Do Old Style Cheater Slicks Hook?

I like the look, but do they actually put power to the ground any better than a radial?

It'd be neat to see a real world ET comparison. Magazine guys, you listening?

 

Fuck no! My touring spun like it was on snow at MOKAN. Ever see the vid of Ryan gettin it on in hs 38? Sure, they look cool................thats why the Touring gets Cheaters and the drag car gets real slicks!

 

Tony, like Tman says, "they're just for show."
I dug out an old set - donated actually - for a friend's old timey rail. (they even had white side walls!)

When he pulled up to the line and popped the clutch, they just sat there and smoked. Think the rubber was just too hard.

 

These are looking like a better option. Not as traditional, but why spend money on motor work and not go anywhere?

Tman, can you get the link to that video? I've never seen it.

 

Even a Mickey Thompson Sportsman Pro (not regular Sportsman) might get you out of trouble.

 

I soaked an old pair in VHT and another unnamed compound (cause I don't trust a few of you out there who are reading, not you posters though cause you are much smarter than that) for one week. These were well stored (wrapped and in thick black plastic bags stored indoors) but old ones I had from a long, long time ago.

They were pretty supple and seemed like they would work ok. Mounted and tried em in the driveway and needless to say they went up like a popcorn fart in the dry fall leaves. This was even after a good heat up proceedure enveloping the neighbors house before trying the first launch. Had em set at 8 psi.

Now that doesn't mean they are all bad, but set of new G.Y's and she hooks like hell.

Your mileage may vary.

 

Sports pros work pretty well. Regular sportman suck for traction. Best that I can find so far for my application on the street is the pros.

Cops really look funny at slicksand they handle like crap around corners as well in the rain. However for very short cruise and starting trouble with the local import kiddies, slicks are kind of fun and the way to go IMHO.

 

Bones-

Like so many questions, the answer isn't necessarily simple.

No way traditional "cheaters" are gonna hook like modern-day wrinkle wall slicks, or perhaps even as well as some of the current radials. But compared to what else was available in the '50s and early '60s, they were a noticable improvement.

The early "cheater" recaps (Bruce, etc.) with the "pie-crust" sidewalls were generally better than standard bias-plies - mostly because of additional width and softer rubber - but just marginally so. Even back then, some guys preferred street tires (Atlas Bucrons, for example), 'cause the tread area over the "pie-crust" cutouts at the outside of the cheaters didn't do much. They seemed to wear mostly in the center - and somewhat unevenly on the outer edges (indicating rubber just "flopping" around without providing traction).

Later, as re-capping (and tire casing) technology advanced, the cheaters got better. Casler's were a popular brand that worked pretty well - especially on the comparitively heavy stockers and super stockers - who's weight helped push the treads onto the track surface (if they had their rear suspension set up right, that is).

Once the tire mfgs. went to purpose-built cheaters (essentially racing slicks with a couple narrow grooves cut in them), things got better yet. It wasn't long after that though, that the sanctioning bodies just went ahead and leagalized regular slicks for all classes. The cheaters faded pretty quickly then - except for the occassional street application, where guys wanted to have a slick type tire, but still be "legal" on the street.

Bottom line - Old tires are always gonna provide marginal traction compared to new rubber, 'cause it just doesn't stay supple forever. But ...I'd bet there are still a few good "cheater-style" tires out there (again - compared to street treads of equal tread width), if you shop carefully.

 

The question I haven't seen asked or answered yet is how do tires like the new Radirs hook?
I saw Garlits run an easy 9 in one of his restored Swamp Rats a few years ago. How do the NEW cheater slicks hook?
Are people really using old tires they've had forever or found in a basement, and expecting them to hook at the track today?
If I've misunderstood the question or missed the point of the post, I apologize.

-Brad

 

Even old style slicks - real dragstrip oriented slicks as compared to cheater slicks - didn't work all that well on the street.

Drag strip driving on slicks took a bit of an educated foot in that you'd try to leave with minimal wheelspin and when the slick started biting you could roll in more throttle.
More than a few guys had the slicks go up in smoke when they got a little nervous, exuberant or anything but calm.

They were a little better than street tires, but not a whole lot.

Different story when the wrinkle-walls came along.
They bit pretty good right off the line.


When little brother got his drag racing Henry J running, stock frame, engine setback 10%, 12" wide slicks we found the slicks didn't bite at all in his long asphalt driveway. (Which was comparable to the nearby two lane highway.)

At the strip the slicks worked pretty well.
He started out in the 12's and got down to the low elevens fairly quick.

After a swap to an Alston tube frame with ladder bars and installing 14" slicks the car started running mid tens and after another engine was swapped in it ran low tens and started knocking on the nines.

I ran a pair of cheater slicks back in the day, but they didn't seem to hook as well as regular street tires.
Probably because the street tire had a fairly soft compound and the cheater seemed to have a harder compound.

Tire and chassis science has gotten to the point nowadays where wheelspin is virtually nil.
I would guess that this same chassis/tire combo would spin the tires badly on the street.

Just like Daytona, dragstrips seem to have a 'blue groove' where the slicks bite well.
Get off to one side on a dragstrip to avoid a starting line oil down and there's not much rubber embedded there and a poor start is almost a given - provided you're running some serious horsepower.

