I have a GM TH 350 in my 30 Ford Roadster. It is in back of a 283 SBC. Question: Does this transmission require a cooler? There is a tubing loop on the outside of the trans on the RH side that looks like it could be the supply and return connections for a cooler. Transmission has been in the car for about 10 years and 6,000 miles and is working just fine. I recently changed the filter element and oil looked to be in good shape. No burnt smell. Looking to see if a cooler is needed or advised. Much thanks... (o[]o)
Yes, it should have a cooler on it. You may be getting lucky in that the loop combined with a light car and relatively minimal driving has kept it cool all this time.
It is highly recomended that you run a cooler.You can get one of the frame mounted one from summit oe jegs and they will do the job well.
Thank you, all. I thought it should have one, but new to the hot rod community, and not familiar with this unit. I was thinking about mounting a cooler under the car in back of the trans. Will this location give enough air flow to do the job? Is there a specific size I should be looking for? The tubing loop looks to be of 3/8" size. I live in Austin, Tex. and it does get a little warm around here. (o[]o)
Yes, and if you get a new radiator get one with the cooler built in, it'll save some room under the car and ther'es not much room to begin with. If you don't have a built in cooler mount it in the rear of the ch***is where there is more room away from the exhaust. In the first pic you can see the cooler lines heading forward to the radiator, you can also see there isn't much room that isn't close to the exhaust.
I've seen people just loop the hose like you mentioned and always wondered how in the world that worked with no cooling. We have been using those long round finned double p*** coolers and we mount them parallel to the frame member, hidden underneath the car. So far so good. Don
I have used old Ford power steering coolers (one p***) with success and temps never got over 180, not suggested if you tow or have a stall converter though!
I always run a frame mount cooler. Now really, is the radiator coolers a real cooler or just a tube running from an in to an out inside the tanks? My thought is that they will heat the trany fluid to somewhat to the water temperature in the radiator. I would think that was designed for those cold weather starts in N Dakota warming up the trany for winter driving. Am I wrong?
I was always told that the "cooler" in the radiator was more to warm the fluid in the winter than it was to cool the fluid in the summer.
Some early Novas with automatic transmissions did not have transmission coolers. That said ... I always use a frame mounted cooler in addition to the cooler in the bottom of the radiator. I run the fluid from the transmission to the frame mounted cooler, then on to the radiator cooler. I believe the cooler on the frame cools the fluid. Then as it goes to the radiator ... the radiator gets the fluid to the correct operating temperature. Transmission rebuilders say that you can get the fluid too cool to lubricate the transmission. Too cool is as bad as too hot. .
mj40, I believe that you are correct, sir. I was alwas under the impression that the heat exchanger in the radiatior was for temperature control; that is heat when the trans fluid was cold and cool when it was too hot. The main reason for maintaining a relatively constant transmission coolent temperature is to maintain the viscosity of the transmission fluid so that all of the little orifaces (orifi?) in the transmission p*** the correct flow/pressure. Another reason to warm the transmission fluid is to drive off any water that has condensed/collected in the transmission. This can be a problem with vehicles that are driven short distances in cold weather. Naturally if the transmission gets hot the fluid is then used to remove the heat, hopefully before damaging the transmission. General Motors built a few automatic transmissions that were air cooled, I understand that they had fins on the torque converter to dissapate the heat. I'm thinking that they were on some smaller cars, Vega perhaps?
Those were 'glides and had several large holes in the bellhousing to cool the convertor. Cooling the convertor was suppose to cool the fluid enough to keep the ****** from self destructing. GM never put that system behind a V8 and didn't keep that idea for long.
Okay, lots of information here for which I thank you all. The Roadster has an aluminum radiator with fittings on the bottom tank that look like connections for trans cooler lines. But, the fittings are 1/8" NPT size and the fittings on the trans look to be 1/4" NPT. Question: will the smaller fittings on the radiator cause a restriction and/or pressure drop? I would like to use the radiator cooler. Also, it looks as if appropriate type rubber hoses will work. This is a great site with some knowledgeable and helpful folks. Thanks. (o[]o)
The powerglides in the early Nova had a metal shield spot welded to the converter and a case with holes in the bell housing area to promote cooling. I too have run a Ford pwr. steering cooler on a 34 Ford for years,with a trans temp gage with good results, normal temp after freeway driving was around 200. I use the radiator trans cooler if possible. If you are worried run a trans temp gage. I type too slow!
