Ever build a car for a guy and he quits on ya?

Ever start a car project for a guy and he even pays a deposit, then he bails on ya cuz he finds something a little farther on down the line for cheaper? Geeze Louise!!!! At least he wuz honest bout it, but it still feels like a slap right in da kisser! Mikey

 

At least you had the foresight to require a deposit! An engine builder buddy of mine can tell ya some stories similar to yours! (He's got the engines to prove it.)

 

Yep, sucks huh ..

 

That's why some shops insist on being paid weekly.
Worst case, they get screwed for a weeks work.

 

Yep, been there. Had a guy bale at about the 70% mark on a '59 250 PF Coupe about 25 years ago. He'd been keeping up pretty well and one day called and said he had to pull it. I got paid before it went but he intimated he wasn't happy with the progress versus money spent. Neve rheard from him again. About 10 years later I ran into his brother who had recommended me to the guy (I had done some high end import work for him) and asked him about it. Turns out he was in over his head and waited 3 or 4 years before he had it finished, but he was too embarrassed to ask me to finish it.

I was in a funk over it for 6 months probably. But I got over it.

Charlie

 

a guy in the town above us used to build awesome engines , he didnt require deposits and was a nice guy and ended up going back to driving truck for a living to many unpaid rebuilds , and broken promises

 

Yes, of couse. Everybody in any business does. A few times we ended up losing a day's shop time, on others was ahead. Why be upset? If we are mature about it, who knows, we might get that same customer back sometime in the future. Customer doesn't owe any apology as long as he pays up according to the agreement, and at least, before leaving. It's his project, unless he doesn't pay in full and in that case it belongs to the shop until he does.

One time we kept a guy's airplane for three months before he settled up. The day he terminated the contract on the mechanical work he had brought it in for, I closed out the work order and gave him his bill.

The next day we started charging rent for the space it was taking up. In the end it was three months hangar rent that couldn't have been charged him for if I had been clocking in on the maintenance he originally brought it in for. The next year he came back with the same bird, for a propeller overhaul. Smart customers are always looking for the best deal.

 

I have it happen several times... I had to not get too excited till its paid in full.

 

Something a little different, one of the friends in the family was building a 41 willys coupe for a guy, fiberglass body, and chassis that was built from the ground up. Anyway, the guy paid him in full and then dissapeared! He held onto it for a while and he never came back for it. Paid for the whole thing. That's one time I personally wouldn't mind someone quiting on me.

 

If you think building cars is expensive and risky, try designing and building buildings. Same thing, do most of the work first and then hope, just hope to get paid within a reasonable time and sometimes just at all. And no guarantee it might not stop at any moment. Think about what it takes to do a car and then multiply by 100's or 1000's times and think about that. Be glad you just are worrying about this one car project for the moment.

 

At least you were smart enough to get a deposit.

 

thats why i lost my job cuz the owner couldnt run strict enough to keep the shop open. guess he was just too nice a guy to be running a business. theres alot of dicks out there but they get paid... not exactly how i would treat a customer but firm actions mean true money

 

Yea, well, ever pay up front and have the guy sit on his ass and not do the work? It swings both ways.

 

yes it happens. Customers get in over their head or their financial situation changes, it happens, had several this past year where customer stopped an already active project. So I stopped work, send them an invoice and told them I would start charging rent for space 10 days after. They paid up and picked up.

I won't do work without a deposit, but even then you sometimes get into a bind.

What happens more often is that people promise you work, even sign a contract/work order and then bow out when you are through the wait list and ready to start on their project. This happened a lot last year.

Bigger problem are customers that have a max budget and then keep adding to their project, then when you are close to being finished they get upset that they paid more then they planned. Had one guy who I was going to redo a car for, we agreed on a $40K budget with him providing a complete car with a rebuild running engine and trans, he wanted a traditional hotrod, so we designed him one and he approved the ideas. Then he decided he liked the look of a flathead, but wanted at least 200hp, please add that, then he wanted an automatic transmission instead of the 3 spd, then he wanted billet wheels, then we found that he frame he provided was cracked and badly build and needed to be replaced.. all in all he added $30K in parts alone. On top of that when we did build the car we designed he changed his mind every time he saw a part completed, narrowed '50 Ford dash, headlights, interior, color he changed his mind on all of them after some or most work had already been done. Then he was upset that his total bill was more then the original $40k estimate. He stopped the project and I was mostly happy to see him go.

The combination of these things and the slower economy made me decide to scale down my operations a lot, now just me with some part time help when I need it.

 

Maybe he found a shop that actually had floors?! Sorry, had to say it

 

That's why smart shop owners get a deposit.

If he found something more completed for less money, you should be happy for him. You at least have the chance to finish the project for the customer vs. him not having enough money at the 90% done point.

My theory (right or wrong) has always been to get the customer out the door at the lowest cost while still making my margin.

