My SBC stroker motor/TH350 needs to be put in neutral at the lights to keep the temp from climbing about 20 - 30 degrees. It has a ProComp hi-flow water pump that works great except when idling at less than 1000 RPMS. So I ordered a new Flow Kooler aluminum pump from Summit, which UPS brought yesterday. Here is what I wrote in an Email to Flow Kooler, and their initial response; Lee, UPS just brought me one of your #1888 water pumps from Summit Racing, in a sealed plastic bag. I am really disappointed at the amount of co**** grinding that has been performed on the aluminum housing to get rid of the casting lines. It's going on my hot rod with no hood that I've spent a lot of time on with engine detailing and honestly don't want to install your product because it looks so darn rough. The casting lines as-is would look better. I've used Pro-Comp water pumps that have almost a perfect cast-aluminum housing without any grind marks. Surely all your cast aluminum water pumps (#1888 in particular) aren't butchered up on the outside like this one. The question arises as to what the casting looks like on the inside, if it's so bad on the out. Hopefully this one I have just slipped by quality control and you have a better one I can obtain somehow. I paid the extra $$ to get your #1888 aluminum pump instead of the #1668 because I thought it would look better. It isn't a show car, but a driver that's put together with the right components, and real sano. Can you holler back and let me know if and how I can get a better looking pump? Thanks, Pete Pete There are marks we would not expect to see. Specifically the bolt mounts. We would not knowingly sell this pump in this condition. It appears it was damaged in install. The casting marks on the perimeter however are consistent with those of other 1888 pumps. They are acceptable to most owners/builders as most builder typically paint the pumps. We do offer a polished aluminum version of this pump for show cars which may suit your needs. I completely understand if this pump is not what you expect. Summit will typically return and exchange in a short amount of time. Lee Lee, There are marks we would not expect to see. Specifically the bolt mounts. We would not knowingly sell this pump in this condition. It appears it was damaged in install. I don't believe this water pump has ever been installed. Those marks you see were done with a small Dremel tool, die grinder or something similar. There are no bolt head or washer marks. The casting marks on the perimeter however are consistent with those of other 1888 pumps. There are no casting marks left. They've all been ground off with what appears to be something like a 4" grinder. Did you mean grinding marks? They are acceptable to most owners/builders as most builder typically paint the pumps. They look great raw-cast if they're decent to begin with. What I need is one that's ground for polishing, but unpolished. We do offer a polished aluminum version of this pump for show cars which may suit your needs. How much? I completely understand if this pump is not what you expect. Summit will typically return and exchange in a short amount of time. Summit will take care of me, but they won't look through boxes of 1888's to find me a better looking one. I'm going to have to pay return freight (which I shouldn't have to) and, I don't want another one that looks like this. Do you cast or machine in-house? Can I get a raw cast one that hasn't been ground on? What about the cast iron ones.........do they look any better? Thanks, Pete Does anybody have experience with a Stewart pump, or can recommend a pump that is hi-flow at idle? The Flow-Kooler is the only one I see that refers to idle, or low RPMs.
call Summit, return it to Summit, if the manufacturer doesn't stand behind it then the hell with them.
Man... I love living 45 min from Summit... I go through box after box until I see the one I want. About the pump... I don't know of any pump ****ty enough to move too little water. What's your idle at in gear? If it's ridiculously low, you might be on the right track, but I really think you might be running into another problem. All readings will go up when you slow down the coolant flow, but it's not too bad unless that reading is really high. Are you getting enough airflow through the radiator when stopped? Good fan and shroud? What are the temp readings while cruising and stopped? What's it idle at in gear?
Johnny-O, 16" electric fan and in gear it idles around 600 RPMS. If I touch the loud pedal by 300-400 RPMS the needle will go back to 185. If I do nothing it might get to 205. Or I can put it in neutral and the revs go to 1100 and it stays at 185. With that happening I figured the water pump wasn't hi-flow at idle.
You can turn any pump into a Flow Kooler style of pump by installing(riveting) a small sheetmetal disc the diameter of your impeller to the back of your impeller. Flow Kooler even sells the discs separately for less than 10 bucks. You are basically getting a new water pump with their secret (disc) part installed. They don't work any better than a stock one. If you want a really good pump, get a Moroso or a Stewart.
Pete, It's obvious by the pic of your motor that you take pride in your car but that doesn't mean your **** about the appearance of parts. You bought from Summit thinking you would get a better product than if you spent your money at a gippo or discount parts house. My .02.
205 at 600 rpm sounds fine to me. Just means you are ****ing a lot more heat out of the block with slow(er) moving water. The disc on the pump impellers is for high rpm. If you get up to 220+ I might start worrying... but I don't think there is much you can do with a 600rpm mechanical pump unless you change the pulley. Hell man... I throw mine in Neutral once in a while too.
They do not machine or manufacture in house. As you can expect the pump is made overseas and their "special disc" is added here. My old man installed a few on boats and there was zero difference in cooling. Summit even sells the same disc that can be added to any standard pump. Summit will be decent with you. Go for a different brand with a solid rep.
In a message dated 7/16/2008 5:06:41 PM Eastern Daylight Time, lee@thebr***works.net writes: The polished pump is part number 1888P our price is 205.97. Lee, Being the big name in cooling that you are, I thought you might take it upon yourself to deal directly with me the consumer and exchange what I have here for something decent that you'd be proud to put your name on. It doesn't seem very businesslike to blame Summit Racing for selling me "Something that was returned to them after a faulty install." This water pump is brand new, and has never been installed. You haven't given me any confidence in your product, and that together with having to pay freight charges 2 ways..... I think I'll get a Stewart for $150.00. Thanks, Pete
I always install a FlowKooler plate on the back of my water pumps and I have found them to be very helpful.
Me too. I got a Flowcooler pump, it's just a stock pump with the plate as far as I can tell. I got it cause the new "race heavy duty" aluminum pump with the "special o-ring seal" in the back to prevent leaks I got from Speedway leaked. I'm not impressed with Flowcooler.
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