Well ive been attempting to build the frame for my truck. Obtained some 2x4x .188 rect tubing, I know it's a bit thick but it was free. Kept the old frame and tried to copy some of the bends in it that are under the cab and tried to get a kickup in the front. Yuk!! My welding skills really bite not to mention the 2 rails probably arent the same. I think the 120volt mig im using doesnt have enuff power to get full penetration on this heavy wall. Being as how my life is in this frames hands, thought Id visit a local frame builder, he says throw away the 2x4 go with 2x3 .120 wall which he will graciously throw in if I pay him $1400 for a frame. Yeep! Makes my wallet squeek! Just kinda whining to you guys I guess. Guess I'll try and build a jig and try and make things more accurate and look into hiring a welder for a day after I tack it up. Hopefully the desire to work on the ride that Santa brought will carry the day.
If you bevel the all the edges,you should be able to tack it together, then drag it to any welding shop for final welding.
$1400 really is'nt that much for a frame. depending, ofcourse, on what is all included and the complexity of it. ever priced out a good QUALITY set of duece rails?? YOUCH!!
i said GOOD ones just kiddin. thats not a bad price. now put the rest of the frame together. i guess it really depends on how detailed of a frame you want too. i'm used to hanging around Hotroddrummer's shop and they do HIGH QUALITY traditional looking (usualy) chassis and they usually have ALOT of hours into them. custom motor mounts, suspensions and other detail oriented pieces. really neat stuff but if your happy with a tube frame (and there is nothin wrong with it if it is built well) then your prolly now as concerned with all that stuff. i just plan to build a tube frame for my roadster but my model A phantom pickup is getting a completely custom chassis designed to look as if it were made from the factory. all made from flat stock with a custom built Ford style X-member, pinched and streatched in the front. pinched and kicked up in the rear. i can't wait to start on it.
THANK GOD you have enough sense to realize your life and other peoples lives are in the hands of your welding skills, you wouldnt belive all the***** buckets runnin around california with people that dont undersand this, 1,400 is a lot of money to you yes,... but the welder has to set it up, and squre everything ,and your also paying shop rate, if you tack it all together that is the best way to approach what your trying to do.... after its tacked your welder will probely only have a couple of hours in it... big savings!!!! the tubing should only cost you around 100.00
good point THIRTYTWO. shop rate is anywhere from $30 per hour to to "OH MY GOD"!!! so yeah, you could save yourslef a TON of money by doing what you can yourself.
OH!!!! buy the way, buy tex smiths new book on chassis fab, its well written and very informative... the bigest thing to fab work is making things fit right to begin with, dont try to fill holes and big gaps.... and get a good 220 welder its hard to pickup good habits when you are making up for the disability of the welder , a good miller will set you back about what the guy was going to charge you to do it
.180? ******! I'm runnin 2x4x.250! I even paid for it! That's just under the cab for crash protection tho. I've got it milled down at the ends to have the .180 slide over and take end and plug welds to run elsewhere under the truck. For the time I've got in mine so far I wouldn't expect someone to make one (right) for anything less than dude toldja, 2x3's a bit small for a truck tho! Was just discussing it witha friend tonite who thought he could get a local builder to subrame his truck for some crazy low price...
Your using this under a 46 GMC!?!? Personally I don't see the attraction people have for 2x3 tubing. OK for a bucket or other light rod but for something as heavy as a pickup? I wouldn't even consider it myself! He wants to use it 'cause he can just chop saw and weld it. I can see the dollar signs in buddys eyes from here! If I were building a frame for a truck I'd use 2x6x3/16 and taper the front. Yeah its heavier...but THATS the idea! Don't fall into the trap of beauty before function. Not that a little 2x3 frame on a 46 would be beautiful! Thick, tapered rails like a 32 would look much better in my opinion. Seeing as how you have the 2x4 and its nice and thick...do as Unkl says and then get it pro welded. You'll have something you can trust then! That extra inch will make a big difference in the looks as well! Bill
DreamWeaver- Your 110V welder should be able to weld .188 wall tubing (if it's a good brand name unit)if you bevel the edges like Unkl Ian said. I built a frame with 2x3 .188 wall tubing with my Hobart 110V unit and it worked just fine. If you feel unsure of your skills, tack it then take it to someone to finish weld it.
