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Hot Rods Getting Over Fear of Cutting up Parts/Making Mistakes

Discussion in 'The Hokey Ass Message Board' started by Auggie Dawgie, Dec 20, 2023.

  1. JD Miller
    Joined: Nov 12, 2011
    Posts: 2,620

    JD Miller
    Member

    :D
     
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  2. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 24,378

    gimpyshotrods
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Can confirm.
     
  3. gimpyshotrods
    Joined: May 20, 2009
    Posts: 24,378

    gimpyshotrods
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    You would need a WIG welder and a FIG welder!
     
  4. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 21,476

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    And be a qualified weldor to operate those welders!
     
  5. Dave G in Gansevoort
    Joined: Mar 28, 2019
    Posts: 3,434

    Dave G in Gansevoort
    Member
    from Upstate NY

    The instructor covered oxy/fuel, stick, mig and tig all those decades ago. He never covered wig and fig! I was never exposed to either. And how do you get filler rod or wire in some of the more esoteric woods like mahogany or ipe? Then I also have a question about the shielding gas: helium, argon, a mixture? And let's not forget about composites. Carbon/carbon fiber...

    Okay I'll stop now
     
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  6. mohr hp
    Joined: Nov 18, 2009
    Posts: 1,409

    mohr hp
    Member
    from Georgia

    IMG_0611.png IMG_0610.png Go find a damaged aluminum radiator and practice on that., I found 2 freebies at an airport tug shop. I used them to make a weird shaped coolant expansion tank.
     
    Last edited: Dec 22, 2023
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  7. ekimneirbo
    Joined: Apr 29, 2017
    Posts: 5,123

    ekimneirbo
    Member
    from Brooks Ky

    One thing here.....I would not use a torch to preheat on a radiator as you may cause the solder to melt if you get too warm. Since what you need to weld on the radiator are mounting brackets, a lot depends on their location. Making tack/very short welds and letting it cool will keep the heat from spreading out. Just get a couple similar thickness aluminum plates and try it on them . Also place your ground clamp somewhere near the point of the weld so current is not flowing thru soldered joints. Maybe a small clamp that the ground can attach to.
     
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  8. bangngears
    Joined: Aug 30, 2007
    Posts: 1,276

    bangngears
    Member
    from ofallon mo

    I can teach mig welding in one sentence and your ready to weld. If you blow a hole, turn it down. If it pops and looks bad, turn it up. We are done. Good luck.
     
  9. i7083
    Joined: Jan 3, 2021
    Posts: 206

    i7083
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I got really hung up on making my front shock mounts match, and they did. Both for the left side.
    Don't over-think it, just think it over.
     
  10. Auggie Dawgie
    Joined: May 2, 2019
    Posts: 41

    Auggie Dawgie
    Member
    from New Jersey

    IMG_0202.jpeg This is the radiator I am talking about. It looked welded to me, but maybe be soldered somewhere on the inside. Since my car is channeled it sits too high. I just have to cut and reweld those brackets 1-2” higher on that bottom part.
     
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  11. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 32,341

    The37Kid
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    Have you thought of fabricating brackets that would bolt onto the the lower bracket? Anneal the bracket that is there and fold it up after the new bracket is made.
     
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  12. ekimneirbo
    Joined: Apr 29, 2017
    Posts: 5,123

    ekimneirbo
    Member
    from Brooks Ky

    The tubes in the radiator are soldered in place. The outside frame is welded. Welding aluminum requires more heat input because aluminum disipates heat more quickly. If you concentrate the heat in a small area reasonably quickly, it has less chance to spread. So if you apply a "tack" with a MIG type of set up, it doesn't have time to spread. A TIG can control heat well for doing short welds and then letting it cool. The trick is getting it clean with a stainless wire brush and then being able to realize when it becomes molten. With a Mig you just have to get it set right before you apply the weld so that it doesn't blow thru, so find what setting works on some similar thickness aluminum pieces. Don't set them flat on a steel table, as the table will absorb heat and your setting will be too high when you do the radiator. Being its an expensive radiator, I'd probably recommend finding a good welder to Tig it for you. Probably $50-$75 if you have the brackets ready to fit up. Then practice Tig/Alum on some scrap stuff.
     
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  13. goldmountain
    Joined: Jun 12, 2016
    Posts: 4,813

    goldmountain

    I remember the fear of cutting up parts back when I was a lot younger. It was 1974 and I had just seen "American Graffiti". I cut the top off my friend's deuce 5 window. Definitely a moment of did I mess up? Well, yes I did.
     
  14. NealinCA
    Joined: Dec 12, 2001
    Posts: 3,434

    NealinCA
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I read this quote from Lil' John Buttera in Hot Rod magazine in the early 1980's and it has stuck with me.

    "Always try to make the best part you can with the skills you have. If it isn't good enough throw it away and make another. Every time you make a part your skill will increase and you'll make a better part than you were capable of making before."

