I am a Licensed Professional Engineer in the State of California and build hot rods and bikes for fun. I'm suprised at the hint of distain toward engineers. It is a great honorable professional career. You guys realize that every original car part was "engineered" right? All good hot rods are engineered, the ones that are't are called rat rods.
I agree with this statement 100% I am a professional engineer and am amazed at the lack of common sense out there. Some of the stuff I had to deal with over the years amazes me both from a few other "engineers" (I have no Idea how some of these people get certified) and especially from some contractors and fabricators.
A couple of years ago we brought a guy in doing his masters program in Automotive Engineering. He wanted to build "hot rods" and learn "fabrication". Day one he was all pumped up, day two I wanted to see applicable mechanical skills and asked if he would pull an engine out of something. It kicked his ass. He never came back for a third day.
Man....I didn't know people hated Engineers so much. I am never one to rock the boat, but I think if you can't see all the engineering that went into every hot rod part you put on your car then it's just ignorant. I also think there are some engineers that try and throw their education in peoples faces, which is just as wrong. I work as a Mechanical Engineer in the oilfield and I have had many Technicians tell me I was wrong. I honor and respect their experience, and actually use it to my advantage. One day I hope I can use my engineering degree to design things I love like intakes, headers, fuel systems, and engines. Having a PhD in fluid mechanics is a nice piece of paper to have, but that's about it. I have learned everything I have through experience. The the guys with raw experience get all my respect too. I learned the most during my education working in the machine shop, or being a part of the formula car design team in college. The connection between reality and theory is sometimes pretty far apart, and common sense should take over. Actually most of the guys I know that are engineers are gear heads.
you are right on the nuts with this comment! my father in law is an engineer "Engineers always know why something cant be done but rarely if ever do anything".He's always coming to me for ideas for things to manufacture but when i bring him many things to do,he never follows through with them and gets pissed because he's got all these other things to do,on top of engineering the things that i brought him! it's like a dog chasing it's tail.
There are different types of Engineers. I found that many times they can be lumped into 2 different groups. Theoretical and practical. I am of the practical breed. When I design machinery and equipment, I think of the guy that is putting it together. because 9 times out of 10 that guy putting it together is me, at least for the first couple of times. Then the theoretical engineers, sit in their offices, get their dry-cleaning delivered and have not even a clue what tools are for. Avoid the latter at all costs if possible
I've been an engineer for 20 plus years now and I still mess with my cars just like my dad did and does who is also an engineer and has been for 40 plus years. Just because your an engineer doesn't make you a dipshit. That is nonsense. Just as all guys who build cars are not geniuses and not all dipshits. If you want to get your engineering degree though I don't know that rod shops are really the most effective use of that expensive ass degree but it would be fun. It is true however that the best engineers are always the ones who like to or have in the past liked to get their hands dirty and build things so get out in the shop.
My first thought was to respond <b>Fuck You Tman</b>. But, I instead I will just say that you are mean.
My brother is an engineer. he is also a hands on guy. He is one of those rare individuals who can look at something and tell me how to build it correctly. then when I screw it up he BUILDS it correctly. And yes, he has also is making a difference in the world. If you become like him we are better off for it. I say go for it - good plan
A generalization yes, but pretty true. Look at your peers, you are lying if you tell me they are all worth a damn. There are some good engineers, you may even be one of them. Here in Rapid City we have one of the top engineering schools in the nation SDSM&T, I have had engineering students work with me and have known a ton of them over the last 20 years. Even many of those that can work with their hands have the "doctor" chip on their shoulder. That is, they think they are of a higher class than the average person due to their education. And they tend to over analyze things.
Electrical Engineer here. Licensed professional engineer (PE) in the state of Nebraska. Gives me the means to build my car. One of the things that has benefitted me is that my boss started out as an electrician and went back to school for his engineering degree - gives you perspective on what can and cannot be built.
I think that the main question behind this thread has kind of been lost. The OP asked if engineers are needed in Hot Rod Shops? Sure we need engineers in the world, but do we need an engineer in a Hot Rod Shop to build a '32 highboy? My answer would be no, these cars aren't that complicated. Do we need an engineer to help design a dam, or a bridge? Yes.
As a former rod shop owner I can tell you that what most owners want is an employee who is serious about coming to work every day, on time, willing to put in 8 solid hours for 8 hours pay, isn't a complete ass (at least most of the time), is humble enough to follow orders and take constructive criticsm. If this employee is blessed with good skills and the ability to think on his feet....he's a VERY valuable asset. Every engineer I have ever known was locked into a "you can't/you must not/that's not the way it's done correctly" box. Some really great guys....just REAL anal.
