40FORDPU has it right in my book. The significance was/is to the previous owner or a non-owner who liked the car as-is. If I buy something it’s mine and I’ll do with it as I please. If you buy what I have sold it’s yours for you to do as you please. Many of the chopped 30’s race cars have been bought and made into street rods many many years ago and I don’t hear any whining about them. How about the cosmetically restored model A’s that were bought from older guys who really thought you were telling the truth when you said you weren’t going to “hot rod” it as you ordered your TCI frame when you got it home….
As much as I like survivors I not so brain washed that I think everyone should be left in as found condition, or that every old hot rod/race car should be left alone. If I were to find an old hot rod or race car in parts -just a body shell frame, and the history was unknow/could not be found absolutely I would make it my own. The Tommy Wilson Coupe is a good example of a survivor that needed to be restored - It was owned Charley Pierce of Deansboro NY, built by Fred DeCarr who became one of the top oval track engine builder and driven by Tommy Wilson. The car was so dominating 1951 & 1952 seasons with the Eastern Mutual Racing Club at Vernon, Brookfield, Morris, Sharon, Lafayette, Lafayette they would start him on the pole and count him a lap down - no matter, he would still win. The car won EMRC Championship in 1951 & 1952. The Flathead was huge! 304 Cubic Inches I believe, I know it had a 4 1/2" crank. As found by father and son Dick and Jeff Ackerman in 2004
My avatar roadster was built in the late 1950's, 1955 SBC, no oil filter, as the engine came from the factory, although I do change , or add the oil as needed. At my age, 83, and near empty wallet, there is no reason, time, or money to re-do my roadster. It is a survivor. Yes, I would like it to be more pretty, paint, chrome, etc. but it is what it is, a survivor, just like me. The main thing is, I enjoy it, and those who know it is a survivor recognise it as such. To each his own.
Zombie apocalypse! Love when old threads wake up. What's changed in 6 years? Not much, although I've been chastised and "warned" how I'm going to RUIN my car by touching up some of the worst. I mean it's hilarious really, as if in the service bulletins and parts books there's a page that says "DO NOT REPAIR PAINT FINISH." If you look close, zoom in, there's surface rust where the hood sides meet the fender. On the fenders the paint is all but gone on top of the headlight blisters. I can repair and lacquer blend it to look nice, respectable. Why wouldn't I? "Well, you won't be able to say it's original paint!" Fuck you. What's your original paint car look like? Sometimes patina means cheap, or lazy, or both. What if it was 1956 and I wanted to freshen up and modify Uncle Lou's old 39 tudor? Touch it up, give it a stance and an 85 vs that lame 60 that was in it. Horror of all horrors, a treasured artifact DESTROYED because I touched up the paint. So yeah as harsh as it seems at 1st, Fuck You really does apply. Maybe the occasional grow the fuck up wouldn't hurt either. Preservation means the occasional repair. Rust is lazy and disrespectful hiding in the guise of "patina" simply because it's popular. And yeah I remain off the hook since I'm not going to refinish the whole car and I absolutely will refer to it as original paint.
This is a replay of a post I made in another thread back in July. I don't mean this to be a declaration of what I would do in every similar situation. It's just what I did at that particular fork in the road............ "Back a few years ago, I just happened to be trolling fleaBay and there was a 1946-ish lowrider for sale that caught my eye. This thing was 'done'....... 10 out of 10 interior, paint, and chrome. The price was low and there didn't seem to be much traffic checking it out. The gears automatically started turning in my head about how little it would take to re-do the suspension and be cruising fat-n-sassy with full-size wheels and tires in a short time. But the descriptive copy in the listing gave a lot of detail about the builder and what a well-known mover and shaker he was in the lowrider community. I had to respect that. I very shortly backed off from any thoughts of swooping in on that "deal". I felt like that would be tantamount to becoming a blasphemous tomb raider making off with a national treasure. I never went back to check the listing because I didn't want to be tempted."
I like survivors of all kinds like factory, hot rods and customs. My buddy found an old 32 ford Coupe racecar.He tried to find history on it and couldn't find any so he made it his own.
I own a 51 Mercury Mild custom survivor that was built by Dean Jeffries, Striped by Von Dutch and was owned by Phil Sauer's who was famous in the Surfing Movies and Tv in the 60s. My merc was also in some magazines in the 50s.If I had the money, time or skills I would like to restore it to it's former glory, since I don't! I got it running and driving and been collecting history for the next owner /caretaker. Here's link: PHIL SAUERS "OLD SHASTA"1951 MERCURY https://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/threads/phil-sauers-old-shasta-1951-mercury.1302694/
These old survivors deserve to be awakened, or indeed just serviced. That "as found" gig is temporary and only for the next chapter in its history. I mean for a while there even Wayne was waxing on about the dirt being valuable. No it isn't. It's dirt. I haven't seen a Ford part number for pigeon shit either. Can someone direct me to it? See what I mean. As found is a fleeting experience for the lucky discoverer. Take your pics and break out the Dawn and hot water.
