Alright guys I have a 1963 thunderbird with a 390 fe that has a harmonic balancer that has a built in v pulley. I had a problem with cheap belts always sheeting and splitting. I bumped up to a gates belt and never had a problem until I went out to start the car and it wouldn't crank. Looked under the hood and the belt was loose. Climed under the car and rubber in the balancer was no longer attached to the ring gear pulley. I just replaced the pulley and after running it wanted to check the tension once the new belt had run for 5 mins. The belt was a little warn then went to make sure the balancer rubber was nice n good on the crank and the pulley was hotter then hell. So here's my question what the hell is going on that is causing the pulley to get so hot you can't even touch it. The belts are not slipping. The pulleys all line up exactly how they should. I'm just kinda lost any advice would help
are you sure all the accessories are in good free spinning shape? maybe one is starting to get locked up and the good grip of the new belts is causing some friction
The only problem I've ever had was with the alternator belt which driving off the v belt balancer. It is a brand new alternator that spins free with the belt off. Water pump is also brand new. Everything got replace when I machined out and rebuilt the motor.
If the balancer ring really is hotter than the pulley, it sounds more like friction from the front seal or heat coming off the crank. How hot is the oil pan? If something inside is getting that hot, the oil should pick it up and heat the pan...
Is the belt the correct thickness for the pulley it is riding in? Other than that belt riding to low in the groove and slipping/slowing getting eaten up creating heat, I can not think of anything that would generate enough heat to make the balancer that hot.
The outer ring is moving on the replaced balancer. Using a timing light, watch the timing mark and you will see the ring moving. I had the same problem years ago on a 1961 390 Starliner. It took about 1 1/2 minutes to move 360 degrees running the engine at a fast idle. It was amazing to watch.
Check closely the profile/width of the V-belt. If the belt is the wrong 'size' (profile) it will make heat Bunny-Quick! (offshore mfg has changed belt specs slightly, so metric belts can be used on SAE applications, and vice-versa; had trouble like this in the '90s)
so I guess the motor runs smooth? could it be viberations from the motor working the rubber? if it gets that hot so soon, let it cool and remove the belt, run it for as long as you can without the water pump turning and see if the pulley got hot. I only say this becouse you said the belt is not slipping and is in line.
On the extra heat...I am pretty sure a rubber ring type damper generates plenty and that one that has started to rotate its layers will generate more. The outer ring is bonded (or was, it your case!) to rubber which is bonded to the inner metal. The outer ring is meant to jerk back and forth to absorb forces generated within the crank, damping them via the resistance of the rubber. This should generate heat within the rubber, now supplemented by extra motion and direct friction between layers as everything comes apart. It will soon generate some heat in your hood, radiator, or fenders as it shakes completely apart and the outer ring launches...
The oil pan is luke warm to the touch after running it 3 mins ago so it's not that. i also grabbed the seal spacer on the crank and that is cold to the touch. The balancer marks are exactly where they were before it lights up exactly where it needs to be no slipping no jumping. I'm going to try a smaller width belt to see if that helps. I just read on a tbird forum that my width was to wide but according to the guy at napa it is correct. Can any one tell me for sure what the width of the belt should be on the alternator without air
The balancer just absorbs vibrations. Resonance that can break cranks. I truly think the belt width is the issue. Sorry I do not know what belt is the correct size. It is possible that NAPA's book is incorrect as well. It happens. Might be a trial and error moment for now. EDIT: see if NAPA has a pulley groove gauge.
Ok just took the belt off the alt and crank and ran it for 7 mins grabbed the pulley and its ice cold it has to be the friction from the belt not fully sitting into the v groove. I'm going to try a narrow belt n see what that does
I see two different size pulleys on the dampener. If you're running two belts to a two groove pulley with the same diameter, the belts will fight eachother causing a lot of heat and friction
The two diameters should not make a difference. These diameters are sized to assure a certain rotation per minute. Let say the ALT needs to spin 50 times per minute to operate. The A/C needs to spin 100 times per minute. Each pulley diameter is designed to achieve that yet work independently of each other off the same crank pulley assembly.
The smaller pulley on the crank is the steering pump the one in the back is for the alternator the one in the middle is the ac but I currently have the compression off. If you look at the water pump pulley the one on the alternator is smaller and the one for the steering is bigger. Ford placed them in a stagered pattern but if you take the 2 circumference top and bottom of both add them up they equil the same side to side
I think 54Buick48D hit it pretty close. I'd bet that the belt is the wrong section width for the application. The Napa specs for their "good' belt are here. http://www.napaonline.com/Catalog/CatalogItemDetail.aspx?R=NBH257400_0117330817 36 degree belt that is .41 wide at the top. That appears to match the Gates XL 7400 that you most likely used. http://www.oreillyauto.com/site/c/d...=Search_C0074_5149522_4398&pt=C0074&ppt=C0007
That plus the crank drives all the rest of the accessories on the engine so the belts are driven at whatever rate the pulley diameter and engine R.P.M.s dictate and the other accessories simply take what's given to them.
I just put on a gates 7400 ran it to the gas station n back n smelled rubber burning sure as shit tossed this balancer too. I went took off the belt had my buddy fire it up I watched the crank pulley and its as true as true gets to the eye had hom shut it down. then took a dial indicator n it never moved until I got to the timing mark bump the crank for sure isn't bent
The last part of the picture is the accessory it is running. The ALT? Possible the bearings in the accessory, under load of the belt being tighten, is not as free wheeling as it should be?
Yea the pulley that just broke again was driving the alternator. I am going to pull that off now n have the alternator tested. Like I said before tho it is brand new with maybe 400 miles on it.
I'm not so sure that you want a narrower belt. Too narrow and it will start out bottomed out in the groove. The proper width belt should ride in the pulley as shown in the left side of the illustration above.
Are these belts also running over water pump pulley? If the bottom pulley has different diameter , they can't share another pulley. Something would have to slip. IMHO
It is possible that it was over tighten when installed thus beginning the bearing damage. I have been subject to that by my own hands. Can last a thousand miles. Can grind away 5 miles down the street after installing. Honestly can't think of anything else creating your issue.
I do not believe it would make a difference. The pulley diameter would allow that accessory to operate at the speed necessary and the second accessory to run at that speed necessary. Kind of like a tensioner in the belt routing. These are often small diameter pulleys. The belt shares different sized pulleys. Serpentine belt set up has numerous sized pulleys.
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