HEI, "ready to run" or Points? What are the Pros and COns?

On my last bracket car [sbc] I used an old cast iron distributor and converted it to use the reluctor from an HEI. Unfortunately hooking up the vac adv would be tough for a street car. I ran two hei modules on a plate bolted to the p*** footwell [ along with the ign coil and ford type starter solenoid ]. In a no spark situation I could have swapped the 4 wires on the modules in about 10 seconds and been good to go or at least know it wasn't the module

I used the MSD 'Cap-a-dapt' conversion that used the large dia ford top.

 

Email "Mart" on here about the box he makes. Takes the current load off your stock points, but lets you keep an original dizzy, and reasonable $ to boot.
See it here:
http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=152481

 

I saw some interesting distributors on the 'net called D.U.I..

http://www.performancedistributors.com/

They make performance curved dizzys for just about everything, including custom made Duraspark and HEI units for SBF. It looks like they make flathead units, too. When you place the order, you fill out a bunch of information about your application and they custom curve the distributor for your setup. If you ever make any major changes to your car, you can send it in and they will re-curve it. I found some reviews online and they are all very positive.

Pricey, but looks like an interesting option to all the stuff that has become name-only and are just as ****py as the cheap junk.

 

HOW TO EXTEND THE LIFE OF AN HEI

If you are worried about getting stuck somewhere with an HEI that quit working during a trip away from home, here is an easy and cheap solution to extend it's life and make it easy to revive in mere moments without anyone seeing you work on the car.

Every few years the HEI in my Studebaker truck, with Studebaker 259 engine (years ago I used to build HEIs for just about any engine until the big guys took over), would leave me stuck in a store parking lot working under the hood to put in a new module so I could get home. only happened every 3-5 years, but still annoying.

I moved the module away from the heat inside the distributor, to under the dash inside the cooler p***enger compartment so when it happened again I could simply plug in a new spare module I kept in the glove box ($15) and no one would ever see me working under the hood in a Wal Mart parking lot.

If it fails, just sit inside the car- unplug, and then plug-in. P***ers-by will have no idea that you were actually working on your car.

The nicest part of it is that since the module is in a cool location, I HAVENT HAD IT FAIL EVEN ONCE IN OVER TEN YEARS NOW.

KEEP IT COOL AND IT MIGHT LAST FOREVER...

 

Good advice,Dare! Keep da module Kool!
One other bug-a-boo on GM's HEI is the pickup coil surrounding the trigger wheel (reluctor). The two wires from the p.u.coil do a lot of flexing due to the normal activity of the vacuum advance unit. These wires will eventually open-circuit inside the insulation and leave you standed, it happens. Take the distributor apart to replace it. Re-time the engine. Blechk.
I'm runnin two Pertronics conversions in stock small Chevy distributors: one in a piston clattering 305, the other in a well built 350. I'm happy with 'em.
I'm runnin a MSD-6 in my 'T' roadster, 324 Olds power, Motorcraft (Ford) magnetic pickup in a modified Olds distributor, 11:1 JE's, cammed, running 4 summers on 92 octane - no signs of detonation on the plugs or pistons! MSD also tames the idle somewhat. I'm happy with it. BTW the "box" is way out of sight - the 'T' is ole skool - no one knows unless I tell 'em.
Mallory! I kinda like their stuff BUT they're like Kodak - their products become obsolete in a few years, and replacement of some of their critical parts then becomes a h***le. Not so MSD - their boxes have been around for a long time.
Early Ford modules (from the 70's) had the wierd habit of shutting down unannounced. Sometimes a pot of cold water poured over the module would revive it!

 

If you've got a 302 in your truck, then aesthetics probably aren't at the top of your list anyway. Run the HEI, keep the hood shut when you park, and have fun driving the bejesus out of it with no worries of your ignition ****ping out

 

Really how many of us are living in 2008? to me thats some spaceage futureworld, and i aint updating 'till i get a Nuclear Powered flyingcar they promised, i'm still driving a 1955 designed engine daily

 

Took the points out of a 69 stango put in a Dura Spark 2. It looks good & performs great

 

Several points (no pun intended) I'd like to make :

1. I've got a Pertronics in a 350 SBC I have in my boat. Bought it because the special marine Mallory parts are hard to find and expensive, and it's a b*tch to crawl into the engine compartment to work on the distributor. I had to re-time it after installation because the increased dwell caused the timing to be to advanced, but after that, it's run the last 8-10 years, no problem.

2. The DUI in the post above for the 8BA would be totally unacceptable to me no matter how well it worked because of the way it looks.

3. I have a about a dozen vehicles with points ignition which I have had from 5 to 22 years. I drive all of them time to time, and have never had a problem with the points or condensors. These range from a '48 Seagrave with 2 dual coil, dual point distributors to a '68 Corvette I drive a lot. I have changed the points in some of these over the years, but only when they started to run bad or when other work had to be done. Now that I think of it, my 1951 Ford with a stock 8BA has the same points it had in it when I got it 22 years and 17,000 miles ago. I guess I just figured out what one of my first tasks this spring will be.