Sounds like a new opportunity to me although you may have left out some of the details.

 

Well, thanx for your imput. I happen to believe that a man's word is his word. This guy has already lied to me and to my wife.
I hope he gets what he wants. It wont be from me. Mikey

 

Just the opposite, had the body shop bail on me. The shop that was doing extensive body work and paint on my F-1 Panel truck closed up and moved out of town on real short notice. No big problem, I paid at the end of each week for work completed so we were even. The worst part was the truck was less the a week away from final paint. Guess it was a landlord/shop owner problem. Got all my parts but only had one day to clear everything out of the shop and the truck was totally blown apart. Brought it home and pushed it in the corner of the garage. Just getting back on it now.

Lee

 

That's why we get a deposit on contract signing that has a payment schedule based on progress. Atleast he was honest.

 

Good Ole Mechanics Lien solves that problem every time
people will learn my time is worth something........And so is your car

 

Been there before...Signed contracts, weekly or monthly draws, and rent charged for abandoned projects usually take care of most possible scenarios. At least I hope so...

 

My father built home all of his life. Built them his way, but for the best appeal. Would only sell them finished and if someone wanted changes, he would give the information on who to call at settlement. I have two friends in the restoration business and have talked to them both about doing the same with cars. I'm in the building trade (houses) and all companies I deal with charge several hundred dollars if a customer wants a change and none of that goes toward the expense of the change. If you use your head and build cars that will appeal by make model and current trend, it should work. I know you have to lay out for the first car or two till paid for, but rolling it back in as intended will continue to build from there. Only way I would consider building and selling.

 

Sorry, meant to say build homes...................

 

I had a guy do allot of work on a 1972 olds cutlass supreme. He finished the job with great results on Friday night, went to look at it and it looked great. I had to wait until Monday to get to the bank to pay off the last 300.00. I got the money and went to the shop to collect the car and the shop was empty, 6 months later I get a storage and tow bill from a tow Co. in Oklahoma for 3500.00. It was wrecked and wasn't worth 500.00 so I sent them the title. lesson learnd.

 

I did a T bucket for a guy once. As the project moved forward, every 2 weeks we would "square up". At the project end, we were 3 weeks into it to finish it up. He was suppose to show up one Wed evening, I stayed late. He never showed. Thursday, nothing. Friday, nothing. Unusual, and a bit unnerving. By Monday, I couldn't take it, I called his house. He DIED that Wed afternoon he was suppose to pick up the car! He was at home doing his exercise program (he looked to be in great shape) and had a heart attack. His wife knew he was suppose to pick up the car, so when she didn't hear him, she presumed he had come to get the car. She found him late that night. I never called back, figured I would end up writing the balance off.

About 3 weeks later, the guys wife called and ask if the car was drivable. It was. She and their teenage daughter came to pick it up. She wrote a check for the balance. The daughter was going to drive it home. The street my shop was on was a narrow commercial street with fencing and no parking on either side. The door to my shop was 18 feet wide. The teenage girl was concerned she might not be able to drive through the door without hitting something. The car was facing the door. I politely pointed out that if she couldn't drive that little car through that big wide garage door, she would never make it down the street. The guy's wife got a good laugh from that, said that was the first laugh in several weeks.

When someone drops off a car, the understanding is the car will be done at a certain time and full payment is expected upon completion. If they do not have the money in hand when they drop off the car, they take it back home. I am not running a bank or a storage facility. The car comes in, it gets done, I get paid, and the car leaves. Parts are ordered, on hand, and paid for before the car is dropped off.

If I'm going to looose everything I have, I will loose it because I have been sitting looking out the window, not because I busted my butt working on some fools car that can't/won't pay me. May not be the best attitude, but its worked for me for 14 years now. Gene

 

Many years ago, a friend of mine painted a bike tanks for a Club member.
Tank was finished on time, guy didn't come back to pay for it...


until 2 years later. Something about Jail time.

 

Probably the guy passed away and nobody knew about the car he had with your friend.

 

Well said!

 

Yes and could I tell some stories but I dont want to relive them. So after several builds and losing money when pepople ran out of money. I sat down and made this up and let me tell you it works good for both sides. Any one that wants part or all of it is more than welcome email me and I will forward it over. Its on all my invoices hanging on the office wall and is no secret.



