I'm looking at building a model a roadster . All I want to start with is the cowl frame and front axle . Here is my problem I find a lot of cowls with tags but I don't know how to tell if it's from a truck a four door car or a two door car ... Is there an easy way to tell?
With model As, there are generally two types of cowl, open car and closed car. In 28 & 29 there were quite a few bodies built by coach builders other than Ford. The 28/29 fordors & cabriolets have a cover over the fuel tank that makes them look similar to the 30/31 models but just enough different to confuse you. Open cars all have stanchion mounts for the windshield frame and the closed car A pilars are solid all the way to the top of the windshield. Closed cars are all set up for doors with roll up windows and most of the open cars use short doors with side curtains for weather protection.
Ok let me be more clear how do I tell a two door cowl from a truck or for door cowl by the codes on the firewall tag? I'm looking to build a two door and if I buy just a cowl it won't have papers and I have to use that tag to get papers.
There is no "tag" on the cowl thay will provide anything but patent data. The serial number is on the frame, and is/was on the engine. If you find a cowl tah with a serial number, it is fake. Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
Even that serial number is just that, a SERIAL number. It doesn't decode to anything. Model A engines left the engine plant with sequential numbers. They were shipped to the manufacturing plant, where they were placed in the ch***is. A worker then copied that serial number on to the frame, before the body was installed. About the only thing the number indicates is the approximate date that the engine was finished. Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
Yeah, but neither a Murray or Briggs body is a likely candidate for this build, so the reference, while handy, is likely irrelevant. Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
The tag on model a cowls, as said tells you nothing as to the type of body, except on Murray and Briggs bodied sedans, which are an entirely different animal as far as both the tags and cowls go. A roadster cowl is the exact same as a phaeton or roadster-pickup frame. A coupe cowl is the same as a Tudor, pickup or commercial-truck cowl. This goes for 28/29 and 30/31 cars. The only odd ones out are the various 'special' bodies built by the afore mentioned subcontractors, and some of the more rare cars built by ford, ie woodies and such. Again, as said before, the serial numbers were only ever stamped on the engines and frames. And they are just a serial number. The only real info you can derive from thes numbers is a ball-park date that the engine was ***embled, as they are purely sequential. Posted using my Lil' Orphan Annie Secret Society Decoder Pin
Sorry I was once told that tag held all the information for the car. So for the build I plan most any cowl would work . So from what your saying I need the number on the frame and or engine to get papers for the car? Is that correct? I'm in ny.
The '28/'29 closed-cab truck is NOT the same as the sedans, or othersm The '28/'29 closed-cab pickup uses Model T doors. Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
I've never lived in NY, but I know west coast guys get their phony ***les there because you have no ***les for old cars. Just a bill of sale and an old registration slip will get you going. If your building a fairly original car (i.e. a stock frame) buy a frame with numbers. If your building a modified ( custom frame ) I'm not sure of the NY rules to ***le a custom car. Out here if you have all the receipts you can get an ***embled or street rod ***le. Your state DMV will be the final authority. Tell us more about your plans. You say you want to build a roadster, then ask how to identify a closed car cowl. Are you doing a coupster? What about the rest of body? Even rusty original parts are getting expensive, unless you have a buddy that is willing to share his stash. You can take a day & drive over to Brookville. A big chunk all at once, but you will have a better chance to finish and the incentive of that investment than scrounging rusty parts for 5 years.
My plans are to build the body from the cowl back by hand so I just want a cowl and frame . Now I just need to know how get papers for the frame o buy.
Check out Old Tin Dealer in Voorheesville, NY. They usually have piles of frames and sheet metal parts. Since it's a business, I'm sure you would get a nice, clean receipt that would go far to help you get registered.
I have found a '31 frame . Where do I find the numbers? Can I use these numbers to get papers for the car?
Frame serial was actually under left body sill, so look considerably abaft the steering about where the pedals would be on top of left rail. That is the original serial for a car...but there are of course historical pitfalls: I posted this recently... Bluto was once on here talking about a famous Bugatti race car that was heavily damaged in action and broken up for parts. Engine, frame, and various chunks of shrapnel were all eventually found by different people, "restored" with lots of fabricated pieces as values of everything shot up, and now there are three of this individual famous racer. Think of a Model A...motor is discarded in 1936 for a rebuilt, old motor goes through several life cycles, and now reaches a HAMBER who rebuilds it again and ***les his car to that block number. The actual car lives on, and then is sold to a streetrodder. He sells the ch***is to another HAMBER who, quite legitimately since he has the actual car, uses the frame number to ***le his rod. The streetrodder, even though he has only a body, goes to ***le it with a Speedway ch***is using the original ***le that he kept back from the frame sale... In an interesting collision of Karmas, they wind up in the same line at the DMV with their registration applications in hand...the resulting conversation eventually requires intervention by the National Guard...
So I need to find numbers on the top of the drivers side frame rail about where the cowl sat is this correct?
Yes, and then you need to contact your DMV, and make sure that the number is clear. Posted using the Full Custom H.A.M.B. App!
I found this about registering a custom built car in NY. Seems like a lot of hoops to jump thru. http://dmv.ny.gov/forms/vs100.pdf.
....what ever state your in go to the DMV web site of that state and there you will find what you have to do to get a ***le....from my searching I found that it is very hard to get a car ***led without a vin number and or a ***le,...the state of Maine was one of the easy ones but not any more...you will find that without a vin number you are dead in the water....In New Jersey a bill of sale for a car is useless...
Sometimes the numbers were not stamped very deeply which makes them hard to locate. If you sand on it, do it lightly so as not ot remove much metal. They start with a star stamp followed by an A then the sequential number followed by another star. If it is a 31 then it will have a very high number. This site has a good number chart. http://www.fordgarage.com/pages/ABenginenumbers.htm#C1
Go here. SEMA has packets you can download/print for each state. http://www.bipac.net/page.asp?content=tag_***le_toolbox&g=SEMAGA
I wouldn't rely on that website. The rules in Texas change every 6 months so I doubt it's up to date. Just go thru a local ***le company....easy as it gets
Where on the engine do I find the numbers... I'm going to look at a running rolling ch***is . No body eccept the cowl . So if it has the engine and I can read the numbers it may be mine
I don't know why I'm spending my time on this. I only took a few minuets to search the sister site, Ford Barn, to find this. '32 numbers are on the back, Model A are indeed on the side of the block.
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