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

Keep in mind you don't want to run low pressures in a radial street slick.
The long footprint is what gives these their bite and if the pressures are too low the middle of the tire will not be contacting the pavement as they should.

I'm not sure what the pressures should be on these.
I believe the manufacturer can make some good recommendations.

 

Brad, my tirees are Hursts. I bought them 2 years ago from Speedway. They simply dont hook very well. Every car with Hursts,Radirs etc at MOKAN was spinning madly. I think finked had the fastest car there on Cheaters, he was in the 13s with those checker flag treads (dont quote me on thse details)

 

My hurst pie crusts will not hook at all but make a good street tire, I drive them on the strets and they look bitchin but use m/t 10 1/2 15s by 29 1/2 and they hook great............on the strip ........even spun them several times at mokan till we got some rubber down.....

 

At the Hot Rod and Restoration trade show I saw these in the Coker booth. I've never used them, but they felt plenty soft to hook a 11-12 second hot rod.

 

Old "style," not old. I mean newly made cheater slicks from companies like Hurst and Radir.

I'd really like to see samIyam run the BFD w/ cheaters to see what the difference in ET's would be. His car is a little lighter than what I'm schemeing on...but similar beyond that.

 

i have found that cheater slicks are just for the look and hook the same as the same size street tire. On my 64 vette i run a m&h 11" dot aproved street slick and pull the front wheels on the street. the hoosers are also really good and sticky but some dont like the tread pattern on the dot aproved ones

borken stubaxle was on the street.

 

NO.... I have a set of the Hurst cheater slicks from Speedway (I ground my own whitewalls in them ).

As someone said they make great everyday street tires, but are a little wide I think. Seem also to wear more in the middle no matter the air pressure.
I was amazed in how well they held in the rain .

 

We just got a set of Hurst Slicks from Cody, from Adams Hot Rod Rubber. To try on the street and strip. And to give feedback as to how we like them. We will report as we go along. As a side note, we used to "sipe" them as Les Schab(sp) does, to make them work in the rain. But that was about 1962? Remember these are "cheater slicks" They are not slicks! But I like the look on the look on the rite car! We will report later............OLDBEET

 

I have Hurst slicks on my Model A (not cheaters) and they seem to hook pretty good. I dont know if there is a different compound between the slicks and the cheaters.
Jimmy White

 

I have the wide m/t radir slicks and they didnt hook at all. My car isnt a race car by any means though so i didnt by them to hook at the strip. They do pretty good on the road. Even though they arent terrible bad in the rain, i still dont recomend anticipating rain when driving on them.

The reason the tire wear is in the middle is because the wheel is too skinny. I got a 10 inch wheel for a 10 inch tire and it wears pretty evenly. If you want it to wear more evenly and not just in the middle buy a wider wheel than what you have.

Picture taken by Crow and Beky

Nick

 

Do this, take some white shoepolish. Make a stripe across your front tires and across the tread of the rears. Drive around the block. Look at the white. If it is only worn off in the center, too much pressure. Adjust your pressure down until you are using all the tread. I am running 21 pounds in the rear and 25 in the front of my T.

For the record, even the slick guys had traction problems on the new surface at MOKAN. THat said, Ryan was spinning his Hursts the last two years on decent traction.

 

I picked up a set second hand from NW speed. They hook up alot better than my Coker bias plys did, but that aint saying much. I was suprised how smooth they run. 80 with the slicks feels like 60 on the Cokers.

 

Crease, I agree. My 54 AND my T felt great and predictable with the same cheaters on both. Even with the spin.

 

Look at these things in person...they have a high crown...saw a nostalgia Anglia eat the wall at Lakeland, FL with these things...not safe, IMHO

 

I think those are Firestones and Coker carries them. They look like bald snow tires to me. haha.

Nick

 

The new surface wasn't yet preped for the faster cars.... Once some rubber is layed down, and some glue is sprayed, all will be fine...

 

Saw a dragmaster chassied digger in Bradenton a few years ago with repop cheater slicks and a mild blown 392, on gas with carbs. It was like driving on ice. Even way down track blipping the gas would create instant tire smoke. And this was on a very sticky track. Obviously that isn't the application the cheaters are designed for.

For those that ran them at Mokan, did they hook any better at the end of the day? Even though I was spinning the tires pretty good, 60 ft times weren't bad early in the day, and improved by nearly a tenth by the last run.

 

Dave, mine were the same all day. And like I said, in years past, Ryan was spinning them on a track with gobs of rubber and VHT on it.

 

The TRACK at Lakeland, Fl isn't safe!!! I used to live in Lakeland--I ran there ONCE and wouldn't run it again on a bet.
I'm not saying anything one way or another on the tires--they may have contributed, I don't know, I wasn't there. But I don't think ANY car would be a safe ride at Lakeland.
-Brad

 

I'm bringing this back up because I plan to buy a pair of ww cheaters in the next week to use on my gasser project.

I'm mostly(95%)using them in street application, but may hit the track once or twice a year for some grudge matches.

I like the radir 8.20-15's.

So is the general opinion that these are plenty good enough on a street car?

I thought about the Coker versions, but hear alot of questionable stuff about them.

I want my tires and the rims I'm using before I hack up the quarters.