Projects Giant speedster project

Frame covers

I set about trimming the frame covers to fit around the rear spring perches. Just a lot of measuring really, then careful cutting with an abrasive disc and a nibbler. The pieces still need some final touches but I put the body back on to get the full effect. It's hard top get a sense of the entire car from my crummy pictures and limited space. I'll have to think about the very back of the chassis. Maybe I should put a roll on that frame cover. Or maybe it should be wood. The tail lights will attach there and also the tag holder and light. Do the covers give the car a more refined, civilized look? Is that good? I've got the trim off the excess sheet metal inside the car. There will be a separate frame cover on the rails up by the hood. That cover has to fit into the frame horn casting in a pleasing way. I'll ponder that too.

Jerry
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How about a wood frame cover at the rear like the front? To me, wood "sills" for the top of the frame really make a brass era car.

Brian

 

Jerry,

This shows wooden hood shelves ( & some pretty neat fenders).

In the 1911 Cadillac it has mahogany hood shelves that start under the curved area of the cowl & they stop even with the front of the rad. They are held in place with step bolts. Your flat area at the back might look good matching the hood shelves.

Jack

 

That skiff must have been the Barris custom of it's day. I love those fenders. Wish I had the skill to make them. I searched for a picture of the 1911 Caddy shelves but couldn't find any. Have you got a picture, Jack? I think the fun starts when you add all the little custom features to a car. How about some mahogany strips on the flat triangular pieces beside the boattail as a sort of step? Or a custom acid etched aluminum step plate with Seagrave Special on it? Or both?

Jerry

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they call those butterfly fenders

 

Jerry,

Here is a 1911 Cadillac Demi-tonneau showing the hood shelf coming from under the cowl. You can see it becomes narrower at one point going forward but it stays consistant to the front edge of the rad. The front end matches the radius on the side edge. ( I am currently working on the same model but I would have to take pictures of all of the individual parts as it is right now.) There is a bead matching the edge of the shelf running down the body as well. This makes a nice transition from the body to the splash guards. You can see that was done on the "skiff". I have a 1911 Buick with such a bead which is actually 1/2 oval aluminum screwed to the body. I was thinking the bead could grow in width again at the back to fill the triangular flat areas. You could still add the etched step plates on top of that - sort of like those on an old Chris-Craft.

The rather dainty fenders on the bulky "skiff" body look suprisingly good.

Jack

 

I see now. I was thinking of something else. Actually my '14 REO has the same wood under the hood and I have two pieces of mahogany planned for that purpose on the Seagrave. You're saying do the same treatment on the rear shelves. Interesting. I couldn't run them all the way down because at some point the body comes right to the edge of the splash pans. I'll have to play with that idea. I spent the day cleaning the shop. It was a mess. Still is actually.

Jerry
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that old caddy from 1911 is one rolling hunk of eye candy shweeet lots of detail and fancy wood work

 

I agree . I have worked a lot with wood , so I can imagine the work it was to have a so perfect finition ....

 

Take it apart--put it together.

When I'm building something (big or small) I usually rough in a system, go off to other parts, then come back and tune in whatever I worked on before. I built the shifter mechanism but I left off the fine tuning, probably because I figured other things were going to interfere with what I did. Does this seem confusing? So today I came back to the shifter--I need it to work if I'm going for a drive. The lockout arm took up most of my time. This little part acts like a gate, locking the shift arms in place until the clutch is depressed. Then it lifts up allowing the shifter to move. Since I messed with the entire relationship of the parts I had to cut and reweld the lockout arm. In the big picture, when I get the whole car working and driving satisfactorily I'm going to dismantle everything and paint it up for final assembly.

Jerry
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So in effect there's an interlock between the clutch and the shifter? Gotta admit that's something I hadn't comsidered! Though it makes a lot of sense since I think you'd mentioned previously that this was a non-synchro, crash-box transmission. Probably helps explains why the tranny was still in serviceable condition after all these yerars.

Had to study your pics a little bit but I think I finally got my brain wrapped around how it all works. Actually a fairly ingenious solution!

 

I don't understand the point of the interlock. I see how it works, but in a non-synchro transmission, don't you want to be able to leave the clutch engaged while you rev the engine a bit to match the gear speeds to downshift?

