OK - what' the general thought on this one - do I go with a torsion bar setup for the front end or just solid mount an axle to the front end? I'm wanting this thing to be safe most importantly and not be a handful to drive. Looking at 120" (ish) wheelbase, going to be mild SBC powered at around 360-380 estimated HP, but if I get crazy I've got the 540HP 406 that I may strap in it one day and want it to go straight. Guessing around 1800-2k lbs tops. Also - what about spindles and steering - aftermarket like a MW setup or use some stock old ford anglia spindles?
If this is a fed the weight will only be around 1200, without the driver, mine weighs about 1000. the fe will work better on a fed if it has some spring. I would not weld it solid. my first plan was to use a anglia with a buggy spring. i let some well intentioned friends talk me into a torsion bar. my car is 134''long. a fed can be a evil handling beast. let me know if i can help.
The simple answer first. SPE spindles. They're the anglia spindles that everyone has used. Strange and Mark Williams sells them also. On the suspension, if you are going to run on rough tracks, I'd install the torsion ***embly. You'll have better results with the car and less repair than without. If you only run on absolutely smooth surfaces, you could run without. You'll miss the instant weight transfer the instant you stand on the gas, though.
We'll need all the help we can get (another lurker and I are planning on building it) - if it indeed weighs around 1200 or less then it's going to be one fun ride with even 350 hp or 400 hp... The plan was to run the SBC, a front motor mount ears, midplate and solid mount a powerglide trans all to the ch***is, then use a single u-joint between the trans output yoke and the 9" rear's input yoke. It'll be a longer setup than the ones that run a direct drive but we're going for cheap fun and we've got a lot of the parts... Got a web site for SPE? We're planning on running mainly at KCIR, possibly topeka, and then MoKan for the HAMB drags. I hear KCIR is pretty smooth in general but a little rougher than some other tracks on the big end, but I haven't been there in probably 10 years personally so this is just word of mouth... Guess I'll be looking at torsion bar setups. Anyone ever cut up a VW bug torsion bar front end to use? Or have any other 'stock' cars that have bars which can be re-used? As for the axle - I saw that Mark Willams has ends to weld to tubing cheap so I'll probably build my own dropped front axle - any suggestions on angles (KPI, Caster/Camber?) Also - any places to source some of this stuff used? Would really like to find a used torsion bar/axle/spindles/steering rods/wishbone setup...
Put some where between 8 and 12 degrees of caster. You will need to build a jig to hold the spindle in the correct position and build the axle around it. Run the camber at 0 so you don't cause drag. Set toe-in at 1/16. I think SPE has a website. That stands for speed products engineering. It's Ken Cox's family. I liked the shape of his spindles better than the other brands. He used to be the cheapest source for tabs and brackets. Ch***is Shop in Michigan was real good to do business with also.
You don't want to solid mount the trans. It will brake the tailshaft housing. Motorplates hold the motor in up and down not front to back. the tailshaft housing is not strong enough to take the ch***is/motorplate flex and will break. We always run a rubber mount with motor plates. On most R.E.D.s the ****** has a shorty kit and has no tailshaft housing, or ****** mount, they hang by the bell housing bolts. You may also want to add engine limiters to the scheme. Cut a plate that will bolt up to the motor mount holes in the block, weld on a couple tabs, run a tube foward or back to the ch***is, it holds the motor front to back. It will still need a rubber mount, because of ch***is flex, but it won't crack motorplates. I'll send a a pic if interested.
Your weight might be a little off. I'm working on hitting 1500 with the altered and that's with a steel body, and a B/RB. You're probably lookin' at 1000-1200 lbs with the rail. I'm not real big on no spring, I'd probably go with a mark williams set up you can usually find one for about a buck to a buck and a half if you look around. One of the other guys here is planning on an FED also, I'm thinkin' we may build him one of the older setups with longitudinal torsion bars, you don't see 'em to often and they work well. But that's just purely backyard. Looks like KC is going to be FED town. Just noticed your ****** mount plans, with motor plates and a mid plate you're gonna want to float the tailshaft and use a coupler on your rear. you'll need to throw a torque stay inther somewhere, but that's no biggy.
