can someone tell me what the major differences, if any, there are in a 1960 389 and a 1961 389? in my quest for parts, i keep running into no parts for a 60, but all i could ever want for the '61. can i use a 61 intake on my 60? how bout a starter? reason i ask is the parts guys tell me one thing, then i had one guy "in the know" tell me they were the same. any help would be greatly appreciated!
I've wondered the same damn thing myself. a 3x2 setup w/carbs for a 61 sold for cheap on ebay, but i didn't know what else it would fit so I let it slide.
hey, theres one on there now i'd like to get, but again it's for a 61. i actually have a new edelbrock 4 barrel intake that came with the car, but it's listed in the book as a 61-64 application. wanna put it on, but..... did i buy an oddball pontiac year or what???
As far as I know, which ain't THAT far there is no difference in 389 from '59 (first year) thru late '60s versions EXCEPT for the R.A engines which came with different heads, intakes etc. '61 was the first year for the 421 but it's just 389 with a bigger bore and stroke. Tri power was an option from '59 up. Check out these places. Should be able to answer your questions. Hope this helps. http://www.pontiacserver.com/ http://www.poci.org/ - there is a forum there to ask questions. Did you know Mickey Thompson had HEMI heads for Pontiacs for sale in '61? They got banned from the race tracks though...
According to Hollanders the 59-60 shared the same block but there are 2 bolt and 4 bolt mains versions as well as using both flat top and recessed pistons. Oil pump fits those years only. And it goes on and on; intakes are different between even 59 & 60. Altho the 60 fits 59 the 59 wont fit 60??? 61 and up are different again with lots of 1 and 2 year limits. My 64 GTO (bought new) couldnt even use regular 64 389 bearings, they HAD to be for a 64 HD 421. It took a fuckin 10 days and a mess of phone calls right up the food chain to get them. That GTO was the biggest PITA I ever owned when it came to parts availability.
The first two pontiac 389's (59 and 60) are unique to themselves. However many parts will innerchange. (that includes parts back to 55. The intakes fit from 1955 to 1964 and 1965 to 1977. Thats as far into new stuff I want to even think about. Hope this helps. P.S. I'm in the need for another 59 or 60 bare block if any are up for grabs. ------------------------------------------------- "OPOSSUM BENDERS" Central Missouri Chapter
I forgot to mention the starter. A 61 won't bolt up to a 59 or 60. The 59 and 60 have a different bellhouse and engine block bolt pattern at the rear. -------------------------------------- OPOSSUM BENDERS "Central Missouri Chapter"
55-59 used an intake with the front water outlets back about a half inch from the 60-63 intakes. the fuel runners are all in the same position though. it is possible on some after market intakes to alaign the water outlets with a die grinder and weld up the aluminum were the outlet used to be in effect just moving them back a little. you will have to have the intake to head area resurfaced or if you know someone with a big belt sander you can do it that way. there's a local guy with a bone stock 59 but he's running a 60 and up edelbrock intake with these mods it's his daily driver weather permiting and has been so for a couple years, the car runs great and doesn't over heat at all. you can also interchange the heads with early 60s ones they just bolt right up, except the exhaust manifolds, but you have to watch compresion ratio in some instances. this might be easir if you are thinking about rebuilding your engine. it seems there are alot of poncho guys on here me included(29 model a w/ a 59 389) iv'e got a early 60's pontiac performance hand book by hot rod mag that covers all the 55-63 pontiac engines. i wanted to get alot of it scanned for tech week but haven't had much time. i'll try and get it up here before the weekends over. this thing covers just about everything from interchange to specs on mickey thompsons race engines. anyways good luck with the project
hey wasasedan, thanks for the info. any thing from that book you can pass along would be great. i'm also building a 31 tudor sedan that i'd like to drop a 389 in. be kinda cool to run the same motor in the hotrod and in the bubbletop.
Wasasedan that teck book sounds real good. I would like to see it for sure. The info I gave on the intake innerchanges by the way came from a 1977 offenhauser catalog. Stock intakes may be different. It seems the early poncho's are overlooked by many. There are really great buys on intakes and other misc pieces. Wasasedan, your ride looks good man. I'm putin a 60 block together including a very rare edelbrock x-1 6x2 intake. Have you every heard of or seen the slanted valve covers that were casted by Mickey Thompson? I understand they were for and used on the Challenger for clearence between the engines? ---------------------------------------------------------- "OPOSSUM BENDERS" Central Missouri Chapter
The best message board for Pontiac tech info can be found here: www.performanceyears.com ----- Bart -----
Hey... Why not run a 455 ? Call it a 389....Can build um cheep.. hell we even made the tunnel ram for mine.. For right now tis a "street racer" special.. Pontiac Slim"
visor those intakes are cool,mlp-61 right, i was origionally going to run one of those after a friend julio blew up his motor in his roadster and gave me a deal on one, but got lucky and found a wieand drag star for the earlier engine and am going to run that instead, saves having to change heads on the just rebuilt engine. next project in line a old thames will get the other intake if i can ever get any time to finish the a. hopefully i can get the book scanned and up here soon, gotta get the old suburban ready for the mooneyes show on sat. but i'll get it up here asap
There's anaother difference between intakes on 55-60 and 61-64...it's the coolant passage at the front, center of the intake on the 61-64's. The 55-69's don't have it. I'm talking about the passage that butts up against the 61-up aluminum water pump housing. and is held in place with that pesky long 5/16ths bolt through a slot in the water pump housing. It threads into the intake. If you try to put the 61 and later intake on a 60-down, the coolant passage boss would run into the back side of the 60 and earlier water pump housing, which isn't able to accept the necessary rubber O-ring seal...it's made all wrong..
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