POLICIES
As we're sure you know restoration work is a specialized process that very few companies even attempt these days. We take this work seriously and are a no nonsense company that is having some issues with policies that need to be brought to everyone's attention.
PHONE CALLS AND VISITS
1. All phone calls need to be made between business hours Monday through Friday 8:00 am to 5:00 pm, Saturdays 8:00 am to 12:00 pm, standard Eastern Time. All calls need to be made to the business phone at 585-344-0408. If for some reason you are unable to call between these hours and feel you need to use my cell phone number, please limit these calls to once a week only to check on progress. Use of my personal cell phone has been abused, and any further abuse will be charged to the customer. My cell phone is to be used for emergency situations only after business hours.
ESTIMATES
1. If we give you an estimate it is just that "an estimate" which means, according to the American Heritage Dictionary, " 1. The Act of Evaluating or Appraising. 2. A Tentative Evaluatiion or Rough Calculation, as of worth, quantity, or size. 3. A Statement of the Approxiate Cost of Work to be Done, such as a Building Project or Car Repairs. 4. A Judgement Based on one's impressions; an opinion. " Don't assume something is included in an original estimate especially something added later. You are being billed shop rate of $65.00 per hour as actually worked by the clock hour and NOT priced in advance. This has been a huge problem and will not be tolerated anymore.
2. Our shop rate is $65.00 per clock hours actually worked. Here is a brief breakdown to give you an example of how a 40 hour work week can accumulate.
1 Hour w/ 2Techs = $130.00
1 Hour w/ 3Techs = $195.00
1 Day (8 Hrs) 1 Tech = $520.00
1 Day (8 Hrs) 2 Techs = $1040.00
1 Day (8 Hrs) 3 Techs = $1560.00
1 Week (40 Hrs) 1 Tech =$2600.00
1 Week (40 Hrs) 2 Techs = $5200.00
1 Week (40 Hrs) 3 Techs = $7800.00
CHANGES AND ADDITIONS
1. Any changes to a job of additional work will be charged for. Don't be surprised if you ask for it to be done, it will be, but you will be charged. Absolutely no exceptions. Again if you ask us to do something be prepared to pay for it.
2. Pick up and deliveries. This is not free we will pick up cars, ship parts, whatever it takes but you will be charged time, fuel and or shipping costs.
3. Old parts are the sole responsibility of the owner. Do not leave them around or they will get thrown out.
SPECIAL PRIVILEDGES
1. No tools or shop equipment will be loaned out. That is final, don't ask to use the shop trailer or even a screwdriver. All this has been done in the past and did nothing but benefit the other party and left me with damaged, broken or missing parts and having to deal with these damages out of my own time and pocket.
2. Staying after hours to meet with customers, this has done nothing but come between me and my family. So if this is the case and its not set up by us you will be charged per hour for it. No longer will I spend hours discussing ones car while my son or wife waits for me.
3. All cars must be insured by their owner. If not insured by owner we will not be responsible for vehicle or parts related to vehicle.
PAYMENT
1. As you can see above from the labor hour breakdown, monies owed can accumulate very quickly. It is important for both the customer and us to stay on top of the monies at all times or we can not be productive. This is a business that needs its employees and needs the building we work in and can’t support those needs with out the funding coming in on time.
2. Payment must be made within 10 days of receiving invoice. Failure to do so will void all offers, discounts and warranties plus completion time promises.
3. Any invoice left unpaid for 15 or more days will have a 10% late charge added.
4. Any invoice left unpaid for 30 or more days is subject to 25% late charge and all discounts void and full labor rated applied.
5. Storage will be charged to anyone with a past due invoice subject to as low as $80.00 per month and up to $25.00 per day.
6. If parts are left on site there will a container charge minimum of $80.00 per month for storage.
7. If you have a negative balance for more then 10 days you will be charged for storage. A minimum amount of $120.00 per month and up to $25.00 per day.
8. Anytime you have a negative balance your car will not be covered under any warranty or insurance. You are on your own all discounts and offers become null in void.
9. Absolutely no work will be done on any car with a negative balance.
10. If customer shows signs of being past due on a regular basis, a deposit will be required. A positive balance of $1,000.00 must be maintained at all times or else all work will stop on vehicle.
11. All jobs require a $5,000.00 minimum deposit. Which by NYS Law sales tax is immediately taken out of that deposit and all other payments.
12. There will be no cash deals everything is taxable and will be taxed in accordance to NYS law.
TIME SCHEDULE
1. If a customer chooses to supply parts, we will not be held accountable for time lost waiting for parts. If any vendor back orders parts we can not be held accountable for time deadlines not being held up to.
2. Any lawsuit attempts to sue for incompletion of car with an over due balance will result in an immediate Judgement put on the owner of the vehicle for past due balance and storage fees.
These restoration projects can take several months to years to complete. Often times I will come in on the weekends or stay late into the evening after business hours are long over to work on a project without the disturbances. We are not open after 5:00 pm Monday thru Friday after 12:00 on Saturday closed Sundays. If I am here I do not want to be bothered. This is my time. If I am working on someone's car it's my choice and still don't want to be bothered. Pretend I am not here, don't ask, don't knock, don't come in. Please give me this courtesy, it may be your car I am trying to work on to meet your deadline.
Acceptance Signature of Customer____________________Signature of Shop Owner___________________________

 

I forgot to mention we do give 10% back incentives for those that play by the rules this realy makes the job come together and keeps things moving right along.