Let me start this off by saying that I know very little about engines. I have a 1973 Chevy Camaro 350 V8 in my rod. I did not build it, I bought it. The builder is no longer around. When checking the timing you plug into cylinder #1 on the driver's side and read the mark on the pulley. My friend and I did this, nothing showed up. So just for the heck of it, we put a chalk mark 180 degrees from the mark on the pulley and tried reading it on the left side of the engine. Sure enough, it could be read on there. What causes this and how can it be rectified? Thanks for your patience with this dummy. Larry
i'm not sure what you are asking...are you saying the timing marks on the harmonic balancer are off? to get #1 at TDC of the FIRING stroke...take off the right side valve cover. the rockers on #6 will be just rocking
#1 is on the left or drivers side , the front one after reading your first post again..i think you are using a timing light and can't see any timing marks on the harmonic balancer? the outer ring may have slipped
Actually #1 is the front plug wire on the drivers side. You may have a dampner that is NOT a mate to the timing mark on the timing cover. The easiest to "ME" is take #1 plug out, pull the wire out of the coil, and stick your finger into the plug hole. When you start to feel compression, as your friend ever so SLOWLY bumps the motor over, watch as the mark on the dampner comes around and when the compression "pops" your finger out of the hole, the motor is "just past" TDC. Then roll back the motor by hand so that the marks on the Balancer line up with the TDC marks on the timing cover marker. If they are off you may have to scribe a line on the balancer (or get the correct combination of balancer and timing marker) that corresponds with TDC on your marker. by "rocking" back and forth the motor by hand you should be able to find TDC (or pull and look at the rockers like suggested above) and make a mark on the pulley that lines up with the TDC timing marks. Also be sure you have the vacuum line off and plugged that goes to the vac*** advance from the carb!!! THAT will throw off the timing!! It is hard for me to type what I am thinking!! I hope this makes sense?!?! ANOTHER question while we are on the subject of timing... I time my engines the old fashioned way. tdc, then 4/8 degrees before or after depending on the book specs, YADA YADA YADA, but how do the timing lights work that have that dial on the back of them??? I have seen them but have NEVER used one??? I have access to one but is it neccesarry??? Ken
The rotor should be pointing to the #1 plug wire in the cap also. Anyone know if Chevys will run if the distributor is 180* off?
According to this web site: http://boxwrench.net/specs/chevy_sb.htm cylinder #1 is on the driver's side.
I think ONLY if you have a reverse rotation boat cam, I "don't" think it will actually fire and run 180 out?!?!?!
If you line up the timing mark on the balancer with the "0" mark on the timing tab, making sure that you are on the compression stroke as described above....does the rotor point to the #1 terminal of the distributor cap? If not, someone may have installed the distributor incorrectly and then re-routed the wires to get the thing running. So, now the #1 cylinder is not firing when the marks line up. You can pull out the distributor and re-install to line up correctly. It would be a big help to have Chilton manual or another book that shows the firing order and how the wires should be routed. The timing lights with the dial simply allow you to read the timing mark right on the zero mark on the tab, by dialing in the desired advanc/retard on the back of the timing light. It's not too important when setting timing at idle speed and only setting a few degrees before or after TDC. But if you are trying to set ttiming at high RPM with all the vacuum and mechanical advance kicked in, then you'd be reading off the tab (like around 36 degrees), so the dial is a big help then.
There is only one compression stroke for #1. when the air blows out of #1 you're on it. check the rotor, it should be pointed at #1. put the cap on it as close as possible. it should run. I'm sure there are some old timers that will say to rev it all the way up and advance it until it starts to run bad and then back it off and its good. thats how a lot of people do it.
