Ben, a washed down cylinder is where too much gas get into the cylinder and is not burned. It washes the oil seal off the rings, lowering compression. Since you say your plugs are spotless, I ***ume there is no fuel in your cylinders. So..... this would be the problem. You/ we are missing something. Need to go back and start at the basics and walk through it. Bones
A crack in the intake ...may cause problems..... but it would still run and create vacuum.....unless you need to measure the crack with a yard stick! That is not his problem. Bones
Bones, thanks for the explanation , understood. Some new info, this thing was parked years ago due to a bad torque converter, it’s a c4 transmission with driveshaft disconnected, and this is a jalopy so no gear pattern marking let’s ***ume it’s not in neutral or park with a bad torque converter and this is reaching here but hey that’s all I have left at this point is to reach, If I’m trying to crank this thing in gear with a bad TC that’s putting a load on the motor causing a slow cranking speed, which doesn’t allow fast enough rotation to start? Because everything is there right now rotating ***embly is functioning have verified cam/crank timing and ignition timing with spark lacking fuel in cylinder but ya almost like it’s not cranking fast enough to draw fuel from carb/intake into the cylinder, I’ll swap out battery tonight for a larger one just to rule that out since the one in it has a low CCA, again I’m reaching here but I’m lost now looking for anything Thanks
Can you access the underside of the car? If so, remove the torque converter bolts/nuts and slide it back from the flexplate......that may give you enough clearance to ‘unburden’ the engine from the transmission. Also, if you can get under the car, it should be easy to move the ****** shift lever into Park position, even if you have to disconnect the shift linkage rod from the shift arm. Ray
Ray, I have access to all that, would that be something that can cause the engine to stumble on cranking keep the crank speed low?
I think that’s a real stretch...timing will also cause it to crank slower. Sent from my iPhone using H.A.M.B.
Take the fuel out of the equation, use some starting fluid. Spray it in the plug holes if you have to.
Double check your timing. I had the same problem recently, turned out Ford used two different timing marks on some engines, one for a light, one for the magnetic pickup. My actual timing mark was so faint I had to sand the harmonic balancer to find it. It makes the timing about two plugs off if you use the wrong mark, it will fire, just not enough to run. I felt like an idiot when I realized what was going on. I had checked the timing countless times, used both firing orders, changed distributors, all to no effect.
You can take the timing mark out of the equation too. Take the plugs out, put your finger over #1 hole, turn the motor over by hand till you feel pressure blowing your finger out of the hole, bring the piston up to its highest point and check that you have proper clearance between rockers and valves. Position distributor rotor to #1 on the cap , or just before. Install the plugs, spray ether down the carb and fire it up.
^^^^^^^and while you are at it, before you crank the engine, Mark the top dead center on the damper and timing cover.....if you don’t see the original factory markings in alignment. Ray
Use a piston stop to find exact TDC. Doing this will also tell you if your 289 has the correct timing pointer. It probably does, but takes that out of the equation. 289-302's used at least 3 different covers / pointers.
possibly......I only suggested that because (I thought) you raised the issue of a ‘bad torque converter’ and uncertain what gear position the selector is in. My suggestion was intended to eliminate the transmission as a potential obstacle....whether it is, in fact, or not. Ray
I have used this for years turn the engine until the intake valve starts to open and the exhaust is closeing when they are both open the same amount you are within 5 degrees of TDC on exhaust . Lay a straight edge across valve retainers If you want. When I put an engine together with one those muti keyway timing gears I use this on top of the lifters to double check. But you have a engine that has not been run for years and trying to start is with a weak battery?
I've only read this in bits and pieces but now I think I'll go back to the top in detail, before offering an opinion. Meanwhile, a C4 converter has studs, not bolts, and probably won't slide back enough. If it does , you might wreck the studs by cranking it over. I've never seen a converter get "tight" when it's "bad" , especially with no fluid pressure. If the converter is totally bound up , you'll still only turn the input and forward drum, which wouldn't be applied .without pressure. "Park" is way in the back on a C4 , on the output shaft. Wouldn't matter where the selector is. Wondering who told the o/p the converter was bad? I've seen a lot of dis-info on these newly bought project cars lately . BTW, if the converter is "bad", then the trans needs to be gone through, too.
Ray,sunbeam, battery is less CCA than recommended, we still thinking timing? I’ve verified timing on crankshaft and cam shaft, set the distributor with #1 TDC with rotor ****on pointing at #1 plug and verified spark, there isn’t any draw through the intake but the valves are opening and closing I have gauges the rocker to valve yet but surely if they opening and closing even some here would be some type of draw through the intake?
The air goes through those little holes in the head, air in plus closed valve and upward motion of the prison makes compression.
Did you ever take compressed air and attach it to the spark plug holes one at a time with both valves closed to check to see if there is leakage? do that first. then do a compression check with the throttle wide open. then add a squirt of oil to each cyl and recheck compression. I seen a 221 small block ford the wouldn't start with the starter. I started when pulled. smoked like a tire kill. When torn down it had 5 burned pistons. you could see the top ring.
You do know you can disconnect everything electrical and 24 volt just the starter and spin the engine very fast. Jeff Bradshaw has a U tube video that shows detailed procedures he done on a 389 Pontiac to get it running again.
I did the compression wet test and the compression was a bit higher after the oil was in it, didn’t hit it with compressed air yet though
All this cranking, and no sign of fuel in cylinders/plugs? Is the carb getting fuel, is the fuel pump pumping fuel? Is the fuel line able to draw fuel? You've got compression (albeit a bit low, should still fire off), you say you've verified timing and spark. I personally think vacuum on a slow cranking engine is a red herring. Put a fresh battery in it. Test the fuel delivery sysrem. Pour a couplr ounces of gas down the throat of the carb (or starter fluid) and see if you get some sign of life. As a side note, I had a neighbor replace the timing chain on his Ford V8, forgot to re-install the fuel pump concentric. He couldn't figure out why it wasn't getting fuel.
If the engine doesn't make oil pressure while cranking, the engine may have become dry from sitting and cranking. You might consider pulling the distributor and turning the oil pump until you have oil coming out of the tip of a pushrod.
Only thing I might add is that you won't see much vacuum with slow cranking, even with the carb fully closed , off the idle screw. You're basically trying to read one cylinder at a time, with a common plenum. Also, haven't seen yet...All that cranking has probably squeezed all the oil out of the lifters and collapsed them . You won't get much cam lift, hence not as much flow through the engine. Use the proper tool and re - prime the oil before the next attempt to fire it up..
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