Can you have a coil AND points?

Can't be... I don't know what the hell a Magneto (bad guy from X-Men!?) is either! lol

 

Also, I read somewhere that you can only properly lube points with grease from a T-Rex's balls, do they make synthetic T-Rex ball grease?

 

You have come far in such a short time Gr***hopper!!!

 

I know a lot of guys thinks I'm nuts, but I still prefer points over a Pertronics. Points are very reliable, easy to fix when needed, and I've NEVER had a points ignition completely fail out on the road. Can't say that about electronic distributors. Racing or high RPM of course points are obsolete, but for street use, plenty good enough.

 

Lol, thanks! I like it here. It is the perfect blend of smart-***es, dunb-***es, knowledge, and sarcasm. Think I will stick around for a while.....Steve Thanks for all of the help guys!

 

Packard Wood,
Before long you will be a god a**** half your peers. The other half will look at you like you are turning green, and wonder why you are "f-ing with that old piece of sh&t"!
Welcome to anachronistic machinery.

 

Ordered a Pertronix but going to learn the points (a cool thing to know, dieing art) and if the *******s will cooperate run them and other points in the future, and keep the pertronix for a fast install roadside back up. If they don't then I will be ordering a second Pertronix for backup as like people pointed out when points ****, you limp home, when electronics ****, you park! (not in to being parked!!) I know that a $90 Pertronix sounds like an expensive back up, until you consider what a tow truck charges! For anyone who just says **** it and goes electronic, or if like me you don't want to go thru the 39 step process of putting new points in at night in the rain and would prefer a 4 stepper here is the part number. The Pertronix 1281 is for ford 8's but they are designed to operate on a 12V Negative ground setup. It operates from 8v-16v so my 6V Positive ground '49 Packard doesn't have enough juice on it's best day to even turn the ******* on! So If you are in my situation you need the Pertronix 1281 P6 the "1281" is still for a ford (Auto-Lite) 8 but the "P6" is the one that is adapted to work on a "P"ositive ground "6" Volt setup. Pertronix 1281 P6 (bout $90 bucks) So I think that this is a damn good thread here fellas. It totally covers all of the info needed to master the mystery's of points while also providing the part numbers for those who just will not be converted to trying to keep the points, so, a good one! Thanks to all H.A.M.B.ers for all of the help! Steve

 

Yeah that is WHY I want to learn them, NONE of the dudes my age have ANY clue about them!
These days if you want your car to go faster you need a computer not a wrench...WTF!

 

remember if you do the electronic conversion you can go to modern better wires, several makers now make them in unmarked basic black so they look traditional

 

A great point! I just looked and Pertronix sells 7mm ones in plain Black. Even still I am still going to keep points AT LEAST long enough to prove to myself that I know how to use them. Gona road trip the hell out of this car so relaibillity is key. Whatever works!

 

If it won't run on points, it won't run on Pertronix. I'm placing my money on the category called "Other Problems". Don't know squat about Packards or how it could happen, but it sounds more like a timing issue.

6 volt systems did not spin the engine very fast, but not that slow. if your going that slow you might have a problem with adequate voltage.

Bill

 

Yeah I am not adding anything until I get it running again on the parts that it was parked with. (I don't think that points just die off in the night, I had JUST parked it!)otherwise every time I "threw a part at it" I am just adding one more variable of possible bad parts or poor installation. I have just talked my wife in to cooking breakfast (1:51pm EST), but after that I am going out there and it is on! I checked the fuel filter and it is good. I hear the electronic fuel pump kick on but next I am going to take the line off that goes to the carb, stick in a bottle and make sure, then hook it back up and look in the carb and verify that she it putin' out! I am thinking this might be a spark issue, so I will have the battery on charge while I am checking that stuff. I knida miss being able to blame it on "The damn computerized cars"...this one is all me and making me look bad! lol Maybe I can s**** 'er for enough to buy an '89 Honada Civic

 

So I have a real nice squirt pattern in my carb, clean AND fresh (Fuel, CHECK!), The air filter and top are it the trunk! (Air, CHECK!) I took the coil wire off and held it to a nut on the motor and had my little girl crank it over and it was tagging the bolt fast and strong! The spark was kinda yellow tho, should it be white or blue? Or not on a 6V setup? Then I put a new coil and tried to start it, still nada, then I swapped the original back on there. I put a new rotor and tried it, nada, then I swapped the original back on there. Could it be the points? It ran well at less than 2KRPM (rough above that) when I parked it two days ago, can points take a $hit while freakin' parked!!? I have spark at the plug, (I pulled one and put the wire on it and held it to the exhaust) So that means that the points are still doing their thing correct? WTF!?

 

The points may be working but the spark is weak . Are you sure you are getting
fuel to the cylinders? Or too much fuel. Pull a plug and see if they are wet?
Check for fire again by grounding one of the wires and the spark color should be
blue for a nice hot spark.

 

On it, be right back.

 

"These days if you want your car to go faster you need a computer not a wrench...WTF!"
That's why I don't work on my daily drivers.