Yeah I do it that way too, but since he was "unfamiliar" with motors I didn't want to suggest that, an engine "poppin, and backfiring" 20 degrees out while "timing by ear" is a detonation problem for a new guy, but what you said is true with us older "pre" computer cars!!!...Ken
if the #1 piston is at top dead center, then the timing mark should be lined up with the pointer. It doesn't matter whether it's on #1 firing or #6 firing! since they both are at TDC at the same time. Although the distributor needs to be installed so that the #1 wire is getting juice when the # 1 cylinder is at the end of the compression stroke. Anyways, it sounds like the engine does run, so that's not the issue here. If the pointer does not line up with the timing mark when #1 is at TDC, then the damper is slipping (outer ring slipping on inner hub, ie loose rubber cushion), or the key is sheared or missing, or it's the wrong damper. The dampers were only made with about 45 degrees difference over the years, so that probably isn't it. Also it's possible that you are using a timing light with the dial or numbers on the back of it, if so make sure that it is set to ZERO! if it's set to a large number of degrees, you won't see the mark where it should be
Don't know if anyone has asked yet or not but is it running smoothly with the timing like this or does it backfire alot? They will run a little at 180 out but they don't run smooth.
IT WON"T RUN 180o OUT!!period!! So something else is ****ed up.Do the "old" "6 cyl at Valve over lap trick.Then #1 will be at TDC.Another question does it have a chrome timing chain cover ? Some SBC's got timed at the top("12 o'clock") while some got timed at about 2 O'clock( looking form the front. A sure way to time it is to put #6 cyl on valve over lap then thread a long bolt into number 1 cyl.TURN IT BY HAND till 1 hits the bolt& but a mark on the damper then TURN IT BY HAND the other way till it hits again, Mark the damper( both times at the same point on the marker) measure the center of your 2 marks & thats your timing mark set it at 8o from that mark & forget everything you ever heard about timing!!lol JimV
Ahhh, having performed this experiment, re: 180 degrees out, I'm with Jim! They don't like to run when the rotor fires the number one cylinder, when the valves are overlapped!
You didnt say whether or not this engine was running when you did this. Is it running or are you trying to get it timed to start it? It wont run 180 deg out so if your trying to get it timed correctly to start it then it sounds like the distributor is 180 deg off. IF so take off the dist. cap, note the direction the rotor is pointing, take the hold down bolt and clamp off, raise up the dist. noting that it will rotate a bit when you lift it up. note where it points when it quit rotating, turn it 180 deg from this point and put it back in. It will rotate little bit as you slide it in so make sure its pointing 180 deg from where you started when its all the way in. If all the answers you got confused you dont feel bad. Ive been doing this for 40 years and these guys confuse me too. Im sure most if not all of them know what there doing just the same as me. I would suggest finding the post that makes the most sence to you in your situation and sending that guy a PM.
The engine is running and it is driveable. If you try to read the timing on the harmonic balancer mark you see nothing. If you put a mark on the balancer 180 degrees from the factory mark you can see it, but then you have to read it from the p***enger side of the vehicle. I guess it is like the harmonic balancer is mounted 180 degrees off. Does that make sense?
Get it to TDC first ( the finger over the #1 plug hole works real good) then check where the mark on the balancer is. That should tell you if it's 180 off...Either mark the balancer at TDC or use some balancer tape. You have to use the right tape for the diameter of your balancer. This doesn't look cool, but if you have a cheapo timing light like me, you can make adjustments real easy. Good luck.
When checking the timing you need to have the vacuum advance on the dist unhooked and plugged. Have you done this? Where is the timing tab on the timing cover located? 12:00 position or 2:00. GM used two setups .
If the pointer does not line up with the timing mark when #1 is at TDC, then the damper is slipping (outer ring slipping on inner hub, ie loose rubber cushion), or the key is sheared or missing, or it's the wrong damper. The dampers were only made with about 45 degrees difference over the years, so that probably isn't it. Also it's possible that you are using a timing light with the dial or numbers on the back of it, if so make sure that it is set to ZERO! if it's set to a large number of degrees, you won't see the mark where it should be (note: if this sounds like a repeat, that's because it is)
Balancer has slipped or it has the wrong balancer for the timing cover. I have had it happen to me a couple of times. This is why when I am building an engine, I mark true TDC on the balancer and paint it white so its easy to see. You wouldn't believe how many balancers are off. I use the piston stop method. Verify the timing light is working correctly and you are on the drivers side front cylinder.
You just may have a later balancer on the motor try pointing your timing light down through the center of the water pump between the timimg cover and the water pump.and if you see the timing mark than they put the wrong timing cover on the motor Or the wrong balancer. only other thing is that your balancer sliped.Good luck.
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