    Many times I will build a simple part but add some twist to it to try something new. The process may not have been needed to make that part, but now I have a new skill for when it is really needed.
     
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  15. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 21,476

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    I can't quote it verbatim but Johns' answer when someone asked him how a certain part was made, he said something like "I just removed metal until it looked like the part I wanted".
     
  16. lostone
    Joined: Oct 13, 2013
    Posts: 3,424

    lostone
    Member
    from kansas

    I've been there too...

    I'll try some new ways to try and work sheet metal, like bumping, stretching etc, then shrinking etc then once I have it all screwed up I'll start again.

    Sometimes this doesn't work then at that point I go back to what I do know and work from there. Sometimes with a new piece and sometimes with the piece I started with.

    Either way I learn something along the way, things like when to stop and do something different or when to change methods and keep going.

    It's all a lesson, a learning curve, feel-sight gets better, methods get better so the end product gets better.

    So it just all boils down to one thing, "if you ain't trying, you ain't learning" that's the way I see it....

    ...
     
  17. Sharpone
    Joined: Jul 25, 2022
    Posts: 2,296

    Sharpone
    Member

    I agree , I would hire it done, looks like it would be easy to totally screw up at which point you’d have to pay $$s to fix or buy a new radiator either way a fair amount of money wasted maybe. In the mean time practice practice practice so next time you would have the skills and confidence to tackle such a task.
    Dan
     
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  18. NealinCA
    Joined: Dec 12, 2001
    Posts: 3,434

    NealinCA
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    From another thread on the HAMB...

    The late Gray Baskerville once asked Buttera how he could make a rear view mirror out of a solid block of aluminum to which Buttera replied "That's easy, just cut away everything that doesn't look like a rear view mirror."
     
  19. DDDenny
    Joined: Feb 6, 2015
    Posts: 21,476

    DDDenny
    Member
    from oregon

    I do believe that's it!
     
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  20. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 32,341

    The37Kid
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    I know it is another era of Hot Rodding but was John Buttera the "inventor" of CNC billet wheels and that whole era of aluminum?
     
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  21. blue 49
    Joined: Dec 24, 2006
    Posts: 2,070

    blue 49
    Member
    from Iowa

    ^^^^ Seems to me he started with a "Strong Arm Milling Machine". (A saw and a set of files)

    Gary
     
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  22. The37Kid
    Joined: Apr 30, 2004
    Posts: 32,341

    The37Kid
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    At one time he had a Bridgeport in his livingroom.
     
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  23. LWEL9226
    Joined: Jul 7, 2012
    Posts: 357

    LWEL9226
    Member
    from So. Oregon

    My dad was a carpenter also and I am sure he has turned over more than a few times.....

    LynnW
     
  24. Happydaze
    Joined: Aug 21, 2009
    Posts: 2,270

    Happydaze
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    At Dan Fink Metalworks there is, or certainly used to be, an aloominum b*llet, circa 24x18x6, that was an aborted wishbone of Li'l John, now just a large paperweight.

    Chris
     
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  25. ekimneirbo
    Joined: Apr 29, 2017
    Posts: 5,123

    ekimneirbo
    Member
    from Brooks Ky

    Sounds like someone I would have liked to know...............:)
     
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  26. Well coming from a guy that jumped into a hot rod project 20 years ago with no idea how to do it, I can say with confidence that it's ok to do things a few times over. I mean I butchered a Model A frame so badly that I drove to Los Angeles and back in a day just to get another one with good numbers. Fortunately the first one went to some much more capable hands at the time and still lives on as well. You'll be fine, the first cut is the hardest.
     
  27. alanp561
    Joined: Oct 1, 2017
    Posts: 5,308

    alanp561
    ALLIANCE MEMBER

    That's two sentences! Bet you were a pipefitter, huh? ;)
     
  28. Adriatic Machine
    Joined: Jan 26, 2008
    Posts: 788

    Adriatic Machine
    Member

    Mock it up, critique it. Remember it is only metal and most mistakes are recoverable
     
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  29. jerry rigged
    Joined: Apr 18, 2019
    Posts: 198

    jerry rigged
    Member

    A hard lesson for me to learn was "don't let Perfect become the enemy of Good". Otherwise nothing ever gets done.
     
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  30. rocsas
    Joined: Dec 17, 2013
    Posts: 229

    rocsas
    Member
    from colorado

    Sometimes you just have to go for it, I was nervous as hell starting this 1951 ford, but the more you go the more comfortable you get with it.

    Seeing the end product is more rewarding then any bolt on part for sure. Yea cutting up an expensive part is hard but just take your time and measure 40 times before a cut and be careful, that will minimize any mistakes.

    Even if you cut something or it doesn't go right, sometimes the best way of learning, is by making mistakes

    FB_IMG_1685684240237.jpg FB_IMG_1685684249567.jpg FB_IMG_1685684233075.jpg FB_IMG_1685684259582.jpg FB_IMG_1685684293257.jpg 20231216_142416.jpg
     
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