4. The only vehicle that has left me stranded on the side of the road was a '79 Ranchero that had the silver "brain-box" give up; not once, but twice.

5. I couldn't get the miss out of my vintage dirt track car with a built 12.5 to one '54 hemi until we put a magneto on it. We tried just about everything before this. (Interrestingly, I also talked to the guy who build the car originally in '65 with a 324 olds with lots of cam and compression, and he told me the same thing; they couldn't get it to run right until they put a magneto on it.)

Bottom line looks like points are fine except in some extreme cir***stances where something better is required. For the experience with the Ranchero, it looks like early electronic setups should be avoided.

 

What he said. I'm driving 1955 designed engine daily. Feels good. Josh.

 

I upgraded my '64 y-block 292 to a Pertronix Ignitor I with a Flamethrower coil yesterday for about $100 and I have to say, after installing the module and coil, removing the ballast resistor wire (to achieve a full 12v), and opening up the spark gap to about .045, this engine responds a ton better, revs much smoother, and starts much quicker.

I would say that upgrading to a Pertronix Ignitor setup is probably the best bang for the buck available to help really smooth out these old motors!

I was somewhat skeptical when I opened up the little box to find a tiny black cube with two wires sticking out of it. However, the instructions were very clear and concise (for both the ignitor and the coil), and I was easily able to install both components with relatively little confusion. The only conflict which I ran across in the instructions (and had read about online previously) was about whether or not to eliminate the ballast resistor or resistance wire, whichever your vehicle has. The Ignitor kit says to NOT remove the resistor, while the coil instructions said that it was fine to remove it. From what I had read online, it seemed that the most success was found when one eliminated the resistor. I went ahead and ran a new wire from my ignition switch to the coil & ignitor, ultimately realizing the full 12v potential.

After I finished wiring everything up, and reinstalling the newly gapped plugs, I turned the key to fire her up, and it started right up effortlessly. I had not re-timed the engine yet either; I plan to do that and check the plugs again today...

Although I have only run the Pertronix I and Flamethrower coil combo for one night so far, I have to say that I was relatively impressed with what it did to the engine in terms of quicker response and smoother idle. Electronic ignition is also said to be a big boost to your fuel efficiency!

 

The HEI in my altered quit on me the last time I took the car to the track.
Had a mallory dual point in the truck, put it in and finished the day.
Now that I'm converting the old altered to a street car I'm thinking about using an old piont style dizzy converted to electronic so I can get a little more firewall room. Thanks, Mike

 

The GM HEI has been around for over 30 years now. I'd spend my money on them cause any small town parts store will have the parts to repair one. IMHO. It is ugly but it works good. Just be sure you run at least a 12ga wire to it so you get all the bang from it. It has a black cap also.

 

Personally, I run the full M.S.D. set up

Pro Billet dizzy, Blaster 2 coil, and 6al Box.

I have a trick for the "don't look right" gang...this takes a few minutes, but Youu can do eeet!

step one. peel "blaster 2 sticker off of coil. now it's just another black coil. cool.

step 2. remove cap from high dollar distributor. pain black as well.
cool.

step 3 (for the **** retentive) remove roll pin from cam drive on high dollar distributor. remove shaft. remove pick up and plate. tape off shaft hole(s)

sandblast high dollar distributor body. possibly paint with "cast blast"

re-***emble.

stock looking distributor-Check.
cool.

step 4. (for the no room guys.)
***uming the under dash area of Your car or truck is cluttered to hell and back, try this.
go to junkyard.
procure portion of metal heater box.
place 6al inside portion of heater box.
bolt under the car.
beat to fit, paint to match.
take care to seal box well, and install at least 1 good drain hole.

step 5. Have buddy "pull off a plug wire" while engine is running on a dare.

Laugh when the spark jumps from his "zipper region" to whatever is in a 3 to 5 inch radius.

step 6. rush buddy to hospital for electrical burns "down there."

step 7. once recovered from lawsuit, amaze Your friends with Your high powered ignition system that looks stock.

 

came across this in the parts for sale after reading this thread.

302 ford pertronix, NIB don't know what the costs is new, but it's a fellow Hamber.

http://www.jalopyjournal.com/forum/showthread.php?t=311052

 

I've bought "non-starting" engines for peanuts, and got them going simply by popping the distributor cap, pulling the rotor, and freeing up the stuck contact points. It doesn't necessarily take a real long time for contact points to get stuck together. Even on my old Honda 350 motorcycle, just sitting thru the winter often results in stuck-together contact points.

So, do I convert all my distributors to HEI or equivalent? Heck no! Depite their need for periodic maintenance, points are reliable, and there can be a Zen-like satisfaction in setting and tuning them.

Slightly O/T: Can anybody tell me the year that Ford/Mercury switched from points to electronic ignition?

 

Neither will make it run smoother. Points work very well unless you want to wind the rpms up above what would be considered normal IH left lane speeds, above which they cut out. Hei cost more. Points easier to troubleshoot(for this old fart).

I use points distributor on my daily driver hot rod, would install HEI only if I were to add a performance cam and upgrades to drag race it.
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