Just purchased a 51 Ford flathead that I am going to be freshening up. As far as the adjustable lifters,should I go with the solid or hollow type? Also any suggestions on wheree to purchase the rings,rod,main,and cam bearigs would be appreciated. Thanks in advance!
Naw man,***** that dude. He's a******, and he just hoards up avail products from everywhere else and doubles the prices. Speedway has killer prices on bearing, rings, pistons, etc. Red's Headers is awesome too..
Several documented instances of Speedway lifters wiping out a new cam. And every person I have talked to with the problem has said that when they called Speedway they were told, "We are not aware of any problems with our lifters." And I know they were aware of at least ONE instance since I made the same call myself.
Yeah, but what about his question about hollow versus solid type adjustables. I have both & was wondering which to use.
I'd say if anybody can get some old, unused, dusty from the shelf lifters they would be worth twice what new ones are selling for. I've heard nothing good about new lifters, flathead or otherwise.
Original Johnsons are indeed getting pricey! I say Red's,****uming they are maintaining tradition under new ownership. There was a good essay on the multiple new lifters and their failures in Red's "engine talk" section, so they are aware and I hope picky. I think there are solid ones now that are satisfactory and cheap, and hollow ones (from Flatattack?) that are more expensive. If scared of the choices (which I certainly am, but I still have some Johnsons), order from the supplier of your cam. The solid ones are unappealing due to their ridiculous weight, but apparently casuse no problems in street flatheads. Flathead valvetrains can control them with common springs, it seems. I got my set of the solids as a surprise...ordered a new set of lifters at the moment Joblot had sold the last of the good ones, maybe 1972. Looked at then in horror, put the box waaay back in the basement forever.
I rebuilt my flatty last summer- I ordered most of my parts from Eric VAPHEAD here on the HAMB. He runs Riley Automotive and is an Alliance Vendor. He ordered the lifter's, valves and springs through Red's Headers and got me an Alliance discount. Some of the common stuff he got drop shipped from Speedway with an Alliance discount and free shipping. I also ordered my main bearings from Rollo at Vern Tardel Enterprises. Very happy with the service and I saved a ton of dough.
get a scale and weigh them, you will see the adjustable actually weighs more, i dont have a pic but there are some solid lifters that are also drilled out.
I feel lucky to have gotten a set of reconditioned Johnson's from Ron Furtado before his passing. I hunt down good used Johnson lifters at swaps like it's my job. Adjustable weighs may weigh more that a stock solid (which is actually hollow inside). I have a hard believing that a Johnson-type lifter is heavier than an Isky-type solid.
I agree with most, that Speedway and Red's Headers are the places to go. I got the valves, cam (400 Jr.) and Johnson-type lifters from Red's and the rest from Speedway. Almost 10,000 miles in 2.5 years, and no problems yet. Hey Dude good luck with all your decisions. Eric
I'd pick up a pair of hollow adjustables,captain insano(mike@ H&H)or Eric (Vaphead,Riley automotive) Ive done business with both of them and they are both cool guys.
I am running a set of hollow lifters that i bought from flathead jack for 4 years and 15 thousand miles.Yes he is difficult to deal with and i will not do buisness with him again. When i miked them there were about .001-.0015 taper from top to bottom,they must grind them and then hollow them.The bore size was within allowable specs. I was reluctent but i ran them anyway. Fast foward two years and 7500 miles and i tore my oilpan out in nyc(Potholes,imagine that)While i was replacing the pan i could inspect what i had,all looked great.Im using a 400jr and set my springs to 180lbs installed height.single spring.I use joe gibbs xp4 and swear by it. Good luck and i hope this helps,Gary
I doubt that the pre-'70's Johnsons weigh more than the current solid things...they were hollow shell cast like early flathead ones. I have not really examined current hollows...they may be a cruder casting or even machined out with thick top and bottom?? When I got the first solids I mention above, I knew something strange was going on because the box was so heavy when I took it out of the mailing box!
Talk to the guys at Red's very nice to deal with, also try H&H Flatheads talked to them a hand full of times also easy to deal. Good Luck.......
There are current hollow adjustables. They will weigh more than originals (they're hollow, as someone already pointed out), but nowhere near as much as the early solid adjustables (I think a product originally developed for the 9N tractor crowd).
Why not "Stellite weld"" the lifter top and grind to suit .Set and forget,just like henry wanted.OR use longer aftermarket ch vy valves and grind to suit .
Being an old timer with flat heads, we did the stellite on the valve stems , not the lifter, and set the excessive clearence, when possible with a hammer to the tulip bottom of the valve. Lay it on a vise , and hit it on the side with a ball peen hammer. But, later we had tools where we would measure the depth to the lifter, and then measure the valve length, and adjust the length to match the depth. Then it was just a matter of installing them. Errors could be done by deeping the seats, or doing he valve. LOL Traderjack
Mike Davidson of Flat attack racing in Australia has some pretty cool hollow lifters that remble the old lightweight hollow Johnson lifters http://www.flatattackracing.com/ $325 AUD probably under 260 US$ I run them in my blown flatty
OK, you want to know how much flathead lifters weigh? A few years ago I****embled a flathead for me and one for a buddy. Between us, there were several engines apart. I borrowed a scale from the local high school and this is the result. If someone wants to use this info for a permenant record, Go for it. The weight for the Flatattack lifter came from Mike Davidson. Original grind to fit Ford lifter, 45.1 g. Old style Johnson adjustable, 81.9 g. Replacement Johnson, solid with a swirl cast in, 111.1 g. Replacement solid with a groove cast in, as found in tractors. 117.5 g. New Manufactured Flatattackracing. 79 g.
On a stock motor it wont matter what lifter you run slong as its good quality .BUT ,if it runs a fancy cam or gets a blower, the lighter the better , as far as wear and top revs go .And some big dolla can be sunk just in the machine work in that area!
why would you need hollow lifters on the street, considering the price? only reason i use em is because i bought a set of johnsons out of tradin times (almost 40 years ago) for $15.
Hollow for street flatheads is an aesthetic thing...all rodders and Henry Ford believe that lighter is better no matter what. The random hardness and failures on an engine that has ridiculously low stress on the valve train is the horrifying part of current selections...probably only safe approach is a knowledgeable vendor, like Red's, where many of the employees and the owner have an awareness of function.
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