120" or LESS usually requires front suspension - over 120" rules usually allow rigid mount. Careful when buying a "new" torsion bar set from MW or any of the other manufacturers - the ones I've looked at were for Modern Funny Cars - as such they were STIFF as HELL (jump on the front frame of a modern Funny Car to see what I mean)- talk with the mahufacturer and let them know EXACLTY what you are using it for - they might suggest getting a "softer" one. Get a copy of the rules and follow them to a TEE!!!!! Also be sure to investigate ALL aspects - for instance - 8 to 10 degrees of caster sounds right for a street car, but as the speeds increase (not sure how fast you're talking about going) they generally increase the caster as well - it was/is not unheard of to have 30 degrees of caster on certain types of drag race cars. I think I have right around that much in my FED - for instance. Early cars often used Ford Spindles - sometimes stock other times recut for anglia dimensions - aftermarket spindles are also readily available although expensive!! (I know - I bought a set!!! )
My rule was 8-12 if there is lots of front end weight and 150 mph or below. On a rear engine car or a front engine dragster that is 200" long and going really fast, up to 22 degrees. The old 30 degree stuff from the 60's causes problems. All the modern cars will not have 30 degree front ends.
If you are gonna build your own axle, use a Ford axle for a jig, knock the kingpins out and use a long bar for your kingpins slide your tubing down over the top. Basically, you have an axle on top of the Ford axle. This will give you the camber for your axle ends, while you weld it up. Does that make any sense?
KCIR had the worst track surface of any track I've been to. Mokan had a pretty smooth surface before they repaved it, but it got some soft spots on the big end. I bet Carl has them fixed by now. In any case, you need a front suspension, and you also need to build some flex into your ch***is when you build it. Look at a bunch of other diggers before you start yours. I might rethink the U-joint idea as well. Wrapping your *** around a ford 9inch is one thing, but its damn scary to have a 13 dollar u-joint spinning at 6,000 RPM next to your shins. If anything in your car breaks, its gonna be that thing.
I totally eclosed my driveshaft on my old altered. I used a piece of an old Oxygen cylinder. That way the ujoint is covered. It ****s if you have to get in there but I felt a little safer.
Da Tinman - Please send pics if you got them - I think I understand what you're saying. I wouldn't mind having a shorty but the output shaft is expensive from what I recall... HemiRambler - I'm doing my research right now and looking at a lot of other FED's and trying to figure out what to do and how they did theirs - the more info I can gather up front the better this should turn out. I do have a copy of the NHRA / SFI cage specs for a dragster driver's compartment and will probably order the full 06 rule book here before starting... Four-Thirteen - Where can I get a coupler for the 9" to Powerglide?? Can't think how that would work - would it have a flanged side on the pinion of the 9" and then a splined coupler that bolted to the flange? I was planning on a 1/4" plate cut from some steel pipe over the U-joint area to cover it in the case it let go. I figured that would be the weak point of the driveline. I was planning on welding 2 'straps' to the sides and then bolt it into the ch***is. Porkn****** - where can you find the MW setups?? Guess I need some leads on where to look for this stuff... If you happen to run across one let me know!
SPE Speed Products Engineering http://www.speedproductseng.com/ That's one of many links on this page: Race car ch***is builders and components http://www.roadsters.com/ch***is/ Dave http://www.roadsters.com/
Mark williams has everything you need. http://www.markwilliams.com/driveshaftSolid.aspx?CategoryID=207 you'll have about 200 bucks into it. To be honest, I've got a U-joint in the car I drive. I didn't set up the ****** to rear end coupling in the car, it was like that when we got it. I scares the **** out of me every time I climb in it though, and the first thing that will get changed as the car is updated will be that coupler. David
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