the front of the timing cover and the rear of the harmonic balancer, so I will make the front plates up, bolt them on, and then make up a tie plate that misses everything and welds to both of the bolted on mount plates.---Thanks---Brian
Hey Brian, next time you are at a show and see the big GM crate engine truck - walk up and grab their give away books, usually a catalog and performance guide. The performance guide has dimension drawings of various blocks. Handy book to have around. I'd offer up the measurements you are looking for, but would guess you already have 'em...
Yesterday I built mounts, and today I went out to my friends house and installed them. Everything went very well, however i am going to build a tie-plate that p***es under the timing cover and ties the two frontplates together to take the strain off the block casting. I checked today for space, and have decided to put a set of secondery mounts at the bell housing area to take some of the strain off the transmission tailstock.
Here is the tie-plate that will fit between the main motor mount plates and weld to them. It is 3/8" thick, and wraps right around the underside of the timing cover with 1/4" clearance all around. This does leave a ton of room around the vega steering box area.
I went out to my friends house today, and installed the tie plate between the two front mount plates (as showed in the previous post solid model). It fit fine, with no interferance. Everything is getting tacked into place with my friends 110 volt mig. When I am satisfied with the fit of everything, I will get him to blow the ***embled ch***is apart and then I will take my big Lincoln welder out to his place and finish weld everything. I measured the location of the turbo 350 mounting bolts in relationship to his frame, then came home and modelled up mounts for the rear of the engine/front of the turbo 350. His frame is 5" deep x 2" wide, and has a K-member made from 1" square tubing welded to the top and bottom of the frame. In my model, the light blue is a "to scale" representation of the turbo 350 mounting flange, and the purple is a "to scale" representation of his frame in the area I am dealing with. You can see the new plate brackets which I will make and install, and you can see that the brackets which attach to the frame will actually be supported between the top and bottom K-frame members.---this should be sufficient, as the lions share of the engine weight and torque will be taken up in the front mounts. These mounts at the rear of the block are "insurance" against putting too much stress on the bellhousing area of the aluminum turbo 350 case.
So---Today we built rear motormounts. I'll go out to my friends tonight and see if they fit. Nice background, eh??? What? Brag??/ Nah, not me!!!
Starting to like what I see here. There's a pretty good chance it'll stay together once you get her done. Good Job. The Wizzard
The mounts are installed and they look good and fit fine. The pictures I took aren't that good, but I will post a couple anyways. My friend has to take everything apart now so that I can manipulate the frame to get at all the different sides of it to finish weld everything with my heavy welder. Now if he wants to go drag race, he won't have to worry about the engine or transsmission moving or breaking the ******.
A big thank you to Mister Woodward for sending me a 2D cad model of a small block chev engine. I will convert that to a 3D cad model (solidworks) and make it available to anyone who needs it---Brian
nice work, did you leave the tail shaft mount on or just go with the front and middle mounts? I have been using my truck for 2 summers now with a big front mount and one at the tail shaft and no problems so far but its never far from my mind to change it
The Jalopy Journal