Hacker is right! Don't skimp on strength...the larger the vehicle, the more frame strength is required. 2x3 is fine for "T" buckets and even "A" bones, but after that you need to go up to 2x4 - 2x6. Glenn
$1,400.00 hmm.. if a guy could sell one a week he just might scrape by.. It may be more than you might spend but, it's Not more than you would charge, is it? Paul
Thanks for the responses guys, always nice to hear other folks ideas. The reason I like the 2x4 is that overall this will be a rather large fenderless pu, the 46 cab is huge by model A etc standards and with the big block the overall effect will be a somewhat large car. I think part of the problem I had when tacking the bits together is that the lens in the hood is way too dark, all I could see was the arc flash and none of the material, gonna go talk to a local welding shop and a buddy that's a pipe welder and see what they think. I'll head off to Loewes and buy some wood to make a chassis jig so I at least can try and make the 2 main frame rails identical and then just tack it together, then I'll either take it to a welder or have one of them portable welding guys come by and finish weld it.
[ QUOTE ] I built a frame with 2x3 .188 wall tubing with my Hobart 110V unit and it worked just fine. [/ QUOTE ] I'm not trying to bust Roach's chops, but the idea of riding in or anywhere near a vehicle sitting on a frame that was welded together using a 110 MIG unit is terrifying.
CurtSix- I can understand that it "seems" scarry, but picture this......in over 25 years of building off-road cars built with a 110 volt mig welder (or AC buzz box), those tube frames have been bounced, wrecked, and turned over and I have never had one have the weld break. Period.
Dreamweaver, For $1400 you might be able to get art morrison to build you rails. Don't quote me on that. I like the idea of building my own frame better. what are you doing for a front axle? I am using the front half of my stock 41 frame and suspension and extending from the trans x member back starting with a z section cut from plate and boxed that will attach to a new rear section made from 2x6 rec. tube. But I am also running fenders and stovebolt so that factored in to my decision.
I know were your coming from Paul but man...its only 2x3 he's talking about! IF the frame were finished to the point of being a bolt everything on deal for 1400.00, then yeah...maybe! But the way I'm reading this is that buddy is gonna make a chop saw 2x3 frame that our guy will finish! Thats too much money for something that a crafty guy could put together in one day. The truck will be fenderless and the rails can be parallel! WHERES all the work in that? I think we're just talking a basic "T Bucket" style frame here, not a repo that will work under a stock Chevy pickup. I could be wrong but it seems a high price to me...even in Loonies! Bill
I really don't understand why you'd want to waste the time and energy on building a frame for a 50's pickup... didn't it come with a frame? Why not buy a front cross member that will adapt newer front a-arms and stuff onto your original frame... that alone is enough to frustrate any new welder/fabricator wanting to learn this stuff... i.e. if you were having trouble the first time making a couple of frame rails... just welding in an aftermarket front cross member is probably a little more in line with you skills as a builder... I mean, I've built several cars... several 50's and 60's pickups... and let me tell you... there's a***** LOAD of stuff to hang on the frame... rear suspension, front suspension, engine mounts, trans mounts, exhaust system hangers, gas tank, core support mount, front bumper brackets, rear bumper brackets, body mounts, bed mounts, check clearence for inner fender braces... what kind of front suspension are you planning on stuffing under this thing? You got to think about track width etc... steering box mount crossmembers for strength... I mean, almost any****** could lay a couple of frame rails out on the garage floor... maybe kick them up in the rear and the front... but jeezus... that's about a tenth of the overall work... I think the thing to do would be to talk to ElPolack-o... last time I was at his shop he had a scratch built frame for an F-100 fgoing together on the frame table... ask him what it takes... then go shopping for parts to modify your existing frame. Sam.
a fenderless '46 GMC? why does this sound familiar? doesn't DrJ have a fenderless '40 GMC? bigger than what you have planned and on a stock frame? does every line have to end with a question mark? Paul?