I have a th350 behind my caddy 390 and no cooler. No room anywhere. I just have copper line coming out and looping about 5 times then going back in. Hope I don't burn it up.
Heat is the grim reaper to any auto trans and the later auto transmissions all ran coolers because of it. You need to run a trans cooler, they make them that run along the ch***is and they are not expensive, get one hook it up and be done with it.
My ****** guy said the main thing is to just get the fluid OUT OF the ******. On my old touring I took a 6 foot chunk of 3/8" line and bent it into a long, skinny "U" shape. I think George now has 15K on the car with no issues. Unless you do a two minute burnout for the crowds, that would heat ANY ****** up!
My son has a Nova with a TH350. The cooling lines broke inside the radiator. Water in the trany wrecked the TH350. 10 years later it happened again. I'll never use a trany cooler in the radiator again.
Here is a smart man! Learned the hard way, but learned none the less. I was going to say something earlier but figured someone would jump all over me, especially after reading how the cooler in the radiator regulates the temp. I always run an external cooler and never run it in conjunction with the cooler in the radiator and G.H.Russ' problem is one of the reasons why. Another reason is heat. Heat from the engine/engine's coolant can make the ****** fluid too hot, it's obviously worse if the engine overheats. A blown radiator cooler or an overheated engine can/will cost you a ******. Even my O/T diesel Super Duty pickup that I tow with only has an external cooler. Here's a FUN-FACT: Back in the 60's some drag racers that ran an automatic used an A/C condenser as a ****** cooler.
Probably not, just hack mechanics. Someone lost their job as a printer repairman and decided that it was a sign that they should open a shop. I worked on a Lincoln Convertable last spring that had the looped piece of soft copper for a cooler on the turbo 350. Came from a well known shop in Colorado, but they had just scabbed it together to sell it, or maybe it is the quality of work that they out out. 4,000 pound car now has a transmission cooler. The old looped piece of copper tubing (we are talking short piece here) is an old junkyard trick. used to be you couild buy a car cheap from the local junk yard and then patch up the slip shod stuff and drive it, or not and pick up another cheap car in a few months.
I am sure that if ALL the transmissions wrecked by a broken cooler in the radiator were counted ... that number would be a very small number when compared to the number that NEVER had a problem. I have NEVER had transmission cooler fail in all my 60 plus years. I have seen quite a few transmissions burnt up without a cooler. Both my 32's have a small stall convertor. They add additional heat so I NEED ... a extra cooler IMHO. I also run a extra transmission filter. The extra one quart of fluid also helps ... .
"The Roadster has an aluminum radiator with fittings on the bottom tank that look like connections for trans cooler lines. But, the fittings are 1/8" NPT size and the fittings on the trans look to be 1/4" NPT. Question: will the smaller fittings on the radiator cause a restriction and/or pressure drop? I would like to use the radiator cooler. Also, it looks as if appropriate type rubber hoses will work." The trans cooler in the radiator cooler will work fine, just get some 1/4"npt to 5/16" tube adapters. Use a good thread sealer on the NPT joints and then double flared 5/16" steel line for the cooler lines. If you do not have a tubing bender they can be made from 5/16" copper, easy to bend and obviously will not rust. I normally run an aux cooler in series with the radiator cooler but the radiator cooler alone will work by itself. I would not use rubber hose for the lines and if it is used anywhere in the cooling circuit it has to be the correct high pressure hose and NOT fuel line or it WILL fail.
I actually busted an in radiator cooler when I lived in mexico. But we are talking extreme use bucking and bouncing. I still use them when it is what I have, if I plan ahead I use an external and sometimes both.
Hello All, and thanks for all your help and suggestions. This is a great site. I have decided to use the cooler in the bottom tank of the new aluminum radiator, and to use trans cooler hoses. I'll post photos of the before and after. We'll see how this works... (o[]o)
I did connect the tans to the radiator cooler today. Pleased with the results. Routed the cooling hoses from the trans, over the starter, along side the engine oil pan and then into the cooler. I fabricated some brackets to hold the hoses . All worked out well as the cooling line hoses are well tucked in and hardly noticeable. As soon as I find out how to post some photos will do so. Thanks again. (o[]o)
Here are photos. I liked routing th cooling line hoses against the engine as it kept them from the exhaust and out of sight. What little is visible looks nice. What do you think? (o[]o)
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