I won't mention the industry but I heard an interesting story on the radio about how this animosity came to be. In this industry the term was "throw it over the wall". In other words, do your part of the job, then turn it over to the next department down the line which has to deal with it. Don't be concerned about your design after you have turned it over to someone else (we are talkiing a mass production company). In my area of the country we had the opposite attitude. This was something that was taught in college. Think about how something can be manufactured when you are designing it. The unfortunate problem is the engineer gets caught in the middle. If you design too much for ease of manufacturing, then your sales and marketing department says you are not innnovating anything. Without innovation the company cannot be a leader in the industry. If you design too much for sales and marketing, then the manufacturing department says you don't how to "real world" build anything. Onelow, keep in mind after you have earned your degree, you may want more challenging design problems than you are thinking of now. Let's say you want to design a new engine that will revolutionize the entire industry. You will want to work for a company that has millions to spend on research and development so your hands are not tied. It may be harder to find a rod shop that will have that kind of budget.
Case in point http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=j-zczJXSxnw Oh wait............... Or dams.......oops http://www.sespe.com/damdisaster/introduction.html
You either have mechanical aptitude or you don't. It is hard to teach and certainly can't be taken away by your degree. Any of the guys implying that are ridiculous. I have a BSME...It has provided career opportunites for me that never would be available to me with out it. Do I work in a Hot Rod shop? No...but I have worked on equipment with engines on them almost exclusively my whole career. It has provided a good living for my family and the ability for me to afford to own and build my own cars in my own shop. If you have the ability to get the degree....get it. Don't listen to the guys who probably don't...
Hmmm... Not quite sure how to react to this. I'm a Mechanical Engineer and I worked SUPER hard to get my degree. The interesting thing is, because of HOT RODS I got a great engineering job with an awesome company of which is owned by a HAMBer. This is an argument of "left brained" people vs. "right brained" people as well as the stereotype that the a middle-ground mind set cannot exist. Guess it's all a matter of opinion. I, for one, chose to educate myself the best I could. Seems to me the argument is also something along the lines of "How could a person educated with knowledge of how things work possibly build something that really looks cool and still go to work and build something with their hands?" I've been a hands-on guy my whole life. I got my engineering degree to enhance the mechanical interests I have, as well as learn how to design better built mechanical things. I guess I've always had sort of an artistic personality, and it allows me to keep an open mind about design concepts as well as pay attention to what something looks like. I guess you could say I use my knowledge of Engineering to ask myself questions about how to make something work as well as look good . But what the fuck do I know... I'm just an Engineer who couldn't possibly know anything about style, design, or building hot rods. So disregard all of the above.
Dilbert on Engineers . This is funny, there are lots more truths about engineers in Dilberts comics. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=qOtoujYOWw0 http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=lXGDRrkaRgU&NR=1
I would say if you are an engineer, building hotrods and on the HAMB you probably don't fall into the sterotypical engineer rut
My one advice to those of you who ARE going to school for engineering... ALWAYS have a back up plan and get an internship and some hands-on experience. I went to school with several guys that were hell-bent that their 4.0 BSME degree was enough to get them an awesome job. I know at least three of them who couldn't hang and one of them delivers for Papa Johns pizza because he can't get a job now. Get experience in the things you want to do and you can do them...
For all of those who delight in bashing engineers, I would like to see where you are at on your 60th birthday and compare your 'station' to any of the millions of engineers (good or bad) on their big 60. If you never marry or have children then do as you please since the only victim is you. But as a husband-father you have a responsibility to raise yourself above the 'norm' to be the best you can be. Anything less is simply a waste. A good engineer will never be one to say he 'knows it all'...and I worked with plenty of those in the old days...the good engineer will learn from others just as quickly as he teaches others. Knowledge is power. You can use it to your advantage or you can squander it, just as you would any of the gifts and tools provided by Zues. .
One reason I enjoy the HAMB so much is that there are alot of very technical people here with well developed artistic talents that are hands on type. My great-grandfather graduated from Yale with an mechanical engineering degree and worked designing cool things in the 40s and 50s. He also started the New Britian Art League and was an excellent painter and sculpter. I have his Engineers' Manual from 1939 here at my desk. I think anyone who over-generalizes about "engineers are retards" or thinks that because they are an engineer they are more knowledgeable about something gives me more opportunity to make more money!
I have been an engineer for the past 9 years. I am a complete hands on person also. At my previous job I worked at an air intake manufacturing company. My hands on ablity helped me figure out some of the production issues. A degree will get your foot in the door over a person without a degree in most cases. Most hot rod shops dont hire engineers but there are tons of automotive engineering jobs out there. I have worked with some engineers that just mentally masterbate ideas that never amount to anything. SO I can see your point about engineers being worthless. In my eyes there are two kinds of engineers, ones that are hands on and bring things to life and theorical engineers that just come up with these wild ideas that never come to life.
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