ok so i gave up the brakes and had the car taken to a local guy a few people had told me worked on their stuff. I called him today and he told me to coem over and see if it was better. I go over there and it is better, but not much. It seems the pedal is the exact opposite of what it was before, it was soft as a turd and now it's as hard as a rock. It still doesn't stop anywhere near as good as it did before i decided to get the muddy*** brake fluid out fo the system, and now I had to put about everything i have into the pedal to get it to stop in a reasonable distance. I almost could get it to stop in time to make the turn back into his driveway after i took it up the road. The booster seems like it's leaking a litle bit again, which makes me think he doesn't have the mastercylinder on as tight as i did. I found out i need new bearing in the front too, as well as a rear wheel seal since one of my back brakes was full of gear oil when he pulled the drum off yesterday, so I'm going to order those today. What else should i tell him to try? push rod length? Is there any brake parts I should order that might help things? I'm so ready for this **** to be over with...I'm havin gto spend the money I got for "fun" car stuff on stuff that i HAVE to have.....
from what it says, it sounds like it would be the booster, I dont' really understand that though since it was fine before. I'm really hoping it's somethign simple. I've been trying to figure out what booster I can get for it, but I haven't came up with anything from the catalogs at work....the booster it doestn' list one for pontiac and the ones for all the other 59-61 gm cars look different. Anyone know where I could find one or what would work?
This dude you took your car to, what did he do to it? If we know what he did to cause a hard pedal, it will help diagnose the problem a little better. That gear oil in the rear drums ain't gonna help you stop too good anyway! You might need new shoes now, and wipe ot the drum with lacquer thinner. I bet that's PART of your problem right now. The bore sizes of master cylinders have a lot to do with the hardness/softness of the pedal. That MPBrakes site has some info on that.
he didn't really do anything out of the ordinary from what he told me. Just got the rear adjusters unfroze and adjusted them out, re-bled the new mastercylinder and put it back on, bled the brakes, and that's pretty much it. The only things in the system I'm unsure about are the booster, and the pushrod length. I've known I could use a new booster for awhile cos this one always had a little "hiss" coming out of it, but ti always worked fine so i just let it be. You see what happens when I try to improve something. I've determined me and brakes dont' mix....
also, does anyone make a dual chamber replacement for these things? I figured i might as well look into that too while I'm doing all this....
4, that's the problem. All the places I've seen that sell the conversions are all 2 bolts. and all the booster I find that have the 4 bolts don't look the same on the back side as far as the vacuum lines and things go. You couldn't really tell in from the catalog pictures if the mounting/pedal bracket was the same or not. I figure if i could find something that at least bolted up right I could work something out with the vacuum lines.
If you need a new booster anyway, why don't you get a booster that uses a two bolt master cylinder? Then you could put a dual chamber master cylinder on it. The most you would have to do is drill a few holes in the firewall. Every car I've ever worked on, from street rods to newer imports, uses a clevis that fits around the pedal and either a pin or a bolt that goes through the clevis and a hole in the pedal to hold it on. Should be really easy to adapt a new booster/master cylindar set up. All you should need to do is run one vacuum line to the booster.
well if i do that, how do I decide what booster/master to use? just pick something out of a similar sized car? The main thing would be installing it. I just got all the dash stuff and wiring stuff straightened out recently and I'd HATE to have to undo all that again, or **** it up. I don't have the car here to look at, would a later 60's setup bolt in? Or is that wishful thinking?
ok, i gotta go to work, I'll see if i can find anything out there. If not maybe someone wil have some info for me here about swapping things out when i get back.....
measure the bolt pattern on the back of the booster and post it here, I'm sure some guys could take measurements off of what they have and find something that may even bolt right in. I'll check the booster in my dad's '63 bonneville. That may bolt in. I say this because MP brakes' disc kit is for '59-'64 full size pontiacs and it includes the booster and master cylinder. I know that the '63 uses a two bolt master cylinder. We're about to swap for a dual because we're putting discs on it soon, using the scarebird brackets.
a hard pedal on power brakes means the vacuum is not there right? maybe he hooked your vacuum line up to some stud on the manifold or something goofy like that? or the line is pinched?
I had the same problem on my 59 buick, turns out I got a remanufactured master cylinder turns out the piston in the master cylinder is thicker than the original style pistons, it kept the piston from clearing the return pressure port hole in the cylinder causing it to build up pressure each time i drove it. the brake lights would eventually stay on continuously until I removed the master cylinder and shaved the end of the piston so it would return the proper distance to allow the fluid to return like it should.
i didn't find out **** at work. I'm gonna try to get out to where my car is tomorrow to measure the mounting bolts of the booster and see if any of the 7 boosters we have in the store is the same. I dunno what I'll do if none of those will work since the catalog doesn't give you any dimensions like that...if i find one that fits, finding the matching master cylinder for the booster will be a whole new adventure, we have no way of looking up what cars a particular part goes on.....
i went through all this with my catalina a few months back. i searched and searched and finally ended up putting a booster/dual res. set up from a 78 corvette in the pontiac. didn't take much more then 2 new holes in the fire wall, adapt the rod to the brake lever, and run some new brake line with residul valves. all in all, a good saturdays work. (once you track down the parts ) note: this was not the BEST solution, but it works very well. i just ran out of time trying to track down parts) this m/c was intended for a disk/drum appliacation which i don't have. (will in the future however) been driving it for months and it stops great.
so what, did two fo the original holes line up? what did you have to do to adapt the push rod? There HAS to be something that will just bolt right up, I really don't want to have to start ****ing with the firewall, but I can't just let the car keep sitting. Have pictures of what you had to do? I was hoping I'd be able to find out if the 67 pontiac stuff would work, since that was the first year they had a dual chamber master on em'.
go back and do a search. i originally asked a bunch of questions, did the work, then posted pics. yup, 2 holes lined up. drilled the other 2. just ran some all thread from the rod to the brake lever. i know that there are other options out there, and i KNOW something will be a direct bolt in. i just didn't have the time, nor did i want to special order somethiing and have it not work. i needed to be able to look at the set up before i bought.
remember the post ***le? I'm wondering if all the 60 model GM boosters bolted up the same, if they did, then someone here should have something for me to work with....What the hell is all thread?
sorry man, i have no idea what the thread ***le was. my memory is ****. so about that gas tank. wait, we're talking about brakes...... all thread. it's just a long piece of threaded rod. like a long bolt with no head on it. that's what i've always called it anyways. i'll see if i can dig up that post as well.
i found one post, but there wasn't anything in it to read really.....duno if that's the one you meant or not. I woudl ike to see a pic of how you have the rod setup if you have one or can get one. I can't picture it in my head....
i'll see if i can get one on thursday. the car is at a buddies garage while i put the bags in. gonna go pick it up on thursday.
ok, found the post with the pics. none of the rod though. its ***le is -- corvette booster, m/c in my 60 catalina
so you couldnt' find anythign taht would bolt up to the bracket coming off the firwall huh....that's what i was shooting for, so i wouldn't have to get into that jungle behind the dash too much. Theres not much room back there to work at all....this is gonna be a loooong week....
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