 

Pulled the #2 plug and it didn't look flooded at all, The spark was looking pretty pitiful tho, from what I have gathered in the last few days, it the point gap is wrong it will not charge the capacitor for long enough which would result in the weak spark, correct? Also I had the charger on the battery and it said full, took it off to crank over the engine a few times to check the spark, put the plug back, hooked the battery back to the charger and it was back to like 20% I charged it overnight yesterday and same thing as now. I JUST bought that battery last week tho.

 

That's what is chapping my *** about this whole deal... I DO work on my 04 Chevy 2500 lifted, my wife's 02 Escalade, my neighbors Lincoln LS, Built a 388 Stroker for my buddies Monti that will lift the Front right wheel (576 ft lbs of torque!!!) with freakin' 24 inch rims on it but this dinosaur is kicking my ***. It is killing me!

 

OK, I am not sure if this has been covered in the 6 pages of this thread.

When points sit, they get a bit oxidized, and you need to freshen them up. Get a points file - from an auto parts store if you don't have one, this is one tool where you want to use the right one - and carefully file the points. Just enough to remove the oxidation. You do not want to try to get through the points surface (which is hardened), and you want to keep the file square so the points close flat against each other. Then, rotate the motor by hand until the rubbing block is at a high spot (top of the lobe) of the distributor cam. How far are the points open? You can set them by eye - the thickness of a thin dime. To adjust them, slightly loosen both screws and use a screwdriver in the 'twisting' slot or groove or notch and, by twisting the screwdriver, adjust the gap. Now lock down the screws being careful not to change the setting.

Lastly, give that car a 12 volt jump. Don't connect the last cable until you are ready to crank, and don't leave the cables connected when you are not cranking. Select ground connections away fro the battery terminals to preclude a spark that could ignite any hydrogen gas venting from the batteries.

 

Bad idea! If you want to try it on 12V, take the 6V battery out and replace it with a 12V, make sure all lights and accessories are off and disconnect the charging system. This can be done but do not jump 12V to 6V.

 

BING!!
Light bulb just went on!
I had a slant six that did just about all the things yours does. A real head scratcher.
Turns out the bearings were gone in the distributor. Had lots of side to side and up and down movement on the centre shaft. Figured it kept knockin' the points out of wack or moving the rotor enough to make poor contact.
Grab the rotor gently and see if you've got much movement.

 

This can be done succesfully as long as you make ABSOLUTLY CERTAIN you go positive(+) to positive and negative to negative. Just like any other car. NOT just "black to ground". Just dont leave them connected any longer than needed. Also make sure your battery cables are big enough. 2 guage or larger. This sounds like more of a timing issue to me. Bring the engine up to top dead center on the compression stroke and see if the rotor is pointing at the no.1 spark plug wire. If no pointee...no runnee. 6volt flathead inliners,gotta love 'em.

 

Okay, but I'll do it my way if the need arises. + to + is given in any jumping situation, 12V to 6V, not so much, lots of sparks.

 

Yes, you have to have a coil when you have points, but you don't have to have points with coil! The trigger for a coil can be electronic, so not always does a coil mean points. I have 3 cars with coils, but no points.

 

yeah! I grabbed the cap and it turned like a good 1/4 inch clockwise, but not back, the base is bolted down solid tho. Is this too much play? I cleaned all of the little wires that are in on the spark action, and rotor, inside br*** on cap, on the advice of a member of the Packard info site and it seemed to help some, it is attempting to fire now but it sounds like it is behind on the spark, should I mark where the distributor is now and advance it some and try it?

 

It ran when I parked it two days ago and I did not mess with the cap before having this issue, do you think I should advance the cap some"? Not too much, too much advance = backfire, and who knows if my old carb would appreciate that!

 

Another issue that is going to haunt you. The modern gas with its alcohol will dissolve rubber. Fairly soon you will have rubber gas hoses leaking and the fuel pump failing. The particles will clog up the carburetor. Leaking gas will cause fires. Watch for areas starting to get wet or leak. Just something else to remember brought to you by the EPA and the farm lobby.

Charlie Stephens

 

Thanks, the fuel line is 90% metal and the two places the it is rubber is a few inches both sides of the fuel filter and about a foot going from the electric fuel pump to the carb so the mechanical fuel pump is no longer in play. All of the rubber line in use is new. The carb does leak from like two or three different places and is DIRECTLY above the exhaust manifold. I want to have the car back to starting reliably before I rebuild it.

 

He meant to try to wiggle the rotor with the cap off. I doubt that this is your problem, though.

And despite what the naysayers proclaim, you can jump it on 12 volts. You charge a 6 volt battery with 8 volts. Just do it as I described.

 

Oh! No the rotor and cap is on there solid and the clips still have a solid click to them when snapped on there. Also I think that the clockways play is just the advance, due to the fact that it springs right back. I have it charging in between attempts and it turns her over as many times as I am willing to put the starter thru. It started three times but spit and sputtered and died and only wanted to do that at 3/4 peddle! Should I advance it some?