I’m enjoying this discussion. I’ve been able to buy a late Friend of my Family car . It is complete. But being stored in a shed on a dirt floor for 60 years hasn’t been kind to it . The flathead is stuck . I’m still on the fence of what to do with for a drive train . Rebuild the hopped up flathead or update it . My Wife wants to drive it also . It is a time capsule. But after attending the Gathering and seeing several flathead powered cars that were driven long distances I’m not sure what to do . Lol
Why not both? Lol. Run something non invasive like an sbc with adapter plates and mounts and rebuild the flathead while running the sbc?
Do what you and your wife want. It sat 60 years on a dirt floor which is way longer than the whiners were alive. I’d probably spend 50-75K making it perfect for me. What ever you choose and if it’s to sell… I’d make sure it was far enough away I’d never see it again.
It’s only a time capsule because someone didn’t give a crap about it. It’s your car, do what you want, as long as it’s soundly engineered no one else can complain. I’d really like to stick a Daimler Hemi and Borg-Warner in a forties Ford, if you want a flathead do a flathead. If you’ve got a SBC lying around fill your boots. There’s nothing worse than doing something to please others that you don’t like yourself.
Pretty foolish of me and all the other people who brought home clay from the last race on the Moody Mile the track on New York state fairgrounds. It's a very common practice for racers when there home track or a historic runs it's last race in fact Dale Earnhardt is a Ghost Track hunter and brings home a dirt, asphalt, or some piece of every track he find. Even display it with my parking pass, and dried clay the my grandstand ticket I think the a big point is being missed and that is there are only some many real built in period hot rods and racecars in the world. They are the source of how things were really done, once they are changed and lost forever it's gone forever. I have seen the aftermath of people finding historic racecars they didn't know or care what they and changed them, and in many cases there were creative, innovative, parts, suspensions etc...many times the parts were scraped, and only after the person who owns the car regrets what they did. People like myself view it as being a care taker not an owner of an old hot rod/racecar, it would be like buying a painting by artist deciding we didn't like and repainting. Now not everyone views it that way.
I love it. Hook onto one sentence and completely MISS the context. Ok, focus for just a moment and I'll say it louder. DIRT ON A FUCKIN BARN FIND IS NOT VALUABLE. IT'S FUCKIN DIRT. DO YOU SAVE BIRD SHIT FOR HISTORIC VALUE TOO? "The chicken who shit on this car was served to Mr Whodafuq Ever..." I mean really, go all the way. How about the mouse turds and the pissy smell upholstery? THIS HAD NOTHING TO DO WITH SOUVENIR CHUNKS OF EARTH. We now return you to your regularly scheduled excess analysis of silliness and practices, like thinking barn dirt is worth $$$$$. Holy buttfuck...
Yeah I think when people started adding "it still has the barn dust!" And freaking out of it rained on the car while they had the the dust listed on their display board at shows is when I started getting noticably bored by "patina". I mean seeing 50 years of dust on a barn find you find yourself is cool but you still wash it off lol
No, I read your whole post and fully I fully understood I was making a point to see if you would read my post beyond the photos which you clearly didn't. You made a blanket statement and this is the problem, people are making blanket statements, generalities and taking things out of context, that’s what is wrong with the traditional hot rod movement now. People are making blanket statement “This never happened, that never happened” “I don’t like it it so it’s wrong” Personally I do not like the look of the rear window or tail lights on the Hirohata Merc, but that doesn’t mean I think they should be changed it march my taste. I remember the episode of Chasing Classic Cars where Wayne Carini (I not on a first name basis with him) was "Waxing nostalgic" about barn dust he said nothing about never washing a barn find, the context was that the dust proves it is a real deal built in period car that had been parked for years, and in fact they did wash it. I was involved in digging out a barn find stockcar, yes we did leave the dust and Lucky Strike wrappers in it we displayed it for the owners H.O.F. induction. My cousin now owns the car, it has since been washed. I will also say in my opinion what to do with this car is a tough call, it is a 56 Ford chassis and the cage was built for 56 Ford body, and the running gear has never been updated, but to make the Fairlane body fit the cage very poorly modified do you leave it alone and let it rest or find a 56 Ford body and fix the cage. The problem is I don't know if the chassis/frame would survive if the cage was cut off and rebuilt. The car was first built and raced by Bill Roese, it was then sold and raced by an 18 year old Wink Hinkley who's barn it was in. I am also not brainwashed there is a big deference between a old finished car that is running or could running vs parts or just a body. I was looking at this body to build a track roadster however I missed it, since it is only a body I was going to fix the rust and repaint it and put it on my own chassis.
No bud, I did read your reply. I'll stand firm, and notice I see your dirt call and raise you bird shit. Hey, I have special "material" too. Has NOTHING to do with leaving dirt on a fuckin car. NOTHING. Sadly this whole topic is always waving from the ridiculous to the sublime. Not this here, in general and in real life. I don't want anyone to just align with me, but if I point out plain ol illogical silliness then so be it. Usually it isn't silly just to me. Just like it's fuckin stupid to think you can use WD40 instead of motor oil, it's stupid to think you "devalue" a barn find by washing it. There's no win here, and I don't give a fat rats ass who thinks I'm right or wrong. Dirt and bird shit are dirt and bird shit. The end. It ain't kool, it ain't special, it isn't historically significant dirt. Over n out.
I have not looked at this thread in years I posted My 1916 Locomobile as a survivor Interestly I later entered it in the preservation class at Pebble Beach and it was awarded the FIVA preservation award for prewar cars View attachment 6265073
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