 

me thinks a leather/ canvas cover with tonneau snaps where metal or wood is a bit of trouble to remove or fussy to make ..add stitching or pockets use some old miltary coats pockets or duffelbags with buckles and straps ..

canvas hood sides ?

laminating multi colored wood helps maintain woods structure and is purdy
laminates can be wood , copper ,aluminum...add square stock ,round stock ,scrolls .. sand and finish
tail lites must go very high up away from the frame .. like an after thought to the primitive racer's use

but fussy is what you do nevermind ....

on the show my classic car they had a car of leno's with a built in copper funnel with a cover for oil fill maybe your fuel fill needs that with a porcelin coffee storage container ..locking lid ?

i just found a chitty chitty bang bang dvd .. now i wish i had a dvd player ...

 

The interlock just keeps the shifter in gear until you step on the clutch since there is no interlock system in the transmission like a modern car. When you down shift you step on the clutch, rev the engine, then slip it into gear. The interlock doesn't affect that. When you upshift there is a brake that slows the first motion (input) shaft so the gears can mesh. It works quite well but has to be adjusted. I'll post a picture of it tonight.

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Paperdog,
Lots of good ideas!
Jerry
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Angular wooden "military" fenders with dovetail joints at the corners and leather sails? Metal studs on the fenders, but half-countersunk? That's more American early-Vintage than Edwardian, though.

Diving bell taillights, definitely. Or convert those old bicycle headlights that had an oval tin-can that took two batteries to work as taillights? Haven't seen one of those in ages.

 

while watching modern marvels they were making a trombone and when they bent the tubing they filled it with soapy water ...capped the end and froze it solid
then bent it around a mandrel the ice maintains the innner dia. but is firm but crushable to be bent soap lubes the movement .. ..thawed out and drained ..
i can see the " old still "coils of tubing for fuel and oil cooling / return lines ..

coiled line also have some vibration damping ..

we did this coiling on exposed wires on choppers in the 60's

and also a old time canning jar GLASS lid with wire bail as a gas cap
VISIBLE.... NO NEED TO STRIKE A MATCH TO SEE FILL LEVEL!

 

just found out a friend does work like this .. here near me in MINN.

 

Not so giant speedster

Tenants interfered with my fun yesterday and today but I did work a little on the Seagrave, welding nuts on the gas tank mount and bolting the shifter mechanism in place. After that I had to begin work my son's Pinewood Derby car. It's off topic but might be a little interesting. I'll bet more than a few of you guys have built these things. There are hundreds of websites devoted to them. I start with the axles, filing and sanding the polishing them on the buffing wheel. Here are a few cars I've built. The spotted one was the fastest, built for my daughter. Even the Girl Scouts have gotten in on the act. The race is Saturday.

Jerry
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Any "podiums" yet?

 

My cars are usually the fastest in the troop, but last year one of the other dad's knocked me off. This year I vowed revenge. My daughter's car beat all in regional girl scout meet. The thing is I build all the cars the same so I'm not sure why one is faster than the other. I think it has to do with wheel alignment. They all have to weigh 5 oz. I put a lead weight split over the rear axle.

Jerry
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having the axles at a slight angle so when on level only two wheels touch car will rock fore and aft.....only edges of wheels touch ... adjust camber and caster and drag is reduced ...

hey hey hey the kids are supposed to build them not just watch ....

 

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Linkage

Yes, more linkage work, tedious really. I bent and aligned linkage. I put in cotter pins. I fiddled with the interlock. I welded a tab for the rear axle rubber brake line. I bolted everything down tight. The interlock will need more fiddling. Looks like the valve gear off a locomotive. Then I finished up the not so giant speedster. Many rules to conform to. No shaping of wheels. No three wheelers. Lots of graphite! Stuff like that. Should I post a video of the big race?

Jerry
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On the not so giant speedster...have you tried adding the weight to the nose? Just a thought, or possibly adding all of the weight behind the rear axle putting a lighter load on the front axle, or centering the weight to make the "bearing drag" on the axles equal. Build several variants and set up your own test track and see what works best.

 

Having as much of the weight as far back as possible is what you want.

 

Most of the variance is in the axle prep and the toe.

 

Not trying to plug this for the guy as I have no interest in the auction. I found this old Seagrave tank while searching for something else. I love the artwork on this tank.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ANTIQUE-FIRE-TR...&ps=63&clkid=7359599806149814898#ht_818wt_905

 

The theory is that as the car descends the hill it gets a little boost as it makes the transition to flat because gravity will still be acting on the weight if it's in the rear of the car. I tried to maximize this theory once and put all the weight behind the axle. The car did a wheel stand sitting still. Also if you put the weight in the front the car hits very hard when it encounters the flat straight-away. My son painted the car and put on the stickers. He's learning about the fifties.

Jerry
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Looks good Jerry- we're (early) in the process of building William's and Daniel's cars too.