[ QUOTE ] I really don't understand why you'd want to waste the time and energy on building a frame for a 50's pickup... didn't it come with a frame? [/ QUOTE ] Well its a 46 not a 50s and i dont want the parallel leaf springs. I want a transverse one. [ QUOTE ] Why not buy a front cross member that will adapt newer front a-arms and stuff onto your original frame... [/ QUOTE ] I want a stright axle not a-arms. [ QUOTE ] I mean, I've built several cars... several 50's and 60's pickups... and let me tell you... there's a***** LOAD of stuff to hang on the frame... rear suspension, front suspension, engine mounts, trans mounts, exhaust system hangers, gas tank, core support mount, front bumper brackets, rear bumper brackets, body mounts, bed mounts, check clearence for inner fender braces... what kind of front suspension are you planning on stuffing under this thing? You got to think about track width etc... steering box mount crossmembers for strength... [/ QUOTE ] Gee, I never thought about that! Ive rebuilt, raced (Division 7 Champion in 1976) trashed, sold and bought a LOT of cars in my life, most here would consider me a grey beard) and this is the first one ive tried to build up from this level. If i manage to do this, great, im having a lot of fun and it's quite a learning experience. If it doesnt happen, no problemo, I'll do something else. If I wanted to, I could just go out and buy one completed, but that's not what this one is all about. I certainly appreciate the encouragement, ideas and knowledge that this forum affords. I don't have any car buddys (except my son Nick) that can help me out with this project, so I guess I may post here when things are getting me down a bit or a hurdle appears. Thanks for the kind words. Bill
Maybe not a grey beard but at least a lot of gray hair. Hey hows it goin Bill? Does the Junk yard lady have anything left? I'm still building those flatheads. Abe and I picked up a A-frame over the weekend, so we can use it as a template to build our own. Have fun building yours it might not be easy but well worth it in the sense of acomplishment in the end.
Sam is Right on Guys, I'd even be leary of the $1400 frame. It't to cheap for a good frame on a truck like this. Ya'll are under-estimating what's involved here. my $.02.
Alot of my friends would kill me if i paid that much for a frame! if its what it sounds like, a perimeter frame. I have a buddy thats only ever had a 110 mig welder and has subramed, chopped, modified a ton of cars and hes never had a weld brake or any problems (ive only known him for about three years and hes built about 5 cars!) as long as the welder is set at the correct settings and the correct size wire is used you should be ok. and if you want to save yourself the money you should find a tech collage that offers a welding course so you can be sure of your-self plus sometimes theyll let you bring in your own project!! I think a welding course is a good investment plus when your done you can say you did it yourself.
Dreamweaver, can you post the photo you have in your profile box? I would like to see a larger version of that photo. Thanks,
The avatar compresses the photo as it originally was rectangular. Hopefully I can post this pic. I borrowed the basic photo from Rudy's truck and added my cab. But ya get the idea, mine will have a different grill also.
Dreamweaver, P.S. Holy sh*t, you sent me to the dictionary to find out what the hell avatar meant. This list is a cultural experience as well. Thanks,
Sorry for the rant above... I had it in my head that it was a 50's truck... Sooooo... if you want to do a Rudyesque pickup like the one pictured... there's no reason why you couldn't do a very simple 2x4 frame with simple miter joints and keep the rails straight (as viewed from above)... You could also just cut the ends of the tubing at a pleasing angle and then lay one rail on top of the other so you have a simple fillet weld to do... and make some nice gussets to strengthen it... for the rear... just run a piece of 2x4 as a crossmember just at the rear of the cab... cut a driveshaft loop into it (Chris Alston make a peechy one) and then come off the top of that for your rear kickup... run a tube crossmember to hang the shocks off... run a ladder bar suspension with a transverse spring or coil overs... and a simple front square tube crossmember up front to hang a Speedway frontend up there and you're done! Sam.
Hahahaha, yeah Sam, thats all there is to it!!!! Really $1400 is not bad to build a frame. If you dont want to pay the CASH then spend the time to learn how to do it. Thats what lots of us did. Sure, I can say I have $100 in tubing in my frame but what about the $50 worth of abrasives? The 25 hours? At $45 per hour (my shops rate) I should pay myself $1125 for that! WHat you say? My time is free? Well, I could have been doing some of the house stuff that needs to be done before we sell this it this year. Since I hope to pocket many thousands of dollars on the house, my time on the frame cost me a hell of a lot more tham the $1400!!!!! Dreamweaver, not slamming you. I like what you have going for a project. I would reccomend the thicker rails for the look you mentioned. Take a class, learn to weld, or bribe a buddy. The above rant was for those that dont show a true grasp of reality. By stating the frame was beyound your skills today shows class. I vote for enriching your